Swaping Lister SR2 to a BMC 1800

[RLWP]

The hurth box I have is the 100 with 2:1 reduction and is the same in either direction. Had no problems with it so far.

 

Actually, it isn't. It's 2.045:1 in the A position and 1.864:1 in the B. It has to be different to fit the extra gear in to give reverse rotation

 

http://www.bukh-bremen.de/files/346/upload/Hersteller/ZF/Reparaturanleitung%20u%20Ersatzteilliste%20ZF3M%20bis%20ZF30M%20mechanisch.pdf Page 10

 

Richard

[PhilR]

Genuine question. What is a weedless prop?

 

The blades are angled backwards so that weed and rubbish tend to slip off the leading edge of the prop That is the theory, and it does work to some degree in forward. But thrust in reverse gear is usually poor. They were more useful many years ago when a lot of canals were chocked with heavy weed growth.

[gazza]

 

Actually, it isn't. It's 2.045:1 in the A position and 1.864:1 in the B. It has to be different to fit the extra gear in to give reverse rotation

 

http://www.bukh-bremen.de/files/346/upload/Hersteller/ZF/Reparaturanleitung%20u%20Ersatzteilliste%20ZF3M%20bis%20ZF30M%20mechanisch.pdf Page 10

 

Richard

Thanks Richard.

[chris63]

Hi Chris, I did exactly the same conversion two years ago to my boat and don't regret it for a second, I loved the character of the lister but not the hot smell and smoke when it got too hot, I picked up a 1.8 Bmc from eBay fitted with a hurth gearbox (which will happily run in either direction) and had a skin tank fitted , lots more power no smell and hot water in abundance!, the engine mounts width wise are the same and the prop was just a little overproped but not too be worried about , I have however fitted a square bladed prop now which works great and is right for the engine.

I wouldn't personally go for the 1.5, if your going to do it try for the 1.8, much stronger in my opinion.

Best of luck.

Hi again, one on there now item number 331279542263 for £500 with a prm box.

Yes that's what I was looking at, and thanks for the positive response.

[chris63]

I took the top end off when I bought the boat as it was running really rough, number one cylinder had been seized at some point as the rings had snapped, piston melted and bore badly scoared, luckily I had a spare set from my old SR2 that I took out of my last boat. and cleaned + degreased all the fins, and yes they was all clogged with gunge.

 

As for oil pressure when I undo the banjo that goes to the oil pressure gauge there is just the tiniest of oil that just seeps out of the pipe,

 

With all the problems that I am faced and what damage the Lister that has possibly been done, also am sure it is underpowered on tidal waters I do think I need another engine, as for fitting a SR3 I only have about 3 inch from the front of my engine to the bulkhead.

 

I went to the boat today and it does turn the opposite way to a BMC. I phoned the guy up about one on ebay,that is a PRM delta 120 hydraulic gearbox that he says can run both ways, can anyone confirm this?

[gazza]

The 120 is a mechanical box.

 

http://www.prm-newage.com/p11-prm120

 

An sr3 would be a tight squeeze with 3" of clearance :-)

 

You may well have to factor a new prop into the equation anyway. Cost of slipping, cost of prop, may as well black at the same time, its easy for costs to start spiralling.

Edited August 11, 2014 by gazza

[bizzard]

An ST2 would be virtually a straight swop for a SR2 and there's not much difference power wise between the ST2 and SR3 but the ST2 is a bit noisier than both the SR's.

[gazza]

The Lister's a piece of cake to work on, maybe a rebuild is in order, new shells and a look at the pump wouldn't be too outrageous,

 

As for tidal stuff, the secret is to try and plan your journey to go with the tide, not against it. That's for NaugtyCal with her awesome 170+ bhp Kad32 Volvo :-)

[gazza]

As per bizzards suggestion

 

EBay item number 161392242424

Edited August 11, 2014 by gazza

[chris63]

The 120 is a mechanical box.

 

http://www.prm-newage.com/p11-prm120

 

An sr3 would be a tight squeeze with 3" of clearance :-)

 

You may well have to factor a new prop into the equation anyway. Cost of slipping, cost of prop, may as well black at the same time, its easy for costs to start spiralling.

Thanks for that the gearbox is a PRM 120 Hydraulic and if I have read it right [ the nearest one is a 150] and it says it goes either way can anyone confirm please.

[gazza]

I'm getting confused now!

 

The 120 is mechanical and uses cone clutches.

 

The 150 is hydraulic.

[RLWP]

Thanks for that the gearbox is a PRM 120 Hydraulic and if I have read it right [ the nearest one is a 150] and it says it goes either way can anyone confirm please.

It's a PRM Delta, the predecessor of the 150. It's a hydraulic box and you cannot swap the pump like on a 260

 

Richard

[chris63]

I'm getting confused now!

 

The 120 is mechanical and uses cone clutches.

 

The 150 is hydraulic.

Sorry wrong ebay number thought you meant this one 331279542263

[gazza]

Sorry wrong ebay number thought you meant this one 331279542263

Ah, that clears it up. As Richard says above.

 

Have a good think about where you want to go with this.

 

I have a lot of love for the BMC, we have a cracking 1.5 in our boat.

 

The effort and cost of re-powering has to be taken into account before you ditch the Lister

 

 

You would get hot water and may save your hearing from permanent damage if you go the BMC route :-)

Edited August 11, 2014 by gazza

[luctor et emergo]

My ST3 never failed me, once. Despite my neglect

[gazza]

My ST3 never failed me, once. Despite my neglect

A common affliction for Listers the world over!

[chris63]

I have only scratched the surface with this boat lol, it's in the water at the moment but the swim is rotten and needs welding [that's how I came across this site] but there is nowhere to get the boat out on the Chesterfield canal anymore, therefore it has to go onto the trent for welding, the plan is to fit a engine just to get it wherever and then it can all be rectified at a boatyard including re blacking, and it has to be there before the BSS and licence runs out in December.

 

Was looking at replacing the boat but have not got £30000 to get a better one, so if I can get it sorted for a 1/4 of that I will be happy.

[RLWP]

Be aware that fitting a different engine may/will involve welding

 

Richard

[gazza]

Big old project then,

 

Welding up a tired hull is quite a task, I have done a fair bit on an elderly Hancock and Lane, the work never seems to end.

 

With that in mind, I'd be tempted to stick with the Lister and put my money into getting on top of the hull.

 

Steel isn't cheap, nor is the time to weld it to the boat, or the money to pay someone to do it for you if you can't weld yourself.

[chris63]

That's another option, have had a word with Dave Tully,[Tully's marine] he has a slipway in Rotherham and I can do it myself with a little help from a good friend that yuose to weld sections of warships, i can weld but not tidy welds!!

[gazza]

Good luck with it, faint heart never won fair lady and all that!

[chris63]

Good luck with it, faint heart never won fair lady and all that!

Thanks for that! first job engine tho.

[bizzard]

The SR's low oil pressure might only be due to an oil feed pipe coming adrift or undone. The crankshaft oil feeds for example are just copper pipes pushed an interference fit into holes in the main bearing blocks. one of these may have popped out or any of the connections on the oil pressure pipes lose or undone causing pressurized oil to just pour back to the bottom of the crankcase without doing anything. There is also the pressure relief valve to consider which might be jambed off its seat. All of this apart from the top end of the pipes that feeds the valve rocker shafts can be got at by removing the crankcase door.

Edited August 11, 2014 by bizzard

[Tony Brooks]

Has anyone mentioned fuel in the oil? Far from uncommon on oil cooled Lister.

 

To the OP, if not done already take the dipstick out, note the oil level and feel/smell the oil. If the level is high, if the oil is thin, or if the oil smells of diesel then part of the fuel system is leaking inside the engine.

 

Check the unions on the injectors & injector pumps, the bleed screws on the injector pumps, then look for broken pipes. The cover on the push-rod housing will have to come off unless its an injector union.

[chris63]

Where is the pressure relief valve, i have checked and de greased all the oil pipes as i thought that was the problem.