Retrofit glow plugs to air cooled diesel eng?

[sqawk]

Hi i'm new to the narrowboat world.

Has anyone retrofitted glow plugs to a aircooled diesel engine

I have a narrowboat with a 3 cylinder Slanzi engine (aircooled) that is a pig to start from cold. Cranking it over for nearly 60 seconds before it fires up dosn't seem right somehow. Would it help to retrofit glow plugs into the inlet manifold? what do people think?

[Tony Brooks]

You can/could get a large plug like thing that screwed into the air cleaner that heated the air but I suspect you have more problems that that.

 

There are broadly two designs of diesel engine s. Direct injected like most older lister and Bukh, or Indirect injected like the vast majority of modern " marine diesels. Direct injected diesels are very good cold starters and are rarely fitted with heaters (modern automotive units excepted). Indirect injected engines burn cleaner at low speeds and powers but tend to be difficult cold starters so most, but not all, are fitted with glow plugs to assist.

 

I have never heard of a Slanzi engine but I suspect it is a direct injected engine so a cold start problem is more likely to be related to low compression or lack of fuel requiring the lift pump to in effect bleed the system. How soon after cranking commences does the exhaust emit clouds of whitish "smoke"? It may also be an injection timing problem so how much smoke does it make after being run for half an hour or so?

[Captain Fizz]

How old is it?

Presumably, it is not designed to have heaters so it may be better to get the injectors reconditioned first.

I think I would start with a compression test.

Cross posted with Tony!

[RLWP]

Hi i'm new to the narrowboat world.

Has anyone retrofitted glow plugs to a aircooled diesel engine

I have a narrowboat with a 3 cylinder Slanzi engine (aircooled) that is a pig to start from cold. Cranking it over for nearly 60 seconds before it fires up dosn't seem right somehow. Would it help to retrofit glow plugs into the inlet manifold? what do people think?

 

I think that you've probably got something more complicated going on

 

What happens during the 60 second cranking - do you get smoke from the exhaust and if so, what colour?

 

Richard

[ditchcrawler]

You can/could get a large plug like thing that screwed into the air cleaner that heated the air but I suspect you have more problems that that.

 

There are broadly two designs of diesel engine s. Direct injected like most older lister and Bukh, or Indirect injected like the vast majority of modern " marine diesels. Direct injected diesels are very good cold starters and are rarely fitted with heaters (modern automotive units excepted). Indirect injected engines burn cleaner at low speeds and powers but tend to be difficult cold starters so most, but not all, are fitted with glow plugs to assist.

 

I have never heard of a Slanzi engine but I suspect it is a direct injected engine so a cold start problem is more likely to be related to low compression or lack of fuel requiring the lift pump to in effect bleed the system. How soon after cranking commences does the exhaust emit clouds of whitish "smoke"? It may also be an injection timing problem so how much smoke does it make after being run for half an hour or so?

http://tractors.wikia.com/wiki/Slanzi

[sqawk]

Many thanks for the quick reply, Slanzi also known as Lombardini............ White smoke within seconds of cranking, hardly any smoke after about 20 mins running. Not sure of age of engine, boat was built in 1994

[RLWP]

Many thanks for the quick reply, Slanzi also known as Lombardini............ White smoke within seconds of cranking, hardly any smoke after about 20 mins running. Not sure of age of engine, boat was built in 1994

 

White smoke is good - you are getting atomised diesel. Within seconds is also good as you don't seem to have an air leak on the fuel side

 

Where have you got the speed control set?

 

Richard

[sqawk]

Speed control is about 3/4 fully open.

​I've only recently bought the boat so maybe i haven't found the 'way' yet...... I've also found it doesn't like idling in gear, engine tends to stall. Again , maybe I'm just not used to it yet. I have so far resisted the temptation to use easy start. Cant seem to find any info on the net concerning this engine.

[Iain_S]

If the engine isn't fitted with glow plugs, it shouldn't need them. Failure to start may be due to any of the things listed above, or just the batteries not spinning the engine fast enough.

 

An alternative to glow plugs could be a flame start system, which would be easier to fit. (But I still don't think it should need it in our climate )

 

Iain

[RLWP]

Speed control is about 3/4 fully open.

​I've only recently bought the boat so maybe i haven't found the 'way' yet...... I've also found it doesn't like idling in gear, engine tends to stall. Again , maybe I'm just not used to it yet. I have so far resisted the temptation to use easy start. Cant seem to find any info on the net concerning this engine.

 

If it won't idle in gear - is the prop fouled?

 

Otherwise, you've got an engine that is reluctant to start and won't idle in gear - you've got a problem of some kind that needs sorting out

 

The compression test is a good idea

 

Richard

[sqawk]

Prop definitely wasnt fouled last time i started it as it was in a dry dock being refloated after survey, I am hoping to move the boat this next weekend from Willington to Kings Bromley, its home mooring. Once there i'll have more time to look at the possibilities. Compression test is probably a good idea anyway.

Going to try warming the air into inlet manifold with gas torch next time i start it, if it works then i might look at some kind of 'grid heater'.

Thanks for suggestions guys.

[Arthur Brown]

Does sound as if the engine needs some TLC, compression,gaskets etc seems a good start. Til then maybe a hairdryer down the inlet may help. It's MOST unlikely that the engine should be this hard to start, without some attention it will cane the battery

[Tony Brooks]

Does sound as if the engine needs some TLC, compression,gaskets etc seems a good start. Til then maybe a hairdryer down the inlet may help. It's MOST unlikely that the engine should be this hard to start, without some attention it will cane the battery

 

or blow-lamp as long as the inlet is not plastic. I would take any air cleaner off it before applying the blow-lamp.

[ditchcrawler]

Speed control is about 3/4 fully open.

​I've only recently bought the boat so maybe i haven't found the 'way' yet...... I've also found it doesn't like idling in gear, engine tends to stall. Again , maybe I'm just not used to it yet. I have so far resisted the temptation to use easy start. Cant seem to find any info on the net concerning this engine.

http://www.gobookee.org/slanzi-diesel-engines/

 

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_kw=Slanzi+Diesel+Engine

 

http://www.generalparts.eu/1.0.1/index.php?lang=en&Itemid=322

[Geoff Taylor]

Hi, I used to service a Slanzi 3cyl air cooled unit some 30 years ago and it was powering a very smart looking 4 wheel drive mini tractor, it was a pig to get parts for as nothing was listed for this model in filter catalogues etc. I know it is an italian engine but it closely resembled Hatz and Deutz units. It was direct injection and if my memory serves me correctly had an excess fuel device on the end of the governor rail which you pulled out after setting full throttle and provision for a flame start device on the inlet manifold. I do remember it being a good starter,very powerful and was quite a sharp sounding engine and rated at 40 BHP. It is the only Slanzi unit to this day that I have ever seen out of hundreds of engines that have passed me by !!!. I would love to see a photograph of your unit to compare it with the one I used to service.

[RLWP]

if my memory serves me correctly had an excess fuel device on the end of the governor rail which you pulled out after setting full throttle

 

I had wondered about that Geoff, useful stuff

 

Richard

[sqawk]

Thanks for that Geoff, and also thanks for the links Ditchcrawler, interesting reading. I dont yet know how to upload pictures to the forum. There is a small brass union on the air intake manifold, near to where the air filtre would be if it was fitted with one...... sounds like it could have been a flame start connection. I will certainly look more closely for an excess fuel button. The only literature i have says the engine is a DVA 2200

[RLWP]

Slanzi DVA 2200 Googles well: http://www.gobookee.org/slanzi-dva-2200/

 

Richard

 

Can you read Italian?

[sqawk]

Slanzi DVA 2200 Googles well: http://www.gobookee.org/slanzi-dva-2200/

 

Richard

 

Can you read Italian?

I wish!

[onionbargee]

maybe you need extra virgin oil ?