Another boat buillder gone bust ?

[Lesd]

I've been trying to reach our boat builder for a while without success and decided just to check on companies house web site, it states they are in liquidation as of late Dec. They still have an answer phone message on their number and the web site is still running. They build us a nice boat and some great people worked there, its a damm shame.

 

Les

[greywolf]

I've been trying to reach our boat builder for a while without success and decided just to check on companies house web site, it states they are in liquidation as of late Dec. They still have an answer phone message on their number and the web site is still running. They build us a nice boat and some great people worked there, its a damm shame.

 

Les

I fear it is one of many, both in the canal world and wider world.Good companies and bad.Recession takes no prisoners.

[Naughty Cal]

As i said before the narrowboat builders seem to be bearing the brunt of this. The GRP manufacturers seem to be holding out a little better.

[carlt]

Fairline laid of nearly 400 of their workforce, late last year.

 

Ferretti is hanging on by a thread.

 

Broom is reducing production, drastically, this year.

 

Princess is introducing a short working week.

 

Sealine has closed two of its sites and laid off half of its work force.

 

Sunseeker seem to be doing ok, for the moment.

 

Are there any more, big, stinker builders?

Edited February 11, 2009 by carlt

[WJM]

"Good companies and bad.Recession takes no prisoners."

 

 

Rubbish - good companies, by definition, do not go bust.

 

Anthony Worrall-Thompson bleating that the banks would not lend him £250k to prop up his failing business! Any one else fancy propping up a fool? If the market changes around you it is incumbent on you to reposition yourself. I was in Pizza Express last night and it was packed. Sell Pizza Anthony! And if nobody wants narrowboats start making something else.

[Naughty Cal]

Fairline laid of nearly 400 of their workforce, late last year.

 

Ferretti is hanging on by a thread.

 

Broom is reducing production, drastically, this year.

 

Princess is introducing a short working week.

 

Sealine has closed two of its sites and laid off half of its work force.

 

Sunseeker seem to be doing ok, for the moment.

 

Are there any more, big, stinker builders?

 

However they have yet to call in the administrators. Culling staff to cut costs is part of making a business survive. I know ive been up for redundancy twice in the last year and have survived both times. Now business is looking up and the cost cutting staff wise is paying dividends.

 

Im sure many of the big GRP builders are doing the same much the same as the big car manufacturers are doing.

[alan_fincher]

I was in Pizza Express last night and it was packed.

 

MFI used to regularly be packed, too!

[WJM]

Agreed -a downsizing is not failure. It is proactive reaction to a changing market, potentially a sign of good management.

[carlt]

However they have yet to call in the administrators. Culling staff to cut costs is part of making a business survive. I know ive been up for redundancy twice in the last year and have survived both times. Now business is looking up and the cost cutting staff wise is paying dividends.

 

Im sure many of the big GRP builders are doing the same much the same as the big car manufacturers are doing.

We'll see, won't we.

 

Plastic boats are mass produced by big companies, so they can survive, for longer, by implementing cuts.

 

Sealine closing two of it's factories and making nearly 300 people redundant is the equivalent of ten or more "one man and his dog" narrowboat builders closing their doors.

[Naughty Cal]

We'll see, won't we.

 

Plastic boats are mass produced by big companies, so they can survive, for longer, by implementing cuts.

 

Sealine closing two of it's factories and making nearly 300 people redundant is the equivalent of ten or more "one man and his dog" narrowboat builders closing their doors.

 

How do you figure that? They are still in production and bringing out new models.

 

Its all about survival

[Proper Job]

The GRP boys are usually 'mass producers' and have fairly large workforces.

 

NB builders (with a couple of exceptions) are relitively low volume producers and only employ a small workforce. There arn't that many people they can lay off as they have a very small critical mass when it comes to their workforce.

[carlt]

How do you figure that? They are still in production and bringing out new models.

 

Its all about survival

Tell that to the 300 workers, now signing on.

 

There are an equivalent lower number of boats being produced, and an equivalent fewer people producing them. The narrowboat industry is just made up of lots of smaller firms, rather than 4 big ones.

[WJM]

"Plastic boats are mass produced by big companies, so they can survive,"

 

 

 

More rubbish.

 

I have a friend who makes exquisite hand crafted racing canoes from vacuum carbon kevlar epoxy, real specialist bespoke stuff. I think he employs three. But he also bashes out GRP bus seats, engine housings and the rear ends of hearses. He is very proud of his racing canoes, but not so proud that he is going to hang his entire business on one market. The size of a company means nothing in terms of its ability to survive, if anything, a big size works against survival.

[Naughty Cal]

Tell that to the 300 workers, now signing on.

 

There are an equivalent lower number of boats being produced, and an equivalent fewer people producing them. The narrowboat industry is just made up of lots of smaller firms, rather than 4 big ones.

 

There are far more than 4 GRP builders.

 

People are being laid of in all sectors of employment. Boat building is no different to any other sector. In fact as boats are more often than not a luxury item they may well fair worse than other markets.

 

GRP boats get many folks into boating, we may well yet see people downizing into "affordable" boating in a bid to keep boating during the current economic climate.

[carlt]

"Plastic boats are mass produced by big companies, so they can survive,"

 

 

 

More rubbish.

 

I have a friend who makes exquisite hand crafted racing canoes from vacuum carbon kevlar epoxy, real specialist bespoke stuff. I think he employs three. But he also bashes out GRP bus seats, engine housings and the rear ends of hearses. He is very proud of his racing canoes, but not so proud that he is going to hang his entire business on one market. The size of a company means nothing in terms of its ability to survive, if anything, a big size works against survival.

I was referring to the motor boat market, not canoes (which I have no experience in).

 

The vast majority of plastic cruisers, equivalent to narrowboats, are produced by the big four builders.

[Naughty Cal]

I was referring to the motor boat market, not canoes (which I have no experience in).

 

The vast majority of plastic cruisers, equivalent to narrowboats, are produced by the big four builders.

 

So who are your big four?

[carlt]

Maybe you should read what the stinker boys are talking about, on their forum, before you come and tell us all is rosy, in the motor boat world:

 

Clicky

[Naughty Cal]

Maybe you should read what the stinker boys are talking about, on their forum, before you come and tell us all is rosy, in the motor boat world:

 

Clicky

 

Whos your big four?

 

EDITED TO ADD:

 

There isnt a sector in the UK economy that can claim to be trouble free. The issue was the amount of narrowboat builders going under. The GRP group has yet to witness a closure.

Edited February 11, 2009 by Phylis

[WJM]

"I was referring to the motor boat market,"

 

I was referring to business in general and suggesting that bad businesses go bust and good ones survive. If I were a boat builder who was finding it tough I would use a combination of downsizing and repositioning to survive. To a narrowboat builder that might mean making storage tanks, footbridges, roof joists - I wouldn't sit around bleating about a recession and waiting for it all to cave in around me. That principal applies to all businesses.

[carlt]

So who are your big four?

Sealine, Sunseeker, Fairline and Princess. Not mine, though.

 

The GRP group has yet to witness a closure.

 

Select Yachts

[Naughty Cal]

Sealine, Sunseeker, Fairline and Princess. Not mine, though.

 

So what about the other builders like, Viking, Shetland, Birchwood, Westwood, Alpha craft, all the small builders on the broads such as Falcon and the likes as well as the non UK builders like, Bayliner, Sea Ray, Bavaria, Rinker,

 

I think the point here is that there are many builders of GRP boats much like there are many builders of narrowboats. The difference being that the GRP builders are weathering the storm better.

[greywolf]

"Good companies and bad.Recession takes no prisoners."

 

 

Rubbish - good companies, by definition, do not go bust.

 

Anthony Worrall-Thompson bleating that the banks would not lend him £250k to prop up his failing business! Any one else fancy propping up a fool? If the market changes around you it is incumbent on you to reposition yourself. I was in Pizza Express last night and it was packed. Sell Pizza Anthony! And if nobody wants narrowboats start making something else.

I agree about worrall thompson in that he did say that he very wisely refused to risk his house to refinance,and he could probably have got the money by doing another appearance on a cooking program.I do not however agree that changing a business is viable either if you are already just keeping your head above water,you are self evidently short of capital. Good companies do go bust in a ressesion the bank just has to refuse you a credit line when you need one.

[Naughty Cal]

I agree about worrall thompson in that he did say that he very wisely refused to risk his house to refinance,and he could probably have got the money by doing another appearance on a cooking program.I do not however agree that changing a business is viable either if you are already just keeping your head above water,you are self evidently short of capital. Good companies do go bust in a ressesion the bank just has to refuse you a credit line when you need one.

 

So you wouldnt consider cutting staff costs to save a business?

[grahoom]

So you wouldnt consider cutting staff costs to save a business?

 

Hows the Civil Engineering business going? plenty of spare time

[Naughty Cal]

Hows the Civil Engineering business going? plenty of spare time

 

Pretty crap, however the misfortune of other companies is playing into our hands. As i said before survival of the fittest. We are now in a far better position to ride out the next year or so. Fingers crossed things are looking up.