ACC

[pelicanafloat]

As an atheist who makes all the presents and cards from scratch I can assure you that some of us manage to celebrate xmas without any of the commercial of religious nonsense.

I've no objection to you being an atheist, but I do object to your judgement that any religion is nonsense. In fact, being an Atheist is a religiion of sorts .... I happen to believe in many things, for instance, I have faith that when looking for the solution to a quadratic equation, the answer will be found. If the teaching was wrong, I could still have faith in reaching a solution We use faith and belief in many things that may not be as straight forward as finding the solution to a simple equation. Afterall, if whichever God was within reach and able to be seen by everyone, you'd just include his or her existance as just another excuse to look elsewhere.Now, I have faith that one day you might actually say something without rubbishing the bit you feel awkward about. I'll pray for you and see what happens .... give it time

[Gingerbeer]

Can't believe I am going to write this but Carlt didn't say that all religion is nonsense, he said religious nonsense which is two different things.

 

Just shoot me now.

[carlt]

I've no objection to you being an atheist, but I do object to your judgement that any religion is nonsense.

It is pretty difficult to be an atheist and not dismiss religion as nonsense.

 

I find it ironic that religious folk object to my belief that to worship an imaginary being is nonsense yet the abrahamic faiths in particular believe that my lack of faith will condemn me to an eternity of pain and torment in the fiery pits of hell.

 

I think they're silly and they think I will be punished forever for not believing in their particular imaginary friend yet it is not me who is offended.

 

Funny old thing, religion.

Can't believe I am going to write this but Carlt didn't say that all religion is nonsense, he said religious nonsense which is two different things.

 

I also believe that all religion is nonsense but that still doesn't make me the villain.

 

I do respect everybody's right to practice whatever faith they choose, however silly it may be, which is more than can be said for most religions (yours being one of the few exceptions).

if whichever God was within reach and able to be seen by everyone, you'd just include his or her existance as just another excuse to look elsewhere.

If there was a god that could be seen by everyone I would be forced to acknowledge its existence but I would also want to know why it should be worshipped, considering the mess its made.

[Gingerbeer]

That's what I get for helping...being corrected.

 

Maybe you should have left "however silly it may be" out of the sentence. I find people get very defensive when you attack their beliefs.

 

Just to make it a little clearer, Buddhism is not a religion, we don't believe in God, heaven, hell, or the bible. And if God could be seen, then there would be no more reason for any religion to exist.

 

(quote) Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. For by it the elders obtained a good report.

Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. (Hebrews 11)

So seeing God would sorta make everything you thought before null and void. Just my opinions but with a touch of actual Bible scripture to back it up.

[carlt]

 

I find people get very defensive when you attack their beliefs.

 

As is their right.

 

Just as I would have every right to get defensive because their "god" says that I am so naughty for not believing in him that I will be tortured until the end of time.

 

I don't get defensive, of course, because I think it is silly and just highlights the malevolence of the people that invented religion in order to control and punish ordinary folk.

Edited September 26, 2013 by carlt

[Gingerbeer]

Just as I would have every right to get defensive because their "god" says that I am so naughty for not believing in him that I will be tortured until the end of time.

 

 

 

Their god may not, but there probably a few on this forum that would like to have a whack or two.

[carlt]

 

Their god may not, but there probably a few on this forum that would like to have a whack or two.

I doubt it very much unless they really are lacking real meaning in their life.

[eightpot]

In fact, being an Atheist is a religiion of sorts ....

How did you come to that conclusion?

[bottle]

Atheists believe there is not a god.

 

So like the religious they have a belief.

[Athy]

Christmas? Commercial? Shurely shome mishtake here?

Oh, hang on, just got back from downtown Wisbech, where one of the shops is offering illuminated santas and trees for sale - in September? Mind you, they were so hideous that they will have to start flogging them now if they want to find enough punters with taste by-passes by Christmas.

Although we label it Christmas, to me it's also valid as a midwinter festival of goodwill to others* and, as noted above, a time for cheerful gatherings and good nosh-ups at a meteorologically challenging time of year.

 

* Not always in downtown Wisbech of an evening, however.

[carlt]

Atheists believe there is not a god.

 

So like the religious they have a belief.

Religion is not about belief, it is about faith.

 

I believe there is no god because, in the absence of any empirical evidence, a supernatural, omnipotent, omniscient creator is the least logical reason for us being here.

 

Religious folk have faith because there is no need for them to have any empirical evidence or logic.

 

I am faithless because I cannot see the point in a creator nor the need to pray to one or worship it, even if it did exist.

[Gingerbeer]

Not sure if this appeals to everyone but I got a laugh from it.

 

For those of you that are not following the recent controversy that has to do with Laura Schlessinger: she is a radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. Paramount Television Group is currently producing a "Dr. Laura" television show. Recently she has become a convert to Judaism, and now she is Ba'al T'shuvah. Recently, she has made some statements about homosexuals that has caused the Canadian anti-hate laws to censure her... The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura which was posted on the internet...

J. Kent Ashcraft May 2000

Dear Dr. Laura,

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind him that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.

 

I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the specific laws and how to best follow them.

 

a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord (Lev 1:9). The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

 

I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

 

c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

 

d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

 

e) I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

 

f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an Abomination (Lev 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

 

g) Lev 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

 

h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev 19:27. How should they die?

 

i) I know from Lev 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

 

j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev 24:10-16)

Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

 

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help.

 

Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your devoted disciple and adoring fan.

[RLWP]

The Dr Laura letter has quite a back story: Snopes

 

Richard

[pelicanafloat]

It is pretty difficult to be an atheist and not dismiss religion as nonsense.

 

I find it ironic that religious folk object to my belief that to worship an imaginary being is nonsense yet the abrahamic faiths in particular believe that my lack of faith will condemn me to an eternity of pain and torment in the fiery pits of hell.

 

I think they're silly and they think I will be punished forever for not believing in their particular imaginary friend yet it is not me who is offended.

 

Funny old thing, religion.

I also believe that all religion is nonsense but that still doesn't make me the villain.

 

I do respect everybody's right to practice whatever faith they choose, however silly it may be, which is more than can be said for most religions (yours being one of the few exceptions).

If there was a god that could be seen by everyone I would be forced to acknowledge its existence but I would also want to know why it should be worshipped, considering the mess its made.

 

You have faith in your belief that no God exists purely because there is no evidence that can make you believe otherwise .... the sadness in that argument is that you will only believe if someone else will prove it.

 

Not a problem, but please don't say my belief is nonsense as I feel it belittles. As for the commercial aspect, I have long been a christmas humbug! .... As for Chrisitianity, well now, it sort of beggars belief!

 

As an aside, we were on the lock flight going down into Bath, and this person comes along and praises us for belonging to the BCF (Boaters Christian Fellowship) - we have a sticker alongside the 'Dogs Trust' (that could be construed as being a bit dyslexic lol), anyway ... being aware of the problems involving, for sake of argument, non compliant continuous cruisers, I asked him what if anything the BCF thought of their plight. His retort was along the lines of what plight? They have been asking for it for years! About blooming time they got their come uppance! I asked if this was the general view of the BCF, seeing as they had just had a big mission meeting (which we didn't know anything about, I might add), but it appears that this sort of thing wasnt on the agenda ..... hmmm, so much for His Christian charity. (and don't ask me .... read between the lines )

 

But that is unfair. An aweful lot of inaction and expectation is expected of religion. The truth of the matter is that ones belief is basically about what happens hereafter. I've been to prayer meetings and been told that "God loves me, and that is sufficient!" Not exactly the most endeering of platitudes considering how many people need proper thoughtful guidance and teaching in this day and age! But I digress. What another persons believes is perfectly acceptable. I just don't find it acceptable to be so general in your rubbishing of others .... that's all .... God Bless, and Peace be with you!

[carlt]

 

 

 

Not a problem, but please don't say my belief is nonsense as I feel it belittles. As for the commercial aspect, I have long been a christmas humbug! .... As for Chrisitianity, well now, it sort of beggars belief!

 

 

As I said, as an atheist I have no faith.

 

I also stand by my assertion that me claiming that religion and the blind faith in the unprovable is nonsense is far less offensive than what a christian believes my fate will be, on my death, for not sharing his superstition.

 

As for my rubbishing of others you must bare in mind that the Christian is just one god further away from atheism than I am. The difference being that I don't think those who believe in other gods will be getting their just desserts, on dying, any more than I will be.

Edited September 26, 2013 by carlt

[Ange]

 

December 2009, our first year living aboard full time. We've put the deccies up every year since then but sadly haven't taken any more photos. I took loads and loads of photos in our first year but have been sadly remiss since then.

 

Christmas itself alternates between my mum & dad in Bolton, and Dave's mum & dad in Kent - we've not yet spent Christmas Day aboard the boat - it's always too much of a clan gathering on either side of the family.

 

We did have a lovely New Year cruise last year with Dave's mum & dad and his brother & sister in law who were visiting from America.

[pelicanafloat]

 

December 2009, our first year living aboard full time. We've put the deccies up every year since then but sadly haven't taken any more photos. I took loads and loads of photos in our first year but have been sadly remiss since then.

 

Christmas itself alternates between my mum & dad in Bolton, and Dave's mum & dad in Kent - we've not yet spent Christmas Day aboard the boat - it's always too much of a clan gathering on either side of the family.

 

We did have a lovely New Year cruise last year with Dave's mum & dad and his brother & sister in law who were visiting from America.

Angel .... I do believe you brought the topic back online

[Ange]

Angel .... I do believe you brought the topic back online

[Gingerbeer]

 

December 2009, our first year living aboard full time. We've put the deccies up every year since then but sadly haven't taken any more photos. I took loads and loads of photos in our first year but have been sadly remiss since then.

 

Christmas itself alternates between my mum & dad in Bolton, and Dave's mum & dad in Kent - we've not yet spent Christmas Day aboard the boat - it's always too much of a clan gathering on either side of the family.

 

We did have a lovely New Year cruise last year with Dave's mum & dad and his brother & sister in law who were visiting from America.

 

I like the beams that go across the top.

[Beaker]

 

I like the beams that go across the top.

 

I rather doubt they were put up just for Christmas though.

Edited September 27, 2013 by Beaker

[RLWP]

Yeah, beams are for life, you know

 

Richard

[Ange]

 

I like the beams that go across the top.

Thank you

 

We saw them as a bit of an oddity when we bought the boat and debated whether to take them out but we rather like them now so wouldn't dream of it. They're quite handy for putting hooks in and hanging things from as well.

[Gingerbeer]

 

I rather doubt they were put up just for Christmas though.

 

OMG...okay, I love the Christmas deco and especially love the beams that go across the top. It makes it looks very cottagey....how's that Beaker boy.

Edited September 27, 2013 by Gingerbeer

[pelicanafloat]

Yeah, beams are for life, you know

 

Richard

Utter rot

[luctor et emergo]

Just another day for the most part, what with being an atheist. But I did make one concession for lunch:

 

 

Pump-out or cassette?