Electricity prices.

[WotEver]

And that is generally the way in which some marinas get around the law. They just overcharge you for the facilities and there doesn't seem to be a lot you can do about it.

Yes, but the point is that they can't do this by inflating the unit price. If they pay 12p/unit they can't charge you 25p/unit to 'include service charge'. They must charge you 12p and show (or indeed hide) the service charge elsewhere.

[Bunny]

We are on an on line mooring on a 'farm' only room for half a dozen boats and 5 of them are winter moorers , Inc us . I did tentatively request a copy of their electricity contract , for our accountant, as we can claim a small proportion of bills as office expense as we are self employed . They said that they would give us a receipt for the mooring and the electricity monies., I know it's not what we asked for but I think it's the only thing we are going to get. We popped back last week and put the 2 little heaters on timers to cut the bills down and still keep the frost out . We didn't use any heat last year just ' winterised her ' and the interior took quite a bit of work to get clean and warm again, that's why we wanted to leave some heat on . The heaters are the same ones we usually use when we hook up and live aboard. 2 x 650w tiny little oil ones so we know what we usually pay . Bunny

[Horace42]

We are on an on line mooring on a 'farm' only room for half a dozen boats and 5 of them are winter moorers , Inc us . I did tentatively request a copy of their electricity contract , for our accountant, as we can claim a small proportion of bills as office expense as we are self employed . They said that they would give us a receipt for the mooring and the electricity monies., I know it's not what we asked for but I think it's the only thing we are going to get. We popped back last week and put the 2 little heaters on timers to cut the bills down and still keep the frost out . We didn't use any heat last year just ' winterised her ' and the interior took quite a bit of work to get clean and warm again, that's why we wanted to leave some heat on . The heaters are the same ones we usually use when we hook up and live aboard. 2 x 650w tiny little oil ones so we know what we usually pay . Bunny

 

Apart from the rate you are charged, you could reduce your total consumption by using a compressor type dehumidifier. This removes water vapour from the air, that condenses in the cold weather that makes everything damp and causes mould and mildew to form.

I use a compressor type dehumidifier that also reheats the air a little after drying it. It doesn't warm the boat as such, but takes the icy chill off - and enough to keep it dry.

No need to run it 24 hours a day. I use mine on a timer to come on during the worst cold hours of the night, it has an automatic humistat . It has an internal bowl to collect condensate - but to avoid having to keep emptying it - mine stands on the draining board and the condensate pipe goes into a bowl in the sink, that also shows it is working (gallons in the course of winterisation and the bowl often overflows into the sink/canal) (and being distilled, the condensate is good for topping up batteries).

My boat is kept dry all through the winter - and uses only about 300watts - much less than an electrical heater.

[Bunny]

I suppose because we have used these small heaters when we lived aboard for the winter I didn't see a problem . If the rate had been what we are used in wouldn't have even queried it . Just came across last year's mooring fees plus electric bill ..... we were there living on board for 2 months (Inc heaters ) and the just topping the battery up total £ 146 . Learnt my lesson for next year ASK WHAT THEY CHARGE. before I book . . Bunny

[blackrose]

Yes, but the point is that they can't do this by inflating the unit price. If they pay 12p/unit they can't charge you 25p/unit to 'include service charge'. They must charge you 12p and show (or indeed hide) the service charge elsewhere.

Ok, but how does that help the user if the marina chooses to whack 60p/day or more on top of the unit price as some marinas do? The point for many consumers is what they pay in total, never mind how it's billed.

Edited December 6, 2016 by blackrose

[Horace42]

I suppose because we have used these small heaters when we lived aboard for the winter I didn't see a problem . If the rate had been what we are used in wouldn't have even queried it . Just came across last year's mooring fees plus electric bill ..... we were there living on board for 2 months (Inc heaters ) and the just topping the battery up total £ 146 . Learnt my lesson for next year ASK WHAT THEY CHARGE. before I book . . Bunny

 

I misread your comments , I did not realise you were using the heaters for personal warmth and comfort. I thought you were concerned about keeping the boat dry and warn when you were not on it. A compressor type humidifier is quiet generally but it might be more noticeable at night and early hours of the morning, when it is best to run it - but great if you are not on board.

 

Asking what they charge is fine - but you have to ask the right questions - which this forum might have helped with..

[WotEver]

Ok, but how does that help the user if the marina chooses to whack 60p/day or more on top of the unit price as some marinas do? The point for many consumers is what they pay in total, never mind how it's billed.

It helps because you know the price of the variable cost as well as the fixed cost. If you know there's a 60p/day service charge then your fixed costs are £4:20 per week. Now you can budget for your usage at 12p/unit or whatever in addition to that.

[blackrose]

It helps because you know the price of the variable cost as well as the fixed cost. If you know there's a 60p/day service charge then your fixed costs are £4:20 per week. Now you can budget for your usage at 12p/unit or whatever in addition to that.

Budget for your usage? Who does that? I'm sure most people just use what they need and pay for what they use. Then of course there are those unfortunate people who have to budget their actual use of electricity (i.e. go without).

 

Possibly we are both missing each other's points here, because you have definitely missed my point that some marinas are effectively circumventing the law by charging whatever they want for the facilities.

[WotEver]

Yes, it does appear that some marinas/farmers/whatever are breaking the law by loading the unit price. That was why I was making the point that it is an illegal practise. I do appreciate however that it's not necessarily possible to do anything about it - if you demand to see their utility bill then they might demand that you leave.

 

That's why it's a good thing when we have threads like this that appear to show that the average rate is about 12p/unit so that those who are paying a lot more can be aware that they're being ripped off. Again, they may not be able to do anything about that in the short term but at least they now have the knowledge and can consider moving elsewhere.

[Bunny]

That's why I started the thread , to see what the average was . I won't push any further to see their contact as , the lady doesn't have a very pleasant disposition and I wouldn't put it past her to turn us off incase we messed with her other more regular moorers, not that we have even seen them , but we won't be returning next winter .bunny

[WotEver]

That's why I started the thread , to see what the average was . I won't push any further to see their contact as , the lady doesn't have a very pleasant disposition and I wouldn't put it past her to turn us off incase we messed with her other more regular moorers, not that we have even seen them , but we won't be returning next winter .bunny

Perhaps someone at some stage ought to contact Ofgen and inform them.

 

Edited to change the regulatory body to the one that's actually relevant!

Edited December 7, 2016 by WotEver

[BruceinSanity]

Perhaps someone at some stage ought to contact Ofcom and inform them.

Contacting Ofgem might be more to the point...

[WotEver]

Contacting Ofgem might be more to the point...

Yep, I think they might be much more use

 

I think I'll go edit my post now...

[mross]

I pay 16.8525p with nPower at home. Can you get together with the other moorers and approach the owner as a group?

when you are ready to leave, you should take them to the Small Claims Court to recover the overpayment!

[WotEver]

when you are ready to leave, you should take them to the Small Claims Court to recover the overpayment!

That's certainly something that I would consider if I were in the same situation.

[mross]

Citizens Advice Bureau could tell you if that's feasible. You could also get a free, thirty-minute consultation with a solicitor. A legal letter to the 'lady' might be enough.

The tariff I quoted for my house is high because I have solar panels on my house and have to use a 'green' tariff. Otherwise I would be shopping around.

[Bunny]

Don't know the other moorers but know they are regular winter moorers there. I've just put the fires on timers and cut the time down by 50% .Hoping to get 50% of the cost of the last bill down . As I said we will make other arrangements for next winter . Bunny .

[Horace42]

I pay 16.8525p with nPower at home. Can you get together with the other moorers and approach the owner as a group?

when you are ready to leave, you should take them to the Small Claims Court to recover the overpayment!

I went to the Small Claims Court once - well nearly - it was settled on the doorstep just before the hearing.

But the amount of detail that was required was amazing.

 

If you went to court you would have to produce precise figures to support your claim and a precise amount you are seeking.

This sort of information needs the cooperation of the marina to give it to you. - and if they don't - it gets tricky.

In all probability if you had the information to start with, the marina might agree on a settlement without the court hassle.

You must get your facts right.

[WotEver]

I would have thought that Ofgen would be a better starting point. They will thrash out the details and they're really easy (if slow) to deal with. If they determine that you have been ripped off then they will tell the supplier to refund you.

 

At least that's how it worked for me with the financial ombudsman a few years back when I had been royally ripped off by a bank.

[Wrinkley]

Found this on the meter macs site (this is who Crt use)

 

Metered Power at SYC

MeterMacs Electrical Metered Distribution System.

8. The initial unit charge will be set at 25.36 pence per unit which is made up of: 13.04 pence per unit for the actual electricity (this is exactly what we are currently paying as a Club to N-Power and includes VAT at the prevailing rate) and a service charge of 12.32 pence per unit including VAT. This figure has been calculated to cover all annual service charges to SYC relating to the use of the system and for the recovery of the capital costs to SYC for the installation where, dependent on units used, has been estimated to repay the capital costs over the next seven years. The usage and cost recovery will be monitored closely and we will adjust the unit price as these estimates become more accurate over time. We will not change the unit price without advising you (changes will usually take place at the commencement of a new membership year and will be communicated through the same media as we communicate all changes to Club tariffs annually).

[pearley]

This is what the letter from CRT last week says:

 

The current rate per Kwh is 0.10683 pence and the standing charge is 0.00417. The electricity charge incorporates VAT at 5% and the standing charge incorporates VAT at 20%. This gives a combined fee of 11.1 pence per kwh