Help with Victron Inverter

[seadog42uk]

Can anyone offer any advice with regard to adjusting the voltage at which the inverter drops out?, mine seems to be set at about 66% of the available battery.

[mayalld]

Can anyone offer any advice with regard to adjusting the voltage at which the inverter drops out?, mine seems to be set at about 66% of the available battery.

 

Advice?

 

If changing the setting is possible, refrain from doing so.

 

66% seems to be a good setting to me.

 

50% is the "do not discharge below this if you want your batteries to survive" number, and having the inverter cut out at 66% means that one of the larger potential loads is removed as you get close to the magic 50% line.

[by'eck]

Can anyone offer any advice with regard to adjusting the voltage at which the inverter drops out?, mine seems to be set at about 66% of the available battery.

 

I had a Victron Combi charger/inverter (12v 50A/1500 watt) & remember adjustments for the two charge volt settings & inverter output voltage but not much else. Almost certainly the setting you ask about is fixed at a particular voltage & designed to protect any further drain from a depleted battery bank.

 

Saying it drops out at 66% of available battery (capacity?) means little as it depends on accuracy of battery monitor which in turn is dependent on life left in your batteries. A more relevant measurement would be the battery voltage it drops out at measured at inverter input which will probably be about 11 volts for a 12 volt system. If the drop out seems premature you may need to look at your battery bank capacity or age. If those seems ok then look at your charging system. My guess though is that your batteries are on the way out if the inverter fails earlier than it used to.

Edited April 14, 2011 by richardhula

[Gibbo]

Can anyone offer any advice with regard to adjusting the voltage at which the inverter drops out?, mine seems to be set at about 66% of the available battery.

 

I'll take a guess at you having insufficient cable size between the batteries and the inverter leading to voltage drop. Or perhaps dodgy connections. Measure the voltage right at the inverter when it happens (not after, not before, but actually when it happens).

[stewart&jenny]

We have a Victron fed by a bank of 6 110ah batteries. We have a Victron battery monitor hooked into the installation. For 3 years I used the available energy to power up my tools while doing a fit out. I basically bled the batteries way down below 50% on quite a few occasions. In October we went off for a months cruising and basically the batteries were knackered so that as soon as you switched on the microwave, the battery monitor registered a voltage below 12v and the inverter would switch off. The solution was to turn the engine on so that the driven voltage went back up. We have now replaced the battery bank and all seems to be working ok.

 

I might add that we researched and finally bought 5 - 120ah 60% deep cycle 300 recycle batteries for £75each (from Alphi Battery Suppliers) ..... I believe that the advances in battery design are such that the 5 batteries are now at least equal to the original 6 batteries. Am quite looking forward to testing them out .....

Edited April 14, 2011 by stewart&jenny

[bottle]

If I may be so bold, apart from Gibbo's and Richard Hula's posts, may I put in my two penny worth.

 

If your batteries are at about 66% (how is this measured) and it drops out, you are putting to much load on the inverter/batteries, turn off some appliances.

 

The load is causing the volt drop but check cable connections for cleanliness and security..

 

This (drop out) has happened to me but my automatic system kicked in and started the generator.

 

The parameters of a VIctron are adjustable but you will need a connection cable (about£50) a computer (laptop) the program for the computer and the knowledge in what to do, it is dangerous place for the 'un-knowledgeable'.

 

Check the simple things first.

[nb Innisfree]

 

The parameters of a VIctron are adjustable but you will need a connection cable (about£50) a computer (laptop) the program for the computer and the knowledge in what to do, it is dangerous place for the 'un-knowledgeable'.

 

Check the simple things first.

 

Depends on the age of the Victron, ours is an older version and can be adjusted via inbuilt dipswitches, they give a coarser range of adjustment than with a data cable and laptop but still sufficient.

[seadog42uk]

Thanks everyone for your comments, I will leave well alone. My batteries are 2 x 200ah Vetus Gel and are about four years old, useing the Victron battery monitor we charge to 100% each day. In a 24 hour period we use about 90 - 100 ah, but only get a maximum of 130ah out of the batteries. What should I expect to get from new batteries?

 

Regards,

 

Stuart

[WotEver]

... useing the Victron battery monitor we charge to 100% each day.

Sadly, you probably don't. The BVM is known to lie.

 

My batteries are 2 x 200ah Vetus Gel <snip> What should I expect to get from new batteries?

If you take them down to around 50% then around 200Ah.

 

Tony

[mayalld]

Sadly, you probably don't. The BVM is known to lie.

 

 

If you take them down to around 50% then around 200Ah.

 

Tony

 

But they were 200Ah each when new.

 

They are now 4 years old, and capacity will be reduced.

 

130Ah from 2 x 4 y/o 200Ah batteries seems reasonable.

[Justme]

How big (in watts) is the inverter & how big is the load that causes the drop out?

[WotEver]

But they were 200Ah each when new.

 

They are now 4 years old, and capacity will be reduced.

 

130Ah from 2 x 4 y/o 200Ah batteries seems reasonable.

Which bit of

What should I expect to get from new batteries?

did you not understand?

 

Tony

[mayalld]

Which bit of did you not understand?

 

Tony

 

 

I understood all of it thanks.

 

I wasn't disagreeing, simply expanding the answer.

[seadog42uk]

Thanks everyone, I think we will look to having new batteries at some time this year. I run the generator until the inverter goes into float mode and reset the monitor at that point.

 

Regards,

 

Stuart

[bottle]

but do you know if the inverter has adaptive charging set up.

 

ps. the only way to change this is with the lead, laptop etc.

 

note: to Innisfree even the new ones have the dip switches but as you say do not give complete control.

[nb Innisfree]

Thanks everyone for your comments, I will leave well alone. My batteries are 2 x 200ah Vetus Gel and are about four years old, useing the Victron battery monitor we charge to 100% each day. In a 24 hour period we use about 90 - 100 ah, but only get a maximum of 130ah out of the batteries. What should I expect to get from new batteries?

 

Regards,

 

Stuart

 

Charging to 100% SoC takes at least 8hrs, more like 24hrs. Beginning of float charge isn't 100% SoC

 

but do you know if the inverter has adaptive charging set up.

 

ps. the only way to change this is with the lead, laptop etc.

 

note: to Innisfree even the new ones have the dip switches but as you say do not give complete control.

 

We have disabled adaptive charging via dipswitches.

 

I was under the (probably false) impression that later models didn't hav dipswitches.

[Gibbo]

Beginning of float charge isn't 100% SoC

 

Indeed. Not often appreciated. I've done a lot of testing on this. It varies a lot between battery type, battery condition, charger type etc but an average of all results would probably be the charger going into float at something round 90% SOC.

 

Unless you've got adaptive charging enabled in which case it could be much lower.

[bottle]

Seadog42uk

 

apologies we have wandered into the charging side and of course an inverter is not a charger, my fault.

 

but you said

I run the generator until the inverter goes into float mode and reset the monitor at that point.

so I will blame you

 

I am now off to double check my combi's manual to see if I have a dip switch to turn off adaptive charging. It was all set up (not by me) before I knew better.

[seadog42uk]

All your comments are welcome, please allow for the fact that my wife and I will be 70 this year and are not able to absorb some of the finer points of the chargeing system. I have always used the monitor to see how many ahours we have used during the 24 hour period and then run the generator or engine to run the charger to 0.0 hours and most of the time the charger goes to float.

 

I was born on the boats in 1941 and worked with my family until 1963 and in all that time we only had oil lamps for lighting and later a very large battery charged from the engine. It was a complete eye opener to us when we returned to live on a boat in 1990.

 

Regards,

 

Stuart

[bottle]

Stuart (Seadog)

 

Going back to your post #8, you cannot be doing much wrong if the bateries are 4 years old, we do tend to get bogged down in the ultimate way to treat batteries.

 

Batteries 'age' naturally, the more they are used (charged/discharged) the quicker they 'age'.

 

Yes, there is the 'ideal' of not going below 50% SOC (state of charge) and always recharging to 100% SOC but on a boat it is not always possible.

 

You have (when new) 2 X 200amp hour. that means if you wanted to treat them well you would not go below the 50% SOC so that would mean you have 200amp hours available.

 

To then charge them back to 100%SOC you would need to put back about 1.5 times that used so about 300 amp hours. (this is where your gauge is fibbing to you)

 

but

 

your batteries are 4 years old and used so they will not have the same capacity, lets say they are at only half of there original, so they are now only 2X 100amp hour so now you only have 100 amp hours available.

[by'eck]

Stuart (Seadog)

You have (when new) 2 X 200amp hour. that means if you wanted to treat them well you would not go below the 50% SOC so that would mean you have 200amp hours available.

 

To then charge them back to 100%SOC you would need to put back about 1.5 times that used so about 300 amp hours. (this is where your gauge is fibbing to you)

 

Hmm... obviously accept that battery capacity reduces with aging but where did you get the 1.5 times re-charge requirement from?

 

I find re-charge efficiency stays much the same at about 90% (this is adjustable on my Magnetronic monitor) i.e. you need to put back in about 10% more than taken out.

 

The battery state monitor errors can be reduced by adjusting the capacity of battery bank after say two years & regularly after that.

[bottle]

I say about 150% you say about 110% lets take the average, 130%

[nb Innisfree]

Charge rate varies depending on SoC, it can be almost 100% efficient when in bulk charge, 1.5 times is a rough average from bulk to 100% SoC which can easily take 24 hrs to reach a true 100% SoC. (24 hrs engine running is very inefficient!)

[WotEver]

I say about 150% you say about 110% lets take the average, 130%

The answer lies anywhere broadly within that range. It depends on how fast the discharge was amongst other issues.

 

Tony

[by'eck]

Charge rate varies depending on SoC, it can be almost 100% efficient when in bulk charge, 1.5 times is a rough average from bulk to 100% SoC which can easily take 24 hrs to reach a true 100% SoC. (24 hrs engine running is very inefficient!)

 

The worry is where is that 50% extra power going & the answer is mainly heat whilst gassing. I removed two batteries from my boat recently that I'd previously had to disconnect due to one cell failing to short circuit in each - 10 volt battery being charged as 12 volt gets quite hot Both showed signs of the casing distorting although thankfully it hadn't split.

 

I would be wary therefore of batteries that require quite so much replenishment.