Company In Administration

[Dylan]

I agree with Snibble. If SVBC did not have title to them, they cannot "sell" them to you. Further, I wouldn't do a deal with the window guy as it might be construed (legally) that, in reality, you did not believe they were really your window frames. Even a signed "contract" with the window guy stating "full and final payment" can be held to be void as there is no legal "consideration" for him.

 

Chris

I agree largely. I would tread carefully there.

[cotswoldsman]

I agree with Snibble. If SVBC did not have title to them, they cannot "sell" them to you. Further, I wouldn't do a deal with the window guy as it might be construed (legally) that, in reality, you did not believe they were really your window frames. Even a signed "contract" with the window guy stating "full and final payment" can be held to be void as there is no legal "consideration" for him.

 

Chris

 

Firstly I would like to say that I have followed this thread since it started and Pav I am pleased that that you have light at the end of the tunnel.

I would advise that you visit a solicitor and one that deals in company. The window frames belonged to SVBC unless the invoice from the suplier clearly stated clearly that the goods remained his property until paid for and I doubt that his invoice stated that. As soon as he delivered the goods the ownership changed, the fact that he decided to give SVBC credit on those goods has nothing to do with ownership of goods. As far as paying him something towards the cost my advise would be no but if he is able to suply any other material you require then maybe you could make him your first choice. Pav is correct as soon as he enters your boat without your permision he is breaking the law. Pav if I was you I would get a letter from the receiver stating that the boat has been released to you and free of debt.

[Rob@BSSOffice]

I need to find out from Tom Keeling, the surveyor, how I stand regarding the boats certification or whatever other documents etc. are required and how we go about getting them.

 

Pav.

 

It is also important that you get an Annex 3a RCD declaration from the administrators. This will enable your boat to be licenced for a year, if necessary and will help with the full CE marking process, manual production and Annex 15 RCD Declaration of Conformity.

 

The full Annex 15 DoC will be recognised by BW, EA, LANT/UANT etc for licensing purposes for the first four years from its date. After that you will need a BSS certificate.

 

You are now at the best stage to decide whether or not to go down the CE marking route. Starting now to go down the CE marking route will be easier than deciding to do this some time down the line as you can log the build as you go along and create the boat's technical file.

 

You don't have to do this, but without meeting the conditions of the RCD and CE Marking, you cannot sell the boat legally within five years. As the course of life can take unexpected turns, you may want to have the ability to sell, even if it is not your wish or foreseeable intention.

 

Chris and Blackrose have fairly well described the choices and decisions in this thread recently.

 

We also have a download on our website here self-builds and sailaways

 

May the following winds be kindly ones.

 

Regards

Rob@BSS Office

[mick1964]

I posted on here last June that I had concerns with this company (see my previous posts if you are interested) , although I didn't mention them by name as we were concerned about libelling them. We were told at the last Crick Show that there were problems with them paying suppliers. This will not be the last boat builder to go under in this coming recession. Buying a new boat is a minefield. I have decided to go for a newish secondhand boat instead - its less risky.

 

Micky

[RichardH]

It is sad when this happens for everyone involved, the customers and the employees of the firm going under.

 

We saw this company at the Preston Brook National and if we'd had a spare 65k lying around we'd have signed up there and then as we were so impressed with the boat and for us it stole the show.

[stickleback]

I was also very impressed with what I saw at SVBC and was almost decided to put in an order when I saw a boat for sale at Barnton; a Ken Martin shell fitted out by narrow Boat Services of Barnton Wharf - £57K. Bought it and am so glad now I made that decision. I think he only does about 2 a year.

 

Pav, I hope things are gradually coming together - best of luck with it all.

 

Stickleback

[bridgit]

Just wanted to add my congratuations on your securing your boat. I know theres a long way to go and my thoughts are with you both.

[WJM]

"The window frames belonged to SVBC unless the invoice from the suplier clearly stated clearly that the goods remained his property until paid for and I doubt that his invoice stated that."

 

 

 

Most businesses trade this way ie; title passes ON PAYMENT not on delivery. It is very likely they still belong to the supplier. He could repossess them, but since they are largely bespoke and as such have no significant resale value it is probably not worth his while. Legally you would not have a leg to stand on, but in practice you will probably get away with keeping them. Just add an extra layer to the complexity of repossession by making it difficult for him to actually locate them.

 

 

 

There are a lot of 'Pub Pundit' misconceptions about business and legality thrown about on this forum. Just because you believe something should work in a certain way does not mean that it does!

[tony collins]

Most businesses trade this way ie; title passes ON PAYMENT not on delivery. It is very likely they still belong to the supplier.

 

I agree with this, you will probaly find in the feint small print on the back of the invoice that title remains with the supplier until payment is made.

 

Tony

[AMModels]

I used to work in the steel trade and a few times we had customers go under we'd send some of the guys round to bring our stock back because it hadnt been payed for so was still ours, the clause stated above of itle not transferring until full payment was made being the pertinent point.

[Capey]

I have only been living aboard for about 14 months, having had both good and bad experiences with fellow boaters, but this thread has almost restored my faith in people. You guys are all amazing, and good on ya Pav.

[bimbler]

Don't order a matress yet Pav, I had a pocket sprung split one made in December 2007 for the Xbed on NB Bimble and then found it too big. It has been slept on three times and is very comfortable. Happy to let you see it if you are interested. Are moored just opposite you, at least, where you were on Sunday! Let us know if you want to have a look and we'll arrange to meet.

[Scotty]

Don't order a matress yet Pav........ moored just opposite you

Blimey, Pav's luck certainly seems to be improving !

[woolies]

Heard today that Liverpool Boats have laid off their staff. Anybody able to confirm this?

Was told by a sales rep today Liverpool boats are downsizing their work force due to lack of orders

It does not mean there going out business, it’s just down to the Recession.......mark

Edited January 31, 2008 by woolies

[Pav]

Don't order a matress yet Pav, I had a pocket sprung split one made in December 2007 for the Xbed on NB Bimble and then found it too big. It has been slept on three times and is very comfortable. Happy to let you see it if you are interested. Are moored just opposite you, at least, where you were on Sunday! Let us know if you want to have a look and we'll arrange to meet.

 

Hi Bimbler,

 

Thanks for that info'. That's a shame that it turned out too big for Bimble.

 

We are looking for a 4'6''x 4'0'' and 4'6''x2'0'

 

I know 'Bimble', have seen her moored up, but have never seen you about.

 

Would certainly appreciate looking at, and talking about your mattress.

 

Will PM you to arrange.

 

Cheers Bimbler.

Regards,

Pav.

[Neildudman]

Was told by a sales rep today Liverpool boats are downsizing their work force due to lack of orders

It does not mean there going out business, it’s just down to the recession.......mark

 

What Recession?

[Ray]

Was told by a sales rep today Liverpool boats are downsizing their work force due to lack of orders

It does not mean there going out business, it’s just down to the recession.......mark

 

Maybe not so much the recession, more the increased charges for moorings and licences! Perhaps it will backfire on BW after all. But sorry for all the workers who are affected by the job loses and apologies for moving slightly off topic.

 

Glad to hear Pav's getting things sorted.

Edited January 30, 2008 by Ray

[saltysplash]

nice one pav

 

really pleased for you

[WJM]

"Maybe not so much the recession, more the increased charges for moorings and licences! Perhaps it will backfire on BW after all. "

 

 

Or maybe it is a much simpler economic phenomenon called market saturation and oversupply. The number of new boats coming onto the system in recent years was unsustainable.

[Timleech]

"Maybe not so much the recession, more the increased charges for moorings and licences! Perhaps it will backfire on BW after all. "

Or maybe it is a much simpler economic phenomenon called market saturation and oversupply. The number of new boats coming onto the system in recent years was unsustainable.

 

I think LB have been particularly hit by the imported boats, which are targeting the same part of the market.

I'd heard some months ago that they were cutting back (halving?) their workforce, I assumed the 'rumours' mentioned on here were of something else.

 

Tim

[Jason Wilson and Family]

Glad to see things have taken a bit of an upwards turn for you. I can't imagine the stress you're under.

 

Regarding the ownership of the window frames (and anything else that comes up), are you going to be able to get your money back from the builders? Contract and all aside, you've paid, it's the middle-man everyone has trouble with. I know you want to make sure the suppliers are paid, it'd be nice for you if you could avoid paying twice.

[colin loach]

I posted on here last June that I had concerns with this company (see my previous posts if you are interested) , although I didn't mention them by name as we were concerned about libelling them. We were told at the last Crick Show that there were problems with them paying suppliers. This will not be the last boat builder to go under in this coming recession. Buying a new boat is a minefield. I have decided to go for a newish secondhand boat instead - its less risky.

 

Micky

i hope liverpool boats are not going the same way i am waiting for mine to be finished. they did have about six boats in production on my last visit. colin.

[Stourbridgeguy]

Was speaking to a guy who works by SVC and he said that Black Prince had shown an interest in the site, dont know how true it is.

[Travis]

Hmm, Black Prince? Wasn't that started by a guy called Rimmer all those years ago?

[Billy the Bargee]

I have read this post with interest, and Infact a few online forums are discussing the downfall of SVBC and the way it has effected the customers.

 

I do recall some years ago a company based in Lincolnshire (I am trying to search for the name) went bust with 5 customers who had paid deposits and although the £'s were not so great (boats were only £50k then for a 57ft'er) it was still very worrying.

Anyway this company had "been on the slip" for a long time and the then General/sales manager resigned from the company and "Started his own boat building Co" called Pheenix Boats. When the company went down with the shells on site and nearly all of the at a degree of fitment, rockwooled/engines fitted etc the old manager contacted all these people and offered to finish the builds for them at a reasonable price.

 

It transpired that the manager had set up an "Echo" company and the main company had just gone belly up to capitalise on the goodwill and trust of the customers. So the owner of the original company had gone down, about 9 months before in colusion with the manager set up another firm to basically mop up all the business and rip them off. This was only found out by accident by a customer who returned to the "new" yard at about 6pm after leaving his cheque book on the boat that was in build and spotted the former boat builder having a cuppa with the "Ex manager"

 

I will endevour to locate the company details but in cases like this it can be a very messy and confusing time and when large sums of money are involved people do very unorthodox and unscruppulus things.

 

And I do believe that this is not the first time that SVBC has gone down it I think it's the 3rd.

 

Bill Tages

Edited February 2, 2008 by Billy the Bargee