Navigation Lights

[tangysheep]

Hi folks

I'm having a new boat built and wondered how important navigation lights are as we shall be cruising very little on rivers.

Are there regulations for rivers that we should be aware of?

Charge for the lights, as an extra £350, which we would rather put towards a cratch.

Regards

Stephen

[Richard Bustens]

Dont think you need them on the canals but i think you do on rivers even if you are not intending to use the boat at night.

[dor]

Doesn't seem to be a problem on the Weaver - no lights needed there, but you do need them to go out on the Manchester ship canal.

[howardang]

Dont think you need them on the canals but i think you do on rivers even if you are not intending to use the boat at night.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

To be slightly pedantic, where navigation lights are required by either the International regulations or by a bye-law in rivers etc they should be exhibited at any time when there is restricted visibility - i.e. they could be needed 24 hours a day and whether or not you intend to use a boat is irrelevant. I would suggest that if you intend to go on such waters you should fit them as a matter of course.

 

Regards

 

Howard Anguish

[James York]

I know they are not required on the Trent Navigation above Nottingham and fairly sure they arn't needed on the Soar either. I think they may however be needed on the tidal streches of most rivers.

[John Orentas]

As Richard says you only need them on rivers and ship canals if you are actually navigating at night. There is no requirement at all on inland canals.

[fuzzyduck]

I have to say nightime navigation on a river has a certain charm, espcially if you slow right down and mentally tune out the engine noise. but i did see somewhere battery powered magnetic nav lights you can slap on at a later date.

 

Enjoy your cratch :-)

[Richard Lacy]

You will only probably ever need nav lights if you are doing transit journeys involving estuaries or rivers for example Kennet & Avon Canal to Gloucester & Sharpness Canal via the Severn. I think you need them on the Thames and the Ribble Link but it would always be advisable to check local regulations if you are undertaking that sort of journey. £350 seems some what excessive , suggest you ask someone else to quote if you decide you want them.

[Richard Bustens]

Hi I think i would ask them to put the wiring in whilst they are fitting out and you can always fit later.

That should only cost £20-30 extra at the most.

[maffi mushkila]

Hi folks

I'm having a new boat built and wondered how important navigation lights are as we shall be cruising very little on rivers.

Are there regulations for rivers that we should be aware of?

Charge for the lights, as an extra £350, which we would rather put towards a cratch.

Regards

Stephen

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

This should answer that one.

 

Guidance & Regulations / Inland Waterways / Navigation Lights Shapes and Sound Signals

 

17 NAVIGATION LIGHTS, SHAPES AND SOUND SIGNALS

 

17.1 Vessels should comply with the requirements of the Merchant Shipping (Distress Signals and Prevention of Collisions) Regulations 1996, SI 1996 No.75. In some areas these will be modified by local bylaws, which will be published by the navigation or other local authority – e.g. British Waterways, General Canal Byelaws 1965, Thames Navigation Licensing and general bylaws.

 

17.2 A vessel which operates only between sunrise and sunset is not required by the international regulations to carry navigation lights. However, in areas where there is a risk of collision in poor visibility, it is advisable to use navigation lights. The local Navigation Authority should be consulted if in doubt.

 

17.3 Vessels operating through tunnels should also carry a white spotlight or headlight.

 

17.4 Sound signalling equipment should comply with the Regulations. A vessel of less than 12 metres in length is not obliged, unless required by local byelaws, to carry the sound signaling equipment required by the Regulations on the condition that some other means of making an efficient sound signal is provided.

[maffi mushkila]

PS 350 quid! Not so bl**ding likely. IKEA oil lamps £3:50

[Amicus]

I’ve seen self-contained battery bi-colour lights, good quality, by Hellas I think, this would slip onto a bracket on the cratch when needed.

Pufectly adequate, shirly?

Edited February 8, 2005 by Amicus

[ChrisPy]

IKEA oil lamps £3:50

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh no, not IKEA again, again !! I suppose now there will be a run on translucent red and green plastic sheets and the price will shoot up like oak-faced ply.

 

maffi, can you run them on camel juice?

 

on second thoughts, how about a candle-powered lamp? No, I never mentioned ear wax

[John Orentas]

Navigation lights should be put into the same category as red and white spotted neckerchiefs and sextants.

[David Schweizer]

This should answer that one.

 

Guidance & Regulations / Inland Waterways / Navigation Lights Shapes and Sound Signals 

 

17        NAVIGATION LIGHTS, SHAPES AND SOUND SIGNALS

 

17.1 Vessels should comply with the requirements of the Merchant Shipping (Distress Signals and Prevention of Collisions) Regulations 1996, SI 1996 No.75. In some areas these will be modified by local bylaws, which will be published by the navigation or other local authority  –  e.g. British Waterways, General Canal Byelaws 1965, Thames Navigation Licensing and general bylaws.

 

17.2 A vessel which operates only between sunrise and sunset is not required by the international regulations to carry navigation lights.  However, in areas where there is a risk of collision in poor visibility, it is advisable to use navigation lights.  The local Navigation Authority should be consulted if in doubt.   

 

17.3 Vessels operating through tunnels should also carry a white spotlight or headlight. 

 

17.4 Sound signalling equipment should comply with the Regulations. A vessel of less than 12 metres in length is not obliged, unless required by local byelaws, to carry the sound signaling equipment required by the Regulations on the condition that some other means of making an efficient sound signal is provided.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes Maffi thats all very well, but what you have onmmited are the by-law excemptions and regulations for Transitory Visitors. I regulary spend several days at a time on the Thames either between Brentford and Reading or Reading and Oxford, and have never been questioned about my boat's lack of navigation lights. As suggested elsewhere, contact the appropriate navigation Authority and seek advice.

[David Schweizer]

Navigation lights should be put into the same category as red and white spotted neckerchiefs and sextants.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

HEAR HEAR - along with Bowler hats and windlass belts.

[Alan Saunders]

Navigation lights should be put into the same category as red and white spotted neckerchiefs and sextants.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What colour is your neckerchief? Agreed GPS is better!

 

HEAR HEAR - along with Bowler hats and windlass belts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Navigation lights & windlass belts are safety equipment. I am not sure about the other bits - a bowler gives some protection! I tuck my windlass in the back of my trouser belt leaving an extra hand free for crossing lock gates, climbing ladders etc. whilst ensuring that I have it to hand if it is needed.

 

Hi folks

I'm having a new boat built and wondered how important navigation lights are as we shall be cruising very little on rivers.

Are there regulations for rivers that we should be aware of?

Charge for the lights, as an extra £350, which we would rather put towards a cratch.

Regards

Stephen

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

£350 seems expensive but lights that conform to the regulations for sea-going craft are not cheap. If you do not intend to navigate at night or in poor visibility on tidal waters & rivers you probably do not need them. However, consider what you might do if on a passage from Teddington to Brentford you had a propulsion failure and were delayed until after sunset. If anchored you would need a white riding light and it would be foolish to navigate in such waters without port, starboard and stern lights. The higher the lights are fitted the more visible they will be. I would opt out but plan to fit a combined tricolour + white at the top of a small folding mast later.

 

Navigating at night on BW canals requires only a white light facing forwards. There is no specification for how bright this light must be; a cabin light is probably sufficient if you have forward facing windows. Using the tunnel light (other than in tunnels) may bring objections from oncoming steerer's whose night vision is spoilt by it! Using the tunnel light also makes it more difficult to see oncoming boats at night.

 

Alan

[Bernie]

If you really do want navigation lights there are some battery operated ones at http://www.boatsnbits.co.uk/acatalog/Navigation_Lights.html

They cost little more than £12 for set of 3.

We have never had any on any of our boats and have never felt the need for them.

Edited February 8, 2005 by Bernie

[Alastair]

I use mine all the time - when I am in fog or at night. But this *is* on a river, I don't think I'd try motoring on a canal at night, not enough manouvering room for me.

 

If you ever plan on being on rivers, and using your boat in winter, you should fit them. The winter day is very short.

 

Battery powered red and green, plus single all-round white would do. Defn fit a tunnel light.

 

If you are going to do much night-motoring, fit an aft white and forward-only white masthead. This ensure that there is no glare in the eyes of the steerer.

[maffi mushkila]

Yes Maffi thats all very well, but what you have onmmited are the by-law excemptions and regulations for Transitory Visitors. I regulary spend several days at a time on the Thames either between Brentford and Reading or Reading and Oxford, and have never been questioned about my boat's lack of navigation lights. As suggested elsewhere, contact the appropriate navigation Authority and seek advice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I didn't omit anything. I copied the rules relevant to the topic from the net. These came from the Merchant Shipping (Distress Signals and Prevention of Collisions) Regulations 1996, SI 1996 No.75.

 

They mentioned in 17.1

 

"In some areas these will be modified by local bylaws, which will be published by the navigation or other local authority – e.g. British Waterways, General Canal Byelaws 1965, Thames Navigation Licensing and general bylaws".

 

So again what did "I" miss, David.

Edited February 9, 2005 by maffi mushkila

[nbtafelberg]

£350 are they GOLD?

 

I'd go to Nauticalia and order some of their oil lamps, we use them and they look and work great!

 

Even if you were to get electric ones and wire them in you'd be hard pushed to cost it at £350.

[tangysheep]

If you really do want navigation lights there are some battery operated ones at http://www.boatsnbits.co.uk/acatalog/Navigation_Lights.html

They cost little more than £12 for set of 3.

We have never had any on any of our boats and have never felt the need for them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Thanks Berni (and all others) for your advice. If we need them the battery ones look good and a fair price.

Thanks again

Regards

Stephen

[DHutch]

We only have a stearn light fitted permently, we used to have a pair of side lights on the wheel house, but they got it the way badly, and we never used them, so they got taken off. at the front we can clip the tunnel light on, but during normal use its in the locker.

 

daniel

[howardang]

This should answer that one.

 

Guidance & Regulations / Inland Waterways / Navigation Lights Shapes and Sound Signals 

 

17        NAVIGATION LIGHTS, SHAPES AND SOUND SIGNALS

 

17.1 Vessels should comply with the requirements of the Merchant Shipping (Distress Signals and Prevention of Collisions) Regulations 1996, SI 1996 No.75. In some areas these will be modified by local bylaws, which will be published by the navigation or other local authority  –  e.g. British Waterways, General Canal Byelaws 1965, Thames Navigation Licensing and general bylaws.

 

17.2 A vessel which operates only between sunrise and sunset is not required by the international regulations to carry navigation lights.  However, in areas where there is a risk of collision in poor visibility, it is advisable to use navigation lights.  The local Navigation Authority should be consulted if in doubt.   

 

17.3 Vessels operating through tunnels should also carry a white spotlight or headlight. 

 

17.4 Sound signalling equipment should comply with the Regulations. A vessel of less than 12 metres in length is not obliged, unless required by local byelaws, to carry the sound signaling equipment required by the Regulations on the condition that some other means of making an efficient sound signal is provided.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Maffi,

 

It is quite clear that in any waters where seagoing vessels can navigate - and some, if not most, rivers, all ship canals etc fall into that definition - the international rules apply at any time of the day or night. If a vessel intends to navigate on such waters it should be fitted with Proper Navigation lights, not the owners interpretation of such lights.

 

Extracts from the relevant rules which cover these requirements areas follows:-

 

INTERNATIONAL REGULATIONS FOR PREVENTING COLLISIONS

AT SEA, 1972

(a) These Rules shall apply to all vessels upon the high seas and in all waters connected therewith navigable by seagoing vessels.

 

( Nothing in these Rules shall interfere with the operation of special rules made by an appropriate authority for roadsteads, harbours, rivers, lakes or inland waterways connected with the high seas and navigable by seagoing vessels. Such special rules shall conform as closely as possible to these Rules.

………..

 

 

(l) The term "restricted visibility" means any condition in which visibility is restricted by fog, mist, falling snow, heavy rainstorms, sandstorms or any other similar causes

 

……………

 

PART C

LIGHTS AND SHAPES

Rule 20

Application

(a) Rules in this Part shall be complied with in all weathers.

( The Rules concerning lights shall be complied with from sunset to sunrise, and during such times no other lights shall be exhibited, except such lights as cannot be mistaken for the lights specified in these Rules or do not impair their visibility or distinctive character, or interfere with the keeping of a proper look-out.

© The lights prescribed by these Rules shall, if carried, also be exhibited from sunrise to sunset in restricted visibility and may be exhibited in all other circumstances when it is deemed necessary.

 

I hope this clarifies the point.

 

Regards

 

Howard Anguish

[maffi mushkila]

Clear as a poachers moon.

 

Now tell me again what did I omit.

 

We are talking Narrow boats here not the QE2.