Liverpool boats rudder loose?

[Nige123]

Hi I have a Liverpool boats 57ft Narrow & the tiller has some play in it....

 

The boat has about 600 hours on it & the tiller has play so when you turn the tiller the rudder seems like it has a size 1 bolt in a size 3 hole?

The boat has always been like this since I have had it & I had it from almost new & it's the same not worse & not better...

 

I have noticed that on full power up the Thames water comes up out the top bearing & I have seen this on other boats so all I can think is it's a problem with cheap boats like mine?

 

I have read that some people weld the rudder on Liverpool Boats the the tube as they are held in place with bolts is this true?

 

So what do I do next? can I get in the water & change out the bolts or fix this problem or is it the dry dock for me?

any help from people with the same problem that fixed it would be good....

[Guest]

Hi I have a Liverpool boats 57ft Narrow & the tiller has some play in it....

 

The boat has about 600 hours on it & the tiller has play so when you turn the tiller the rudder seems like it has a size 1 bolt in a size 3 hole?

The boat has always been like this since I have had it & I had it from almost new & it's the same not worse & not better...

 

I have noticed that on full power up the Thames water comes up out the top bearing & I have seen this on other boats so all I can think is it's a problem with cheap boats like mine?

 

I have read that some people weld the rudder on Liverpool Boats the the tube as they are held in place with bolts is this true?

 

So what do I do next? can I get in the water & change out the bolts or fix this problem or is it the dry dock for me?

any help from people with the same problem that fixed it would be good....

Some l'pool boats have one bolt that passes right through, and another which is a pinch bolt. I suspect the pinch bolt needs tightening. Mine, though not a l'pool boat is the same setup. Forgot to say it can be done afloat if you either stand in or use a dinghy. Never felt the need to weld it.

Edited June 3, 2012 by Guest

[jenlyn]

Hi I have a Liverpool boats 57ft Narrow & the tiller has some play in it....

 

The boat has about 600 hours on it & the tiller has play so when you turn the tiller the rudder seems like it has a size 1 bolt in a size 3 hole?

The boat has always been like this since I have had it & I had it from almost new & it's the same not worse & not better...

 

I have noticed that on full power up the Thames water comes up out the top bearing & I have seen this on other boats so all I can think is it's a problem with cheap boats like mine?

 

I have read that some people weld the rudder on Liverpool Boats the the tube as they are held in place with bolts is this true?

 

So what do I do next? can I get in the water & change out the bolts or fix this problem or is it the dry dock for me?

any help from people with the same problem that fixed it would be good....

Yes, mine was bolted. Had it welded last time I blacked. As for the jet ski effect, I tried all sorts to no avail, but I grease it with silicone grease every now and again, that seems to help .

[bowten]

Are there two allen type screws that can be seen at the bottom of the tiller arm near the greaser point.If there is try tightening these.Hmmmm,just had a thought, these are just to adjust the slack on the tiller arm and won't help you.

Edited June 3, 2012 by bowten

[dor]

Don't weld it or you won't be able to change the bearing.

The solution is to drill out the existing bolt holes and put larger bolts through and tighten up as much as you can. It will probably still loosen, but should last the time between blacking so make sure you tighten it all up when you black it.

 

Some water coming up through the bearing is just one of those things. It shouldn't gush out though, and mine only comes through when at high revs in reverse.

[bizzard]

Had this couple of times with Liverpool boats.The trouble usually happens when maneuvering,the rudder gets obstructed and shoved over by say the shallows or the bank,the steerer then puts on too much pressure at the tiller to shift it,this leverage then forces those horrible pinch bolts to move or bend and from then on the rudder has play (waggle)in it where the stock passes through

You should be able to reach these bolts through the weed hatch to tighten them,and are usually spanner size 19mm.

Nuts ''usually two'' are welded to the rudders tube where the stock passes through,corresponding with these nuts are location indents (short holes) drilled in the stock for the bolts to lock into.

I would at next docking have welded on the other side of the rudders tube two more nuts,drill through indents into the stock and fit two more bolts for extra strength and security. You could drill right through and nut and bolt it but unless this bolt and hole are an accurate tight interference fit,the hole and bolt will wear and play will probably reoccur.

To stop water from spraying up through the top bearing,go to a motor factors and buy a universal stick together car drive shaft CV boot kit.Simple to fit by trimming off with knife provided to fit your stock size.Fit facing downwards under the tiller to stock fixing boss.

[Guest]

Had this couple of times with Liverpool boats.The trouble usually happens when maneuvering,the rudder gets obstructed and shoved over by say the shallows or the bank,the steerer then puts on too much pressure at the tiller to shift it,this leverage then forces those horrible pinch bolts to move or bend and from then on the rudder has play (waggle)in it where the stock passes through

You should be able to reach these bolts through the weed hatch to tighten them,and are usually spanner size 19mm.

Nuts ''usually two'' are welded to the rudders tube where the stock passes through,corresponding with these nuts are location indents (short holes) drilled in the stock for the bolts to lock into.

I would at next docking have welded on the other side of the rudders tube two more nuts,drill through indents into the stock and fit two more bolts for extra strength and security. You could drill right through and nut and bolt it but unless this bolt and hole are an accurate tight interference fit,the hole and bolt will wear and play will probably reoccur.

To stop water from spraying up through the top bearing,go to a motor factors and buy a universal stick together car drive shaft CV boot kit.Simple to fit by trimming off with knife provided to fit your stock size.Fit facing downwards under the tiller to stock fixing boss.

you just described my rudder setup.

 

Clever idea using CV boot.

[Nige123]

Had this couple of times with Liverpool boats.The trouble usually happens when maneuvering,the rudder gets obstructed and shoved over by say the shallows or the bank,the steerer then puts on too much pressure at the tiller to shift it,this leverage then forces those horrible pinch bolts to move or bend and from then on the rudder has play (waggle)in it where the stock passes through

You should be able to reach these bolts through the weed hatch to tighten them,and are usually spanner size 19mm.

Nuts ''usually two'' are welded to the rudders tube where the stock passes through,corresponding with these nuts are location indents (short holes) drilled in the stock for the bolts to lock into.

I would at next docking have welded on the other side of the rudders tube two more nuts,drill through indents into the stock and fit two more bolts for extra strength and security. You could drill right through and nut and bolt it but unless this bolt and hole are an accurate tight interference fit,the hole and bolt will wear and play will probably reoccur.

To stop water from spraying up through the top bearing,go to a motor factors and buy a universal stick together car drive shaft CV boot kit.Simple to fit by trimming off with knife provided to fit your stock size.Fit facing downwards under the tiller to stock fixing boss.

 

Many thanks that sounds about right & makes sense.....

I will try to get at the bolts from the weed hatch & do them up a bit first thing & next time I black it find a better way of fixing it (not welding) maybe fitting a few more bolts...

again many thanks for the help will post the out come soon....

[croxy]

We have a 60' liverpool sandpiper narrowboat 5 years old, we bought it two years ago and the rudder was exactly as you describe. Drilling out the existing bolts and fitting bigger ones will not solve the problem for long, the best solution is to get it welded and should you need to change the bearing at any time then just grind off the weld on reweld afterwards. We had this done soon after buying when she came out to be blacked, problem solved.