BMC 1.5 No Drive!

[Rob1234]

Maybe water in the system has corroded the pump?

Edited March 22, 2015 by Rob1234

[Tony Brooks]

I am in no way trying to gainsay Richard because he has taken the things apart (my experience is on much older boxes) but for the sake of a few moments please try it again with a gear selected. The pump will be working against zero load in neutral so it might (or might not) dump pump output straight back into the body of the box when in neutral. Also try giving it a gentle rev.

[RLWP]

Yes, the pump can be repaired

Tony, I'm hazy on the oil circuit too. I'll look it up later, I am reasonably sure that oil always passes through the cooler when the engine is running. It would be better if I was certain

Richard

 

MORE: This is the manual for a PRM100: http://www.prm-newage.com/media/File/100%20&%20175%20&%20250%20man.pdf

 

Oil circuit is on page 10. I read that as oil always passes through the cooler - is that what you see Tony (just to be sure)

Edited March 22, 2015 by RLWP

[Tony Brooks]

Certainly looks as if it does.

[Rob1234]

On further inspection i have found a bearing that has broken up! Looking for replacement options at the moment!

[Rob1234]

Prm 260 £1400 or rebuild 150 d2 £900!

[RLWP]

PM sent

 

Richard

[Alan de Enfield]

Prm 260 £1400 or rebuild 150 d2 £900!

 

Is this the one you found ?

 

http://www.calcuttboats.com/gearbox.html

Edited March 22, 2015 by Alan de Enfield

[Rob1234]

Yes, i popped into calcut. Very helpful, however out of my price range!

[Rob1234]

Gearbox is off, suspended by straps! Just waiting for my lad to come home from work to help lift it out....like you said Richard its heavy!

[Alan de Enfield]

How about a complete Lister Canalstar engine AND gearbox for £850.

 

Take out your engine, sell it for £850 and you have a free gearbox, or, (don't know if it will work) remove gearbox from Canalstar and fit it to you engine.

 

Various ways to flagellate a pig !!!!

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Marine-diesel-narrow-boat-engine-house-fishing-liveaboard-/271812236762?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f494595da

[Alan de Enfield]

Or :

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hurth-boat-gear-box-wil-fit-1-5-bmc-/261818316463?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3cf59676af

 

Hurth boat gear box wil fit 1.5 bmc

[Rob1234]

 

How about a complete Lister Canalstar engine AND gearbox for £850.

Thanks for the links, its being looked at with regards to a repair at the moment..... see how that pans out first!

[gazza]

Or :

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hurth-boat-gear-box-wil-fit-1-5-bmc-/261818316463?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3cf59676af

 

Hurth boat gear box wil fit 1.5 bmc

That looks like a hbw50 - if it is it will be too small for a BMC 1.5, despite what the listing or previous owner may think.

 

They are only just man enough for a d722 Kubota at 18 odd HP.

[RLWP]

That looks like a hbw50 - if it is it will be too small for a BMC 1.5, despite what the listing or previous owner may think.

 

They are only just man enough for a d722 Kubota at 18 odd HP.

 

To be fair, it will fit a BMC 1.5, notice the adaption to the flywheel housing to make a tiny gearbox fit

 

Otherwise, that doesn't look like a good plan. I wonder if it would jam the cone clutches in gear

 

Richard

[gazza]

As you say it may well fit, but it's an odd choice when there are better suited readily available boxes.

 

I had to rebuild the 50 on my brothers boat. Its a neat mechanical box that unfairly gets a slagging - more often than not because it is being used in the wrong application.

 

I would go for a rebuild of your current box if financially viable or another PRM to avoid problems with drive and adaptor plates, not to mention mounts and re plumbing your cooling arrangements.

[Rob1234]

Gearbox all fixed, many thanks for the proffessional service from Primrose Engineering! Thanks for all the help and advice Richard, also I forgot to say thanks for replacing the rusty dipstick!!! The little things make all the difference!!!

 

Here are a few pics of Warspite in her formal glory!

 

And how she looks today.....

[RLWP]

I have some pictures of the problem that I'll post up. Basically, the pump spindle had worn out.

 

This is the pump drive spindle in the pump:

 

 

It should have a flat blade, this one has lost its ears!

 

Here is the spindle in the gear wheel:

 

 

The pump parts are not available separately, just a complete pump: http://www.asap-supplies.com/marine/prm-260-parts-for-oil-pump-assembly/prm-mt0296-oil-pump-assembly

 

I checked the parts through - there are two things that matter, the teeth on the gears and the state of the casing. In this case, the casing was fine, the gear teeth were a bit worn:

 

 

Now, these pumps only ever rotate in one direction, so only one face of each tooth wears. So, if you can turn them around, you get a good face to work with:

 

 

The upper teeth still show the manufacturing marks. (Turning wheels around is an old clock repairers trick - clocks only go one way round too)

 

As we had a set of gear wheels and a casing in good order, I made a new spindle:

 

 

The later pumps have a larger drive blade, so I have increased the size of this on too to give more engagement in the drive shaft

 

 

So, why did the spindle fail? Well, at some point in the past, the gearbox has been sitting in water, which had entered the gearbox and corroded the bearings making them a bit loose:

 

 

This was the good one, the other had fallen apart completely.

 

The rollers and thrust bearing were similar:

 

 

Anyway. All cleaned out, pump repaired, bearings sorted and Warspite is back in action

 

If you like that sort of thing, I think Warspite was built to some kind of RN specification. She has two, independant raw water inlet systems. Each with a skin fitting, shut off cock, strainer and belt driven pump!

 

Richard