advice on "post-concrete flooring" please

[pamaloon]

Hullo Everyone, Could you help with some advice here please? Reading Starman's Topic, this seemed an appropriate place to come in.

:help:

In restoring my wee 40 foot early 1970's NB, when we took up all the oddments of wood and chipboard as flooring (uneven of course), we found/confirmed the concrete ballast flooring throughout up to the level of those steel cross-member thingies - ie the cement is flush to these points. So...

 

Although the boat is such a "pretty" little boat, with her distinctive Dutch-style Colecraft bow, she is NOT a "listed" type/traditional Fellows & Thingummy sort and, quite apart from the fact that I could not afford a beautiful wooden floor throughout, I've decided to put down a laminate flooring (possibly ISPL's Aqua-Step)which is about 10mm thick. BUT...

 

The cement flooring is "IT"! There's nowt else there: no dpm of any description - no bitumen paint or paste - nowt!!

 

Just to help in giving you the whole picture, the skin/walling is all coming down to floor level - ie as low as we can get!! All we have left is a lovely steel shell, nice and dry and her original steel paint only showing a few very very small rust patches which are get-at-able, plus of course the original polystyrene sheets cut to fit in between struts and cross-members. So, you can appreciate that I'm able to get right down to the concrete floor level to the full length and breadth of the boat.

 

I would like to seek your advice please on how to proceed "atop" the concrete flooring... (and no, I'd rather not sit on the floor with a cold chisel taking the cement out bit by bit!!!).

 

Before laying any final flooring, should I paint/paste the cement with a bitumistic "gunk", or laydown plastic sheeting, right up to the sides with pleats, say, taken up the sides too for about 6 inches ... or anything else? After a DPM of whatever description, should I lay something like CMS's Damping Sheet Type DS so as to get a really flat floor?

 

I'm sorry to show to you all my ignorance. I've waited a long time to have such an NB and I'd like to do things properly. Ok, to begin with she was just a "part-restoration" but the more I saw in depth, the more I wanted to get everything right. She's lasted since the early 1970s - I'd like to make her last another 40 years!!

 

Optimistically I'll say Thank you very much for considering this. Best wishes, Pamaloon

[paulcatchpole]

I'd stick a DPM sheet down, and then tile lath battens, plywood subfloor and laminate on top of that.

 

But, up to you I guess!

 

PC

[pamaloon]

I'd stick a DPM sheet down, and then tile lath battens, plywood subfloor and laminate on top of that.

 

But, up to you I guess!

 

PC

 

Thanks for that Paul and I appreciate that you gave your response in a way I can understand! Sound clear and a nice method of going about things. I'm very grateful.

Pamaloon

[nb Innisfree]

I would make sure concrete is completely dry then seal it to keep out water/oxygen, something that will soak in and stay flexible, paint on silicone damp proofing comes to mind, the type that is used on brickwork to seal it?

[smileypete]

Before laying any final flooring, should I paint/paste the cement with a bitumistic "gunk", or laydown plastic sheeting, right up to the sides with pleats, say, taken up the sides too for about 6 inches ... or anything else?

Wouldn't do any harm, but I'd stick with what has worked over the last 40years...

 

cheers,

Pete.

[Evo]

If I'd gone as far stripping the boat out so that the entire floor is accessable, I'd get the thing out of the water somehow, level it up with a spirit level and jacks, then pour in some floor levelling compound. You would end up with a perfectly flat consistent finish floor. seal/paint it and its perfect for accepting your laminate flooring.

[pamaloon]

Wouldn't do any harm, but I'd stick with what has worked over the last 40years...

 

cheers,

Pete.

Thanks Pete but.........er, exactly which bit that has "worked over the last 40 years"?!

[pamaloon]

If I'd gone as far stripping the boat out so that the entire floor is accessable, I'd get the thing out of the water somehow, level it up with a spirit level and jacks, then pour in some floor levelling compound. You would end up with a perfectly flat consistent finish floor. seal/paint it and its perfect for accepting your laminate flooring.

 

I like the sound of this very much, Evo but...

 

It's just a shame that I need to make one heckuvva load of pennies before I can afford to have the old girl lifted out but ... boyo-boy it'd enable me to do so many of those awkward jobs and t'other things that'd be made accessible. The final flooring finish would really look fabulous then. Mind you, if the eventual surface is THAT good then I'd love to have saved up enough by then for a wooden/plank floor too. :rolleyes:

 

Oh to heck with it, how much is it to have a boat lifted out anyway - and kept out for a four or five weeks??!

 

I think what is called for here is a very public demonstration and declaration here, on the Forum for something that is needed and I could and should do - because by golly it'd be worth it, namely:

 

I MUST SAVE UP, SAY, AN EXTRA £500.00+++ TO HAVE THE GIRL LIFTED OUT AND DO THINGS PROPERLY (INCLUDING OF COURSE ENOUGH TO BUY PROPER WOODEN FLOORING!) There, I've done it. It's 9 November 2010 and let's see how long this public declaration of intent takes to complete!

 

Yup, thanks to you Evo, I've decided this is what I must do. So, cheers to you!

 

Administrator: Your pages should carry a Health Warning! Gentle words to us readers please to remind us that what we decide to write here is going to be made very public and if we say we'll do something, WE HAVE TO DO IT!!! Oh heck!

 

Pam

[Evo]

Whoah....hold on a minute..seek some more advice first...I know absolutely nothing about concrete ballasted boats, I was just taking a quick poke at what I thought I would do in this situation. Is the hull sound..!!! IS any of the concrete loose..!! blah blah.

 

Now.....!!! will you take the little blue ones please..!! .....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry about joke..just my weird sense of humour.

[Biggles]

If the floor is already fairly level as in flat in all directions, dry and in otherwise good condition why not just put a DPC sheet of plastic down, then overlay this with a 1" hi density PU foam sheet then this will be ready for a floating floor of your choice.

 

Biggles

[pamaloon]

Whoah....hold on a minute..seek some more advice first...I know absolutely nothing about concrete ballasted boats, I was just taking a quick poke at what I thought I would do in this situation. Is the hull sound..!!! IS any of the concrete loose..!! blah blah.

 

Heave-ho Evo!! Do you REALLY think I could save up that amount of dosh?! Mmmm, though it was a nice idea wasn't it?! Regarding the little blue ones, I'll stick to me purple and yellow ones thanks! Pam

 

Now.....!!! will you take the little blue ones please..!! .....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry about joke..just my weird sense of humour.

 

If the floor is already fairly level as in flat in all directions, dry and in otherwise good condition why not just put a DPC sheet of plastic down, then overlay this with a 1" hi density PU foam sheet then this will be ready for a floating floor of your choice.

 

Sorry Biggles: I'm now back from being away with the fairies!

 

Yup, the floor is fairly level. I'm fairly sure I could get it skimmed off to "properly level" with some of the chaps who might be able to help.

 

May I show my complete ignorance and ask where I should try and buy the hi-density PU foam sheeting? An ordinary builder's merchant?

 

Thanks, Pam

 

W

 

Biggles

[paulcatchpole]

May I show my complete ignorance and ask where I should try and buy the hi-density PU foam sheeting? An ordinary builder's merchant?

 

I'm thinking Biggles means Kingspan/Celotex or similar, as you'd do in the garage conversion, for example...

 

£10ish a sheet in 1" thicknesses, foil coated, from any good builders' merchant.

 

PC

[Biggles]

I'm thinking Biggles means Kingspan/Celotex or similar, as you'd do in the garage conversion, for example...

 

£10ish a sheet in 1" thicknesses, foil coated, from any good builders' merchant.

 

PC

 

 

Kingspan yes, not sure about Cellotex its kinda soft, I certainly wouldn't use it on a floor with 10mm laminate straight on top. Bear in mind there are different densities of foam. Make sure its good for floors. Good place to look is on under floor heating suppliers for specification, but NOT to buy from.

 

Biggles

[pamaloon]

I'm thinking Biggles means Kingspan/Celotex or similar, as you'd do in the garage conversion, for example...

 

£10ish a sheet in 1" thicknesses, foil coated, from any good builders' merchant.

 

 

'eee, thah's a good 'un young catchpole! Thanks for that,

 

PC

 

Kingspan yes, not sure about Cellotex its kinda soft, I certainly wouldn't use it on a floor with 10mm laminate straight on top. Bear in mind there are different densities of foam. Make sure its good for floors. Good place to look is on under floor heating suppliers for specification, but NOT to buy from.

 

Biggles

 

Cheers for that Biggles. Appreciated.

Pam

[smileypete]

Thanks Pete but.........er, exactly which bit that has "worked over the last 40 years"?!

Not having any bitumastic gunk or plastic sheeting.

 

cheers,

Pete.

[WotEver]

Not having any bitumastic gunk or plastic sheeting.

Ahh, but hasn't that resulted in the need for a new floor?

 

We're getting circular here...

 

Tony

[pamaloon]

Ahh, but hasn't that resulted in the need for a new floor?

 

We're getting circular here...

 

Tony

 

Thank goodness for that, Tony! My mind was beginning to get decidedly giddy!

Pam

[smileypete]

Thank goodness for that, Tony! My mind was beginning to get decidedly giddy!

Pam

What was wrong with the original wooden floor then, was it rotten?

 

cheers,

Pete.

[pamaloon]

What was wrong with the original wooden floor then, was it rotten?

 

cheers,

Pete.

 

Mmm - answer? Not a floor as such that anyone would recognize - a wibbly-wobbly "topping" of cracked and seemingly baked v. thin laminate - or occasional bits of carpetting - on top of very uneven, not-made-to-fit flooring panels of something like wet sterling board or soggy Weetabix etc etc., the list goes on.... Oh, and a few pieces of boarding that had a dpm on one side but none of them sat correctly and they were laid unevenly - all this on top of the cement flooring/ballast. I am happy enough dealing with cement ballast and, once I've "skimmed" it and made it all level then I can get going on a decent dpm etc etc. She's drying out really well, now that nearly all the soggy Weetabix has been removed right up to wall level.

 

She must sound awful to all of you but she's such a pretty vessel and the hull is totally sound and with a nice sounding, smooth-running engine etc. I feel she's a really strong candidate for a proper restoration. Yup, it'll take time but surely anything like this'd be worth it. Ooops, where's the amber nectar?!

 

Thanks Pete. After writing all that, I feel heaps better!

Pam

[RLWP]

Mmm - answer? Not a floor as such that anyone would recognize - a wibbly-wobbly "topping" of cracked and seemingly baked v. thin laminate - or occasional bits of carpetting - on top of very uneven, not-made-to-fit flooring panels of something like wet sterling board or soggy Weetabix etc etc., the list goes on.... Oh, and a few pieces of boarding that had a dpm on one side but none of them sat correctly and they were laid unevenly - all this on top of the cement flooring/ballast. I am happy enough dealing with cement ballast and, once I've "skimmed" it and made it all level then I can get going on a decent dpm etc etc. She's drying out really well, now that nearly all the soggy Weetabix has been removed right up to wall level.

 

She must sound awful to all of you but she's such a pretty vessel and the hull is totally sound and with a nice sounding, smooth-running engine etc. I feel she's a really strong candidate for a proper restoration. Yup, it'll take time but surely anything like this'd be worth it. Ooops, where's the amber nectar?!

 

Thanks Pete. After writing all that, I feel heaps better!

Pam

 

Do you know why the "weetabix" flooring was soggy?

 

Richard

[WotEver]

Do you know why the "weetabix" flooring was soggy?

I’m going to stick my neck out here and guess it’s because it got damp…

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:::coat:::

[RLWP]

I’m going to stick my neck out here and guess it’s because it got damp…

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:::coat:::

 

Well I thought that it was because it came into contact with water, but I see you're thinking along the same lines. Like, where did the water come from and is it going to come back and wreck the new flooring...

 

Richard

[nb Innisfree]

Well I thought that it was because it came into contact with water, but I see you're thinking along the same lines. Like, where did the water come from and is it going to come back and wreck the new flooring...

 

Richard

 

Water tank emptying through leak could happen and without a decent underfloor space would soon ruin it. New flooring needs to be material that will withstand possible future occurrence.

[smileypete]

Mmm - answer? Not a floor as such that anyone would recognize - a wibbly-wobbly "topping" of cracked and seemingly baked v. thin laminate - or occasional bits of carpetting - on top of very uneven, not-made-to-fit flooring panels of something like wet sterling board or soggy Weetabix etc etc., the list goes on.... Oh, and a few pieces of boarding that had a dpm on one side but none of them sat correctly and they were laid unevenly - all this on top of the cement flooring/ballast. I am happy enough dealing with cement ballast and, once I've "skimmed" it and made it all level then I can get going on a decent dpm etc etc. She's drying out really well, now that nearly all the soggy Weetabix has been removed right up to wall level.

Fair enough. If the concrete really must be coated I'd use garage floor paint.

 

Paul's suggestion of treated tile batten to level and ply on top sounds good, the air gap will help cut down on heat loss.

 

One of my neighbours used sanded down brand new scaffolding planks in her widebeam, they came up quite nice!

 

I'd also 'back prime' (clicky) any hidden wood surfaces, will help stop it absorbing water and rotting if there are any leaks, condensation etc.

 

cheers,

Pete.