Ken Keay

[Tiggers]

John Harmon (previous owner of Canis Major) gave me this clipping, apparently it was from the Wolverhampton Express. I thought it was a particularly nice thing to go along with the boat. I have also been told recently that Canis was the last boat to be fully completed by Ken Keay? I have found an advert in WW by Keelcast (the company that took many of the staff on) with a picture on Canis saying it was the last tug to be completed by Ken. Anyone know if this is true?

 

Also still desperately searching for pictures of Canis whilst she was still working, I am yet to see one!

 

[Derek R.]

You have just confirmed (as near as dammit) the use for a box I have which itself came from a friend whose Grandfather - and Italian gent - once owned. The friend was about to chuck it on a bonfire. It's a signwriters paint box, not that I knew that at the time, but it's almost identical to that Ken is seen using though smaller.

 

Brilliant - thanks!

[Guest]

Crying out to be framed and displayed on the boat I would have said..

[Heartland]

Ken Keay, his last yard as far as I can recall was Carl Street, west of Pratt's Bridge, and previously Worseys ( I am sure Laurence can confirm. The yard was alongside the Wyrley & Essington Canal and has been mentioned in another recent post regarding the idenfication of the boat hull fragments that still reside there. Is it recorded when Ken Keay stopped building there?

 

The paper by the way was the Express & Star.

 

Ray Shill

[Laurence Hogg]

Ken Keay, his last yard as far as I can recall was Carl Street, west of Pratt's Bridge, and previously Worseys ( I am sure Laurence can confirm. The yard was alongside the Wyrley & Essington Canal and has been mentioned in another recent post regarding the idenfication of the boat hull fragments that still reside there. Is it recorded when Ken Keay stopped building there?

 

The paper by the way was the Express & Star.

 

Ray Shill

Hi Ray, Yes thats at Carl St and as far as I know it was the last boat he completed, there was much "work in progress" around most of which was never completed.

[Tuscan]

When I bought Canis ( as opposed to Canis Major) I was told that these were the last boats he converted, if I recall Canis had to be recovered from the yard after being sold but with he receivers in place, my memory is hazy so I can't be totally sure.

[Tiggers]

That really is amazing to know, thanks guy

 

If anyone does have any pictures of her, would love to see them.

[mykaskin]

Nice little piece about life on the yard here:

 

http://allensregister.com/bp190_keay.php

 

Victoria was on dock there twice, once when bought by ST Brants and I have a picture with her still in Waterways blue on the slip thanks to Malcolm Braine, and I saw another of Malcolm's pictures when she was in ST Brants Grey being worked on for her new owners Birmingham and Midland Canal Carriers!

 

Mike

[Laurence Hogg]

This is Canis Major a few days prior to the signwriting, virtually finished. Other boats in the picture are "Leviathan" to the right and "Silver Jubilee" in the background.

 

[johnthebridge]

I've previously described here my involvement with Canis, but I assume you didn't see my post. I bought Canis, as a complete boat, from Ken in about 1975. She'd lain empty and cabin-less at Pratt's Bridge since acquisition from Stewarts and Lloyds, and my original intention was to cut her in two, get Ken to make a 60' motor from the fore-end and sell the stern on. Some time before any of this happened, Ken told me that the Josher steamer Vulcan, then owned by Charlie Foster and lying at the yard, was for sale. Cutting a long story short, I bought her, and then sold the (by then) two halves of Canis to two friends of mine, John Harmon and Peter Ward. John had first choice and, for reasons I never understood, chose the stern end.

Too long ago now to remember properly, but Canis Major was probably the last fully-completed boat off the dock before it closed. I can certainly remember John and I dragging stuff away from the yard and towing it down the curly Wyrley to Minerva, probably around 1981-2, John on Canis and me on Barrow. I remember it was very cold, with cat ice on the cut. It was immensely sad, the yard had occupied an awful lot of our time during the '70s, and I still miss the sights, sounds and smell of it, even now.

You never saw Ken sign-writing much. Most of the work then was done by the late Selwyn Jordan. When the time came, and the yard finished, none of the full time blokes moved to Minerva with Keith Humby. Mr. Humby's company there, Keelkast, was a name they had made up by using the Humby family's christian names--KEith, ELaine, KAtherine and STeven. They were not a company I would have ever employed, either to build, or work on, any of my boats.

Edited September 11, 2012 by johnthebridge

[AMModels]

Hi John, Charlie was my grandfather and he fell out with Ken over the sale of Vulcan. The quote for rebottoming her was the cause for her sale and he 'found out' later he could have had her done for a lot less than Ken priced it...that could have been mischief making by someone else tho. At the time my grandad had lost the ends of two of his fingers in an industrial accident and he couldnt afford to pay and Ken told him shed sink if he put her back in the water, so he made the difficult choice to sell her. I loved that boat lol, we still had the boys brigade fit out inside and 15 of us would go away as a family kipping on green think tarped mattresses on steel frames which folded into the side of the hull during the day. Selwyn was theday to day gaffer on the yard for sure and everyone looked to him when Kens back was turned, when Keays closed he and Mac Till took over looking after the Walsall council boat fleet including USK and Truman the Keays built holiday boat which looked just like a cut off joey which was in effect what she was.

Im with you on the smells and sounds of the yard tho, as a kid being free to wander around with steam chests and huge hand tools everywhere was like xmas everyday and crawling under and over the boats on blocks and afloat made it the best playground ever. My uncle had the first boat built by Selwyn and Mac at Victoria basin at the top of the 21 and called her Mayflower partly as homage to the motor from Elements.

Thanks for the memory nudge.

[johnthebridge]

In some ways, I think Ken lived in his own world, rather cut off from "modern times", and his pricing of some jobs could be somewhat inflexible, but I do think that particular incident was, as you say, mischief making. I can also take an educated guess at where that might have emanated.

I know that when he re-built Vulcan for me, we agreed on a total (fair) price beforehand and he kept to that figure, although the work was, inevitably, more extensive and took much longer than we initially thought. I always found him to be an utterly honourable man-outwardly he came across as a rather endearing old buffer, slightly bumbling, but underneath there lay a much more steely determination. He loved the yard, and would have done anything to keep it going, but I felt then, as I still do, that when he was joined by Tony Miles, the yard suffered. Although I think Tony had the best of intentions, I felt that his style of conducting business was at odds with Ken's ideals. Tony thought that the yard required a modern approach, and more cash of course, all perfectly laudable aims, but I think his manner could, and did, alienate the traditional type of customer the yard attracted. Ken preferred the old fashioned approach, of agree a price, shake hands and get on with it.

Although Selwyn was always around the yard and usually painting/writing, Sid was nominally the foreman. There were also Alan (carpenter), Eddie (odd job man, always wore a beret, blacking, mixing up chalico, caulking etc.), Bill Whitehouse the engine man (who operated his own little fiefdom from a trailer in a corner of the yard), assorted welders who came and went as required, and Paul the young chap who moved boats around and later went to the top of the 21 with Selwyn and steered the Usk.

Charlie never mentioned his spat with Ken, but usually called him something like "a canny old bugger" in any conversation I had with him! We sat next to each other at Worcester for Ken's funeral along with various luminaries from the canal world, and he was as sad as anyone at Ken's passing although, in true Black Country fashion, he did say to me afterwards that, "he'd only come to see that the coffin was nailed down properly".

Do you remember the famous teapot, that used to lurk in the hovel?

[Tiggers]

Can I thank you both for such fantastic info, and painting such a vivid picture of the yard. I do remember John making a passing comment about the teapot, and feeling very honoured when he was offered a cuppa!

[AMModels]

In some ways, I think Ken lived in his own world, rather cut off from "modern times", and his pricing of some jobs could be somewhat inflexible, but I do think that particular incident was, as you say, mischief making. I can also take an educated guess at where that might have emanated.

I know that when he re-built Vulcan for me, we agreed on a total (fair) price beforehand and he kept to that figure, although the work was, inevitably, more extensive and took much longer than we initially thought. I always found him to be an utterly honourable man-outwardly he came across as a rather endearing old buffer, slightly bumbling, but underneath there lay a much more steely determination. He loved the yard, and would have done anything to keep it going, but I felt then, as I still do, that when he was joined by Tony Miles, the yard suffered. Although I think Tony had the best of intentions, I felt that his style of conducting business was at odds with Ken's ideals. Tony thought that the yard required a modern approach, and more cash of course, all perfectly laudable aims, but I think his manner could, and did, alienate the traditional type of customer the yard attracted. Ken preferred the old fashioned approach, of agree a price, shake hands and get on with it.

Although Selwyn was always around the yard and usually painting/writing, Sid was nominally the foreman. There were also Alan (carpenter), Eddie (odd job man, always wore a beret, blacking, mixing up chalico, caulking etc.), Bill Whitehouse the engine man (who operated his own little fiefdom from a trailer in a corner of the yard), assorted welders who came and went as required, and Paul the young chap who moved boats around and later went to the top of the 21 with Selwyn and steered the Usk.

Charlie never mentioned his spat with Ken, but usually called him something like "a canny old bugger" in any conversation I had with him! We sat next to each other at Worcester for Ken's funeral along with various luminaries from the canal world, and he was as sad as anyone at Ken's passing although, in true Black Country fashion, he did say to me afterwards that, "he'd only come to see that the coffin was nailed down properly".

Do you remember the famous teapot, that used to lurk in the hovel?

 

 

hehehe sounds about right although Im not sure he was kidding about the nails, his opinion may have softened after a few years but he hated having to sell Vulcan as did the rest of us and you will probably be right about the location of the mischief. I remember Paul very well he lived on USK with his girlfriend, whose name escapes me, for a while and we chatted about boats and canals in general on our many shared trips and evenings. Eddie and his beret stand out for me as I watched him mixing the chalico and thinking he was kidding when he told me about the horse muck that went into it and also showing me how to strip down rope to make the caulking and then letting me have a go with the mallet and chisel to knock some in to the planks. The never empty teapot which you never saw anyone fill but always seemed to have tea in it strong enough to melt the spoons or to take the tar off a hull lol. The work done for us never had a fixed price and the rising nature of it was the source of shall we say the frustration felt at the time, I know he didnt go back to Ken with subsequent boats he headed to Brainies yard, or Yates' as he called it when fitout was needed after a sinking incident of his next boat.

[johnthebridge]

Andy, what was the name of the boat Charlie had after Vulcan? Was it Falcon, or Corsair, those names stick in my mind? I think she had an old Thornycroft in her? One dark and stormy night, after an excess of "Bonks's moild" at the club, Charlie and H insisted on levering me into the back of it to, of course, fire her up and demonstrate how they got from London to Birnigem in 22 hours, or some such tale. I found a bottle of the finest Scottish falling over water ("not a drop is sold 'til it's three days old") in Vulcan's cabin and somehow, the night just passed away.

Talking of the hovel, which was the most aptly-named of buildings, what about the resident cat who lived there, and whose name escapes me? Nominally the yard mouser, she was fed Kit-e-Kat from tins that were neither washed out or thrown away after use, but merely stacked in an ever-increasing and quietly stinking pile. The standing "joke" was that Ken was waiting until he had enough tins to ice-plate the wooden tug that Tony M had persuaded him to build. I think Denis Cooper later bought that and after finishing her, sold her on to Nick Bostock. I wonder if the current owner was to peel back the ice-plates.....?

I was never that happy about Vulcan. We decided to try and build an approximation of the gas-engine cabin, but against my wishes it was built too high (still is) and had too much kick-up at the stern. Ken said, "You'm tall, so you'll need the headroom". And that was that. He also wanted to block the counter with timber, and I had a devil of a job persuading him otherwise but, in my absence, he went ahead and did it in steel anyway!. The JP was out of the Judith Anne, and it had been "semi-submerged" at some point in its life. Bill the engine-man had "fabricated" (I use the term loosely) a speed-wheel arrangement with bits from his "stores". These included a steering drop-arm from a 105E and a large iron pinion dating to about 1873. The first time we all went out for a "pre-delivery inspection" run to Catshill stop, I held her back at the turn and, with a massive creak, followed by a sound like Zeus putting out his bins, the whole lot came away from its moorings (self tapping screws in the bulkhead) and descended into the bilges.

Enough!

[AMModels]

Andy, what was the name of the boat Charlie had after Vulcan? Was it Falcon, or Corsair, those names stick in my mind? I think she had an old Thornycroft in her? One dark and stormy night, after an excess of "Bonks's moild" at the club, Charlie and H insisted on levering me into the back of it to, of course, fire her up and demonstrate how they got from London to Birnigem in 22 hours, or some such tale. I found a bottle of the finest Scottish falling over water ("not a drop is sold 'til it's three days old") in Vulcan's cabin and somehow, the night just passed away.

Talking of the hovel, which was the most aptly-named of buildings, what about the resident cat who lived there, and whose name escapes me? Nominally the yard mouser, she was fed Kit-e-Kat from tins that were neither washed out or thrown away after use, but merely stacked in an ever-increasing and quietly stinking pile. The standing "joke" was that Ken was waiting until he had enough tins to ice-plate the wooden tug that Tony M had persuaded him to build. I think Denis Cooper later bought that and after finishing her, sold her on to Nick Bostock. I wonder if the current owner was to peel back the ice-plates.....?

I was never that happy about Vulcan. We decided to try and build an approximation of the gas-engine cabin, but against my wishes it was built too high (still is) and had too much kick-up at the stern. Ken said, "You'm tall, so you'll need the headroom". And that was that. He also wanted to block the counter with timber, and I had a devil of a job persuading him otherwise but, in my absence, he went ahead and did it in steel anyway!. The JP was out of the Judith Anne, and it had been "semi-submerged" at some point in its life. Bill the engine-man had "fabricated" (I use the term loosely) a speed-wheel arrangement with bits from his "stores". These included a steering drop-arm from a 105E and a large iron pinion dating to about 1873. The first time we all went out for a "pre-delivery inspection" run to Catshill stop, I held her back at the turn and, with a massive creak, followed by a sound like Zeus putting out his bins, the whole lot came away from its moorings (self tapping screws in the bulkhead) and descended into the bilges.

Enough!

 

Heath Robinson learnt his trade down Carl Street Im sure, the only cat I remember down there was a moth eaten specimen that hissed and scratched at anyone he didnt like the look of....maybe I should have carried kit e kat with me lol. The next boat was Falcon a mk2 Bantock I think lovely fore end reminiscent of yarwoods railway boats with chubby cheeks, the engine was a beast of a thing 3 cylinder Rus(h)ton Hornsby (always had a sh in the middle when we spoke about it) had a flywheel made of solid brass to look at it and was only ever hand cranked, no electric start on that one. Was a contrary bugger to start and as a 10-11 year old swinging that handle with all my might the feeling of total and absolute muscleman status was never mine as the bloody thing would stop dead for me every time the first compression lever was knocked over and Id end up flying over the top of the handle. I decided my job was to drop the levers and encourage the cranker hehehehe, the engine we had in Vulcan was something crazy like an old bus engine was it? did you have that as well or was it gone before you bought her? Legend in the family has it that on a trip down the Weaver everyone but the steerer (grandad of course) had to stand in the well deck as she had buried her back end down and the back doors had to be shut as they tried to see how fast she could go, the decision was she could go too bleeding fast and the engine would sink her if given its head.

I have to admit that I loved the job done on Vulcan and took a fair few pics of her one time when we passed at Wheaton Aston lock, it was Vulcan and Usk and of course H and Charlie who started the bug for working boats in me and I still dream of one day owning my own a bit bigger than the 1/12th scale model of Hingleys Crown I have built in the shed, Princess Anne is the Eldorado of legend in our family and I have a model of her which was built for H but not finished in time except to be shown at his wake in the club.

[Paul H]

Princess Anne is up for sale! Asking £45K on Apollo Duck

 

You probably didn't want to know that Andy.

 

Good to see you back on the forum.

 

Paul

[Derek R.]

Magic stuff!

 

Talking of Bus engines, way back in the early eighties I'll swear there was an AEC engine from an RT in some boat or other. All I could think of when I heard it was: "Where the 29?" (29's ran from Wood Green to Camden Town and beyond, but Camden was where I worked).

 

Boatless Derek.

[AMModels]

Princess Anne is up for sale! Asking £45K on Apollo Duck

 

You probably didn't want to know that Andy.

 

Good to see you back on the forum.

 

Paul

 

I didnt thanks Paul If I had the cash ....... I know H tried to buy her or at least put together a group to do so a few years back, stumbling block was one guy who was putting in most of the money objected to the name as he was a rabid anti royalist and wanted to put her back to Plato.... sacrilege I tell you!!!

 

Nice to be back.

 

Magic stuff!

 

Talking of Bus engines, way back in the early eighties I'll swear there was an AEC engine from an RT in some boat or other. All I could think of when I heard it was: "Where the 29?" (29's ran from Wood Green to Camden Town and beyond, but Camden was where I worked).

 

Boatless Derek.

 

All I remember of that bus engine is it made the boat go like a train and it could have made a lorry waterski behind it all while sounding like a plane taking off. Did I miss any form of travel out there hehehe

[AMModels]

Princess Anne is up for sale! Asking £45K on Apollo Duck

 

You probably didn't want to know that Andy.

 

Good to see you back on the forum.

 

Paul

 

Just pondering PA being for sale...you knew I would be didnt you!? I 'only' need to sell 2500 models and she is mine....now who wants to place an order for the first 2000??

[johnthebridge]

Heath Robinson learnt his trade down Carl Street Im sure, the only cat I remember down there was a moth eaten specimen that hissed and scratched at anyone he didnt like the look of....maybe I should have carried kit e kat with me lol. The next boat was Falcon a mk2 Bantock I think lovely fore end reminiscent of yarwoods railway boats with chubby cheeks, the engine was a beast of a thing 3 cylinder Rus(h)ton Hornsby (always had a sh in the middle when we spoke about it) had a flywheel made of solid brass to look at it and was only ever hand cranked, no electric start on that one. Was a contrary bugger to start and as a 10-11 year old swinging that handle with all my might the feeling of total and absolute muscleman status was never mine as the bloody thing would stop dead for me every time the first compression lever was knocked over and Id end up flying over the top of the handle. I decided my job was to drop the levers and encourage the cranker hehehehe, the engine we had in Vulcan was something crazy like an old bus engine was it? did you have that as well or was it gone before you bought her? Legend in the family has it that on a trip down the Weaver everyone but the steerer (grandad of course) had to stand in the well deck as she had buried her back end down and the back doors had to be shut as they tried to see how fast she could go, the decision was she could go too bleeding fast and the engine would sink her if given its head.

I have to admit that I loved the job done on Vulcan and took a fair few pics of her one time when we passed at Wheaton Aston lock, it was Vulcan and Usk and of course H and Charlie who started the bug for working boats in me and I still dream of one day owning my own a bit bigger than the 1/12th scale model of Hingleys Crown I have built in the shed, Princess Anne is the Eldorado of legend in our family and I have a model of her which was built for H but not finished in time except to be shown at his wake in the club.

 

Awroight our kid?

Sorry, been away barging in Ireland for the last couple of months, and hadn't seen this. When I bought her, she had no engine in her, but I seem to remember Ken telling me it had been a BMC 1500? There wasn't much of the internals either. Perhaps Charlie felt he needed to retain something for his new boat!

When we stripped the cabin off her one cold miserable Saturday, we decided to have a MASSIVE bonfire on the towpath opposite the dock, and someone, seeing this conflagration, called the brigade. On arrival, they weren't too impressed to be met at the crime scene by three filthy desperadoes with effete Southern accents explaining that they were only burning "a bit of rubbish".

Did you ever to get to see inside the old girl?

That Element's boat is still for sale.....Even at my age, I could still be tempted, if the price was more reasonable. Perhaps it's good that it's not?

[Hummers]

Talking of the hovel, which was the most aptly-named of buildings, what about the resident cat who lived there, and whose name escapes me? Nominally the yard mouser, she was fed Kit-e-Kat from tins that were neither washed out or thrown away after use, but merely stacked in an ever-increasing and quietly stinking pile. The standing "joke" was that Ken was waiting until he had enough tins to ice-plate the wooden tug that Tony M had persuaded him to build. I think Denis Cooper later bought that and after finishing her, sold her on to Nick Bostock. I wonder if the current owner was to peel back the ice-plates.....?

 

She was called "Blackie". I loved that cat but when my dad decided we needed some dogs for security, Jack Haddock took her home (we moved onto "Leviathan" at the yard which was never fitted out and so bought a static caravan and lived on that instead). She quite often got her head stuck in a can.

 

By the way, I'm the "Steve" of Keelkast (re: your earlier post about how the company was named).

 

Edited January 29, 2013 by Hummers