Rob Clarke Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Hi I know nothing about engines, engineering, gearboxes and the like. My sincere apologies. I have a narrowboat with, I'm told, a Lister LH150 Hydraulic Reverse gearbox. Having made it through the Standedge Tunnel, it started to cut out when I put it into reverse. Initially it would restart and move into reverse okay, but it became progressively worse on the downhill stretch to Huddersfield, and since getting to Mirfield I was unable to get it into Reverse at all, it's permanently stuck in forward gear. I've got it down to a wharf in Wakefield and they've checked it over, but it's nothing particularly obvious (adjustment etc) so I need advice from an expert - is it fixable? Am I looking at getting it taken off and sent away somewhere? New gearbox time? Help! Thanks Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayalld Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Hi I know nothing about engines, engineering, gearboxes and the like. My sincere apologies. I have a narrowboat with, I'm told, a Lister LH150 Hydraulic Reverse gearbox. Having made it through the Standedge Tunnel, it started to cut out when I put it into reverse. Initially it would restart and move into reverse okay, but it became progressively worse on the downhill stretch to Huddersfield, and since getting to Mirfield I was unable to get it into Reverse at all, it's permanently stuck in forward gear. I've got it down to a wharf in Wakefield and they've checked it over, but it's nothing particularly obvious (adjustment etc) so I need advice from an expert - is it fixable? Am I looking at getting it taken off and sent away somewhere? New gearbox time? Help! Thanks Rob Have you topped the oil up? The LH150 has 2 separate boxes (the reversing box and the reduction box) That means 2 dipsticks and 2 fillers. Check the oil level in the rectangular reversing box and top up if required with EP80/90 LH150s are designed to fail into forward gear if they run short of oil. If it isn't the oil, then adjustment isn't too difficult. It means taking the cover of the reversing box, which sounds scary, but isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizzard Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Hi I know nothing about engines, engineering, gearboxes and the like. My sincere apologies. I have a narrowboat with, I'm told, a Lister LH150 Hydraulic Reverse gearbox. Having made it through the Standedge Tunnel, it started to cut out when I put it into reverse. Initially it would restart and move into reverse okay, but it became progressively worse on the downhill stretch to Huddersfield, and since getting to Mirfield I was unable to get it into Reverse at all, it's permanently stuck in forward gear. I've got it down to a wharf in Wakefield and they've checked it over, but it's nothing particularly obvious (adjustment etc) so I need advice from an expert - is it fixable? Am I looking at getting it taken off and sent away somewhere? New gearbox time? Help! Thanks Rob Sounds like either the forward gear cone clutch has jambed in its mating cone housing or the hydraulic pressure which works a slave cylinder that withdraws the cone to enable neutral and reverse to be engaged has ebbed away. Is there oil in the box? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Yes, it is fixable - parts are available Do the oil check first though. The dipstick is on the left hand side, towards the front of the gearbox Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizzard Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 (edited) Sounds like either the forward gear cone clutch has jambed in its mating cone housing or the hydraulic pressure which works a slave cylinder that withdraws the cone to enable neutral and reverse to be engaged has ebbed away. Is there oil in the box? You can check the adjustments but I doubt if they will be causing that problem. If the forward gear adjusting bolt has run out of free play then the clutch cones would be beginning to disengage and to slip like a cars clutch when driving forwards and would disengage allowing neutral and astern gears to be had. If the adjustment bolts locknut has come undone and the bolt screwed itself right in ''highly unlikely'' and so making enough free play that its hydraulic slave cylinder piston runs out of travel and hits its circlip stop then it would remain engaged in forward gear. A quick way of checking the hydraulic pressure at the slave cylinder is to slacken off the three slave cylinder bolts located on the back of the gearbox case by about 4 full turns, start up and try to put it into neutral or reverse, if there's hydraulic pressure the slave cylinder body will be forced out to the bolt heads leaving a gap, none or only a little oil should leak or squirt out because of internal ''o''rings around its body. I should think that the reverse gear brake band and adjustment is ok. But check oil first of all as Mayalld suggests. Edited October 4, 2015 by bizzard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Brooks Posted October 5, 2015 Report Share Posted October 5, 2015 I am with BIzzard and Myalid on this one. Check the oil level (most likely) and then by all means check the ahead clutch adjustment but I doubt that's the problem. If you have a riveted friction lining on the cone then when it wears out the rivets can wear grooves in the female half of the clutch. This causes it to jamb. If you have the top off locate the three bolts BIzzard was on about and remove the single bolt in the middle of them. The screw one of the bolts that held the cover onto the box back in the hole. It should push the ahead (Neutral) piston out and disengage the cone clutch. These boxes are built like the brick built wottsit so are best repaired, not changed for some other type of box. Care is needed when removing the box and many, many times greater care when replacing it to ensure the oil pump and its drive gear do not get damaged/bent. I understand those pumps are expensive. If you end up paying for someone to sort it out make sure they are very familiar with the box. I would suggest Richard if he travels that far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FORTUNATA Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Hi I know nothing about engines, engineering, gearboxes and the like. My sincere apologies. I have a narrowboat with, I'm told, a Lister LH150 Hydraulic Reverse gearbox. Having made it through the Standedge Tunnel, it started to cut out when I put it into reverse. Initially it would restart and move into reverse okay, but it became progressively worse on the downhill stretch to Huddersfield, and since getting to Mirfield I was unable to get it into Reverse at all, it's permanently stuck in forward gear. I've got it down to a wharf in Wakefield and they've checked it over, but it's nothing particularly obvious (adjustment etc) so I need advice from an expert - is it fixable? Am I looking at getting it taken off and sent away somewhere? New gearbox time? Help! Thanks Rob Bear in mind the overall condition of the engine is also a factor. I've had my SR2 cut out in reverse before and sometimes they get too hot. It's a good idea to check the cooling fins in the engine because if they're clogged, your engine will get too hot. Likewise you need lots of cool air through the air ducts. I'd be inclined to check for clogging around the air guard and clean out the cooling fins with a rake as required. If it still cuts out then you can go more in depth and just follow Tony's and Richard's advice above if the gearbox is sticking. Yes, it's one of those hardy planetary gearbox systems with a clutch and cone assembly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadsteam Posted October 14, 2015 Report Share Posted October 14, 2015 When checking the oil level make sure that the reverse box dipstick is the shorter of the two. I had an LH150 that would not come out of forward and investigation showed that both boxes had dipsticks for the reduction box, result that even on the high mark the oil pump was sucking air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted October 14, 2015 Report Share Posted October 14, 2015 When checking the oil level make sure that the reverse box dipstick is the shorter of the two. I had an LH150 that would not come out of forward and investigation showed that both boxes had dipsticks for the reduction box, result that even on the high mark the oil pump was sucking air. That is a particularly annoying and irritating problem. Easy to fix though Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) ### Note, earlier posts from this thread are from a previous time ### My Dad's SL2 engine is now stuck in gear. Stopped after a chug today and it won't come out of forward. He has looked at it and the gear selector shaft has sheared off.. Not sure where he'll be able to source a replacement. He has been in touch with Maestermyn as he's only a mile from them, where he's moored. They don't have one but are trying their suppliers.. Casp' Edited January 22, 2016 by DHutch Note added that thread has been revived from Oct 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 That explains the 'phone call we got earlier Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 That explains the 'phone call we got earlier Richard Are you one of their suppliers? My Dad hasn't heard back from them yet. Casp' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 Yes. We need to know the diameter of the thread on the roller. There are two different ones Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 Yes. We need to know the diameter of the thread on the roller. There are two different ones Richard Ah, good. At least he's being looked after. He's going to bumble down a couple of locks tomorrow as he's booked passage, luckily with an SL2 he can be in tickover and it has almost no power! Then he's mooring up for a while, so obviously he hopes to get it sorted before he then sets off again. Casp' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Tawny Owl Posted January 22, 2016 Report Share Posted January 22, 2016 I enquired about a new part, they are still available at £169.57 plus VAT However a good used one has been found and will be on it's way later this afternoon. Glad to help out. Sue 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 (edited) I enquired about a new part, they are still available at £169.57 plus VAT However a good used one has been found and will be on it's way later this afternoon. Glad to help out. Sue That is quite a lot for a 2 inch part.. There must be loads of these boxes lying around after all the engine upgrades. I found a chap selling a new part for £82, but we couldn't tell if it was right, so we'll wait for Maestermyn to sort it.. Thanks for the help About a year ago he was offered a fully working SL2 with gearbox for £600, I said he should buy it and store it away, but he didn't... Bet he wishes he had now.. Casp' Edited January 24, 2016 by casper ghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 New, second hand part has been fitted, but it's still the same! stuck in forward.. When you push gear lever, as though you were putting it into reverse, it slowly stalls the engine.. Mechanic is there looking at it.. Casp' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Brooks Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 Low oil pressure. The LH 150 will stick in ahead with no/low oil pressure its supposed to for get you home purposes. I have had ahead cone clutches jambing in mesh when rivets wear grooves in the steel face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 It's an LH100 manual box, don't know if that makes any difference.. I just used this thread to ask about it.. Casp' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Brooks Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 It's an LH100 manual box, don't know if that makes any difference.. I just used this thread to ask about it.. Casp' I had to take my wife somewhere and realised that the talk of rollers made no sense in relation to a LH150 so despite the topic title this was likely to be a L100. I am sure its not an LH100 because as I understand it the H stands for hydraulic. (could be wrong on that though). So it will have nothing to do with oil pressure. Looking at a not very comprehensive diagram in a manual it looks as if the ahead clutch is pulled out of mesh by a lever on the main operating arm that is part of the cross shaft. I can not see how this is connects the the ahead clutch but parts look remarkably similar to the LH150 ahead setup. Going by that I suspect there is a circlip that holds the ahead clutch cone into the operating mechanism and if this falls off the box stays in ahead and locks up when it is put into astern. I think that if you take the top off the box and look down at the output shaft towards the back the box you will see a drum with springs in it. The springs push against the mechanism that holds the ahead clutch. f you move the lever in and out of ahead you should see the springs get compressed as the cone is pulled back. I suspect you will see the lever dropping down to the shaft area move and the links on it move but I doubt you will see the actual cone clutch pull out of the female cone. Happy for the real Lister gearbox experts to put me right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 It's an adjustment issue Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 It's an adjustment issue Richard I knew you'd know.. Mechanic has fiddled with adjustment and it's now all working.. He had to leave but he's popping back tomorrow to fine tune it as he's not entirely happy with the set-up yet, but it looks like it is sorted, and it has hardly affected their holiday as they always planned to stay put until tomorrow, they're just staying put 1 more day. Casp' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 I knew because I spoke to him Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper ghost Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 I knew because I spoke to him Richard That's cheating, unless he phoned you to ask... Casp' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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