First experience of surveys

[Alan Saunders]

A collegue buying a house consulted a Surveyor who, verbally, said: "I have previously surveyed this property. It is worth nowhere near what they are asking. It is suffering from serious subsidence and many other defects. I am not willing to survey it yet again. I am certain that the vendor will make me unwelcome".

 

Maybe your Surveyor broke the rules in the hope that he will not again have to take money from innocent buyers to, yet again, survey a boat that he considered to be a rip-off? Surely, if the surveyor's valuation less the required works was so poor it would not be a 'selling point' for the vendor?

 

Then again, individual surveyors have their on views. In particular some house surveys are worthless, particularly for older, especially 'period properties' they may

consist mostly of exclusion clauses suggesting a specialist opinion is sought on each and every point. For an 'older' property or boat you need a sympathetic surveyor.

 

What do you mean by 'older' boat? At twenty years old some insurance companies will require a survey and valuation. You could be looking at a hull or 60% of a hull a hundred years or more old that may attract a premium for its hystoric value.

 

Alan

[LEO]

A collegue buying a house consulted a Surveyor who, verbally, said: "I have previously surveyed this property. It is worth nowhere near what they are asking. It is suffering from serious subsidence and many other defects. I am not willing to survey it yet again. I am certain that the vendor will make me unwelcome".

 

Maybe your Surveyor broke the rules in the hope that he will not again have to take money from innocent buyers to, yet again, survey a boat that he considered to be a rip-off? Surely, if the surveyor's valuation less the required works was so poor it would not be a 'selling point' for the vendor?

 

Then again, individual surveyors have their on views. In particular some house surveys are worthless, particularly for older, especially 'period properties' they may

consist mostly of exclusion clauses suggesting a specialist opinion is sought on each and every point. For an 'older' property or boat you need a sympathetic surveyor.

 

What do you mean by 'older' boat? At twenty years old some insurance companies will require a survey and valuation. You could be looking at a hull or 60% of a hull a hundred years or more old that may attract a premium for its hystoric value.

 

Alan

 

Oh Dear, once more this problem crops up - Surveyor is a loose term, as is the 'handle' Engineer.

 

Really with 'inspections' or 'Surveys' one must consider what type of inspection you want, then decide on what kind of Surveyor you need - in the case of domestic properties, preferably a Chartered Building Surveyor, and the agree terms of engagement with him/her.

 

Specialist reports are often called for, as the Surveyor may throw up problems which require specialist knowledge (electrical reports and drainage reports) to name but two.

 

Use a 'sympathetic' professional - agreed, but this is not always helpful - you often need a recently qualified person or one who has kept knowledge up to date by CPD (Continual Professional Development).- particularly important with medical professionals

 

'Joe Public' got a much better deal when I started as an articled clerk. When a survey was called for, the client was interviewed, terms of engagement discussed and agreed as was the fee (which excluded a generous allowance for expenses - usually lunch at a good quality Hotel) and on the due date my Mentor and I, met Harry Batson (the electrical guru) and Mr Wallace (a builder) and we spent 2 days on the inspection.

 

These days I cringe at turnround times and targets.

 

Boat surveys need similar terms of engagement to those outlined above, especially as boats and especially installations, become more complicated, perhaps the Qualified Surveyor should carry out a hull survey and suitably qualified Engineers called in for comments on Engines/gearboxes and electricians to report on electrical installations - a real 'Belts and Braces' approach.

 

L

[John V]

Truly "belts and braces" Leo......but I dread to think the cost.....A lot probably depends on what the survey is for, I would bitterly resent having to fork out for a massive survey like that every 5 or 6 years to keep my Insurance Co. happy!

[John Williamson 1955]

Truly "belts and braces" Leo......but I dread to think the cost.....A lot probably depends on what the survey is for, I would bitterly resent having to fork out for a massive survey like that every 5 or 6 years to keep my Insurance Co. happy!

Normally, insurance companies only insist on a survey for comprehensive insurance, and I believe it's normally only a hull survey they want anyway. If you only want third party insurance, very few places want to see a hull survey, but one of the common restrictions in the policy is that they take no responsibility for wreck removal.

 

I'd just accept the full engineers report and the rest as part of the general running costs, and use the results to plan what I wanted to do next time the boat came out for blacking or whatever.

[John V]

Normally, insurance companies only insist on a survey for comprehensive insurance, and I believe it's normally only a hull survey they want anyway. If you only want third party insurance, very few places want to see a hull survey, but one of the common restrictions in the policy is that they take no responsibility for wreck removal.

 

I'd just accept the full engineers report and the rest as part of the general running costs, and use the results to plan what I wanted to do next time the boat came out for blacking or whatever.

 

If I had a normal canal boat I could consider swallowing it a little easier but as I have a Humber barge on salt water the drydock prices are a bit higher....

A week in the closest drydock to me comes out at £900 and you need to book well in advance! so to go in for a survey and then have to go back in for work!!!!!!

Edited September 2, 2014 by John V

[Pennie]

The boat I was looking at was an '86 Springer and it needed a lot of replating according to the surveyor and it was pitted in one particular place really badly and he couldn't quite work out why that area was so bad. I'm glad I didn't go through with that boat and despite the issues with surveyor he seemed to know his stuff and the survey was very understandable yet thorough.

 

[Southern Star]

Out of interest, did you try to negotiate with the vendor about the cost of the replating?

[Pennie]

My bad not replating; I meant overplated.

 

Yes I managed to either do the work for me or drop the price by £4000

[Alan de Enfield]

My bad not replating; I meant overplated.

 

Yes I managed to either do the work for me or drop the price by £4000

 

 

Does that mean that the going rate for an 86 Springer is more than £4000 ?

[muddywaters]

Sorry to highjack the thread but could I just ask a question about surveys.

The brokerage I'm hopefully buying my boat from in their terms and conditions state that you can only get your deposit back if the cost of putting right any defects found by the survey would cost more than 5% of the price you are paying for the boat.

So what happens after the survey, do I or the surveyor send the brokerage a copy.

Wouldn't that land me in trouble giving the brokerage a copy if the surveyor owns the copyright

[Grace and Favour]

I would never send the brokerage a copy of the survey, under any conditions.

 

I'd happily have the surveyor write me a detailed list of the estimated cost of gthe necessary repairs, and show that to the brokerage.

 

(I'd also probably choose to deal with a different brokerage to be honest!)

Edited September 4, 2014 by Grace & Favour

[Alan de Enfield]

 

The brokerage I'm hopefully buying my boat from in their terms and conditions state that you can only get your deposit back if the cost of putting right any defects found by the survey would cost more than 5% of the price you are paying for the boat.

 

 

I have not come across this before and would be a little cautious of this brokerage - the sale is between you and the seller - the brokerge is just there to faliciltate this transaction by :

 

1) Introducing you to the boat/seler

2) Receiving your money

3) Paying the seller - less their commission.

 

I would suggest that any terms as to refunds, reduced price etc due to the survey findings are down to the agreement of the seller and not the broker.

 

Having said that 5% is not a huge amount - on a £50,000 boat its only £2500, and on a £20,000 boat its only £1,000. - But - do you really want to buy a boat that you know needs £2500 spending on it, PLUS all the other stuff the surveyor has missed.

 

If it REALLY is the boat for you I'd suggest that you negotiate a 'figure' that you would be happy to accept (rather than a percentage)

 

Alternatively walk away and find another boat / broker.

[Bigredbus4468]

The brokerage isn't whilton is it? They allegedly have been known to sell boats that they own inferring that they are selling for an individual.

[muddywaters]

The brokerage isn't whilton is it? They allegedly have been known to sell boats that they own inferring that they are selling for an individual.

Great Haywood Boat Sales

[Retardedrocker]

I've just received my survey report and in the pre-amble is this:

 

DATA PROTECTION

 

The information contained in this report is the intellectual property of S.R. Marine Surveys Ltd. This document contains confidential information that is legally privileged and is intended for the use of the addressee only. All information contained herein is covered by the EU Data Protection Directive (95/46/EC). the survey is carried out for the sole use of the above named client and his insurers.

 

That seems to say it all.

 

Cheers,

T.

[David Mack]

I've just received my survey report and in the pre-amble is this:

 

DATA PROTECTION

 

The information contained in this report is the intellectual property of S.R. Marine Surveys Ltd. This document contains confidential information that is legally privileged and is intended for the use of the addressee only. All information contained herein is covered by the EU Data Protection Directive (95/46/EC). the survey is carried out for the sole use of the above named client and his insurers.

 

That seems to say it all.

 

Cheers,

T.

But does it actually contain confidential information that is legally privileged? Or is the surveyor just trying to protect his commercial position?

[PhilR]

I've just received my survey report and in the pre-amble is this:

 

DATA PROTECTION

 

The information contained in this report is the intellectual property of S.R. Marine Surveys Ltd. This document contains confidential information that is legally privileged and is intended for the use of the addressee only. All information contained herein is covered by the EU Data Protection Directive (95/46/EC). the survey is carried out for the sole use of the above named client and his insurers.

 

That seems to say it all.

 

Cheers,

T.

 

 

But does it actually contain confidential information that is legally privileged? Or is the surveyor just trying to protect his commercial position?

 

The important sentence for the likes of us is *the survey is carried out for the sole use of the above named client and his insurers.*

 

 

[Retardedrocker]

 

As I've said before, I'm no kind of expert, but I imagine that the data protection thing depends on the nature of the contract between client and surveyor. If they agree that the survey is confidential then it is.

 

To give an example, when I took a credit card provider to court over penalties, although I won the case, the bank applied for a confidentiality clause, which was granted.

 

The result of the action was not in itself confidential, but became so because it was agreed as such.

 

I wait to be shot down.

 

Cheers,

T.

[David Mack]

 

 

 

The important sentence for the likes of us is *the survey is carried out for the sole use of the above named client and his insurers.*

 

 

 

I wasn't querying that bit. That means thatnobody else can rely on the survey in law, even if they have seen it or got hold of a copy. But that doesn't mean any of the content is legally privileged.