to survey or not to survey?

[ploddy]

hi all,

 

we are thinking of putting an offer in on a narrowboat this week. The boat was built in 1998 and was last surveyed in 2007. Is it worth getting a new survey? The boat has been regularly maintained as far as i'm aware, being blacked earlier this year.

thanks

Edited August 20, 2011 by ploddy

[wiccan]

We brought a second hand boat this year and we made the mistake of not getting a new survey dne in the boat prior ti buying her (last survey was done in Aug 10). Had we done so, we may have found the serious problems prior to the purchase which have since cost us in excess of £2000 to put right and not being able to use our new boat For almost 6 weeks.

 

I would suggest u get a full survey done to be sure the boat is sound in both structure, electrical and safety. The cost of a good survey could be a lot cheaper than fixing the issues later on.

[Alan de Enfield]

The other side of the coin :

 

A few years ago we looked at a Fairline Corniche, twin 200hp Volvo engines, very nice condition. We had a full survey conducted (engines and hull) at the cost of some several £100's.Survey gave a clean bill of health and we purchased the boat.

 

After a couple of weeks of pottering about we started getting Engine, Turbo and Leg problems. To cut a long story short it eventually cost in excess of £20,000 to fix the various problems.

Tried to take the surveyor to task and he pointed out the 'small print' - he cannot be held responsible for 'anything he cannot see' he does not lift carpets or take anything apart to examine it.

Took it to a marine lawyer who basically said - no case the surveyor is correct.

 

The last two N/B's we have purchased have been without a survey - I'd say its your choice and depends on what you are spending on the boat but just remember a surveyors report is just a guide - not a guarantee.

[14skipper]

Was in a brokerage last weekend,asked about survey on a 2yr old boat.

Was told" although we recommend a survey you won,t really need it,and if you ring a surveyor and tell them the age they will say 'why bother"

Don,t know if thats true or not.

14Skipper

[Robin2]

Perhaps it would be a good idea to ask the surveyor (before he earns any money) "If you give this boat a good report and we buy it and something goes wrong, what can we sue you for?". A good surveyor should not be offended and should be able to give a clear answer referenced to his draft contract.

 

Personally I would be happy with my own judgment of the condition of an engine and the electrical and plumbing systems - as well as the furnishings of course. What I can't do myself is measure the hull thickness and I don't have sufficient experience of poor welding quality or of propeller / shaft problems. Also I don't know the regulations so I would not spot an infringement that might make the boat hard to sell on.

 

So I would get a survey done and I would attend the survey and ask the surveyor any (vaguely relevant ) questions that sprang to mind.

[Ally]

Agree with robin. Make sure you get a FULL survey,, out the water. Use a good surveyor, he will probably save you the money he costs, by giving you items to cut the purchase cost for. Good luck.

[MtB]

hi all,

 

we are thinking of putting an offer in on a narrowboat this week. The boat was built in 1998 and was last surveyed in 2007. Is it worth getting a new survey? The boat has been regularly maintained as far as i'm aware, being blacked earlier this year.

thanks

 

 

The main reason for getting a survey is to reveal faults which may lead you to decide not to purchase the boat. If you can imagine a fault that would a deal-breaker (e.g. a hull thickness down to <whatever>mm), I suggest you just do whatever it takes to check if that fault exists, eg slip the boat and get the hull thickness measured.

 

If you have fallen in love with this particular boat and are going to buy it regardless, complete with old batteries/engine needs a service/dodgy exhaust/thinning hull or a myriad other 'problems' a surveyor might come up with then there the only reason for a survey is for information/ammunition to help you renegotiate the price. But if you want it and you are going to buy it anyway, then you're wasted the survey fee

 

In my experience the technical condition of a boat can loosely be judged by looking at the general aesthetic condition. A scruffy-looking boat is not likely to have been maintained well, and a smart and tidy boat is likely to have had a previous owner with a good attitude to maintenance. As with cars you are buying the previous owner(s) as much as the boat. Most of the headaches that come with a second had boat are rooted in the previous owner. Meet them if possible and assess their personality. I suggest this will tell you all you need to know about the probable condition of the boat!

 

Mike

 

P.S. I've never had a survey done, usually managed to meet the previous owner and have yet to have any surprises.

[zenataomm]

Do what you want ....... it's your money.

 

If you're in the habit of spending large amounts of money on items which you yourself are not experienced in evaluating and it doesn't affect your ability to sleep at night, raise fears regarding your own safety or that of your family and friends or put a question in your head regarding how easy it will be to sell on afterwards then why break the habit of a lifetime?

Edited August 21, 2011 by zenataomm

[Mike Jordan]

Even if you are experienced in assessing boats and engines, its a good idea to get someone who is not suffering from the "rose tinted glasses" effect to look over your proposed purchase.

Your chosen surveyor should come with a recommend from someone you trust, certainly not the one attached to, or prefered by the brokerage!

Your boating can be ruined by something as simple as a lack of insulation or a badly installed engine. Either would cost a mint to correct but may not affect your safety.

When you buy your third or fourth boat you may be justified in relying on your own judgment. You will have heard most of the horror stories by then!

Best of luck

Mike

[Robin2]

Perhaps it would be a good idea to ask the surveyor (before he earns any money) "If you give this boat a good report and we buy it and something goes wrong, what can we sue you for?". A good surveyor should not be offended and should be able to give a clear answer referenced to his draft contract.

 

Personally I would be happy with my own judgment of the condition of an engine and the electrical and plumbing systems - as well as the furnishings of course. What I can't do myself is measure the hull thickness and I don't have sufficient experience of poor welding quality or of propeller / shaft problems. Also I don't know the regulations so I would not spot an infringement that might make the boat hard to sell on.

 

So I would get a survey done and I would attend the survey and ask the surveyor any (vaguely relevant ) questions that sprang to mind.

Do what you want ....... it's your money.

 

If you're in the habit of spending large amounts of money on items which you yourself are not experienced in evaluating and it doesn't affect your ability to sleep at night, raise fears regarding your own safety or that of your family and friends or put a question in your head regarding how easy it will be to sell on afterwards then why break the habit of a lifetime?

 

In what way is your comment related to mine? If not, why make the link?

[zenataomm]

In what way is your comment related to mine? If not, why make the link?

 

 

Absolutely none at all. I linked it to the OP's question and when I hit the post button it only posted half of what I'd written. So I went back and edited it (you'll see that's marked) when I reposted it I didn't check that it was still linked to the right one. I removed the link completely as I believe my comments stand alone without need for any reference.

 

My mistake, apologies, have a cold beer on me

[LEO]

hi all,

 

we are thinking of putting an offer in on a narrowboat this week. The boat was built in 1998 and was last surveyed in 2007. Is it worth getting a new survey? The boat has been regularly maintained as far as i'm aware, being blacked earlier this year.

thanks

 

Hi,

 

It would be wise to get a survey carried out on your prospective purchase, but carefully check what you are instructiing the surveyor to inspect and confirm (in writing) what the limitations of his inspection will be.

 

Surveyors are supposed to 'follow the trail' if they find a problem and discover the cause of any problem, this may involve invasive works to reveal the root cause. In this instance the owners consent must be obtained prior to commencing works.

 

Decide whether you need an engine/transmission survey and is the Surveyor suitably qualified for inspecting and reporting on these points, similarly with gas installations.

 

If a problem occurs after purchase it's wise to discuss this area with the surveyor and try to resolve the matter, I know of 2 recent cases where the surveyor has refunded his fee in an attempt to recompense his client.

 

I am sorry if Surveyors hide behind 'small print' but it's generally down to poor communication when instructing the surveyor.

 

Best of luck which ever route you choose, I have not had a survey on the 2 boats I have purchased, they both were well presented and fairly 'young' as boats go, but unless you have cash to cover expenses don't follow my example, get a survey, which fits your needs.

 

Leo.

 

Leo.

[bottle]

hi all,

 

we are thinking of putting an offer in on a narrowboat this week. The boat was built in 1998 and was last surveyed in 2007. Is it worth getting a new survey? The boat has been regularly maintained as far as i'm aware, being blacked earlier this year.

thanks

 

Reading between the lines adding 2+2 and getting 5

 

Do you mean a new survey or a new BSS (Boat Safety Scheme) certificate.

 

The first, a survey, is in my opinion a must when buying a boat. Select your surveyor and talk to him about what you want and what guarantees he will give.

 

The second, BSS certificate is required to enable you to insure and licence the boat.

 

Edit: If you do decide to put in an offer, make it subject to survey.

Edited August 21, 2011 by bottle

[Robin2]

Absolutely none at all. I linked it to the OP's question and when I hit the post button it only posted half of what I'd written. So I went back and edited it (you'll see that's marked) when I reposted it I didn't check that it was still linked to the right one. I removed the link completely as I believe my comments stand alone without need for any reference.

 

My mistake, apologies, have a cold beer on me

 

No problem!

[daveyboi2050]

Hi All.

 

Iam in the same boat at min myself. I have on Friday found the boat i wont. a 1987 48ft semi trad. That has been extremely well looked after. last had a survey in 2007 but had a hull suvey 8 months ago whilst being blackened. the boat gets blacked every year including bottom plate. has a new vetus engine in 2008!

 

I asked the advice of the broker. who said we would prefer you to have a survey but its my call!

[Robin2]

Hi All.

 

Iam in the same boat at min myself. I have on Friday found the boat i wont. a 1987 48ft semi trad. That has been extremely well looked after. last had a survey in 2007 but had a hull suvey 8 months ago whilst being blackened. the boat gets blacked every year including bottom plate. has a new vetus engine in 2008!

 

I asked the advice of the broker. who said we would prefer you to have a survey but its my call!

 

Well don't fight over it - that will just push the price up