CCing and BW's interpretation of the law

[mayalld]

They are Guidelines not the same as the Law. Don't believe all BW writes.

Sue

 

They are guidelines that you must follow to get and keep a licence.

 

If you won't do so, you will have to take BW to court.

[Tim]

And surely by taking a license you agree to abide by the regulations and guidelines!

[romarni123]

Dave why not ask BW why they are allowing boats to stay in one place for so long, its their job to move them on and no amount of moaning about it will change it till bw treats everyone the same and makes the rules and sticks by them.

[mayalld]

Dave why not ask BW why they are allowing boats to stay in one place for so long, its their job to move them on and no amount of moaning about it will change it till bw treats everyone the same and makes the rules and sticks by them.

 

I have done, and their failure to deal with the issue is the subject of a current complaint to BW.

[sueb]

Dave why not ask BW why they are allowing boats to stay in one place for so long, its their job to move them on and no amount of moaning about it will change it till bw treats everyone the same and makes the rules and sticks by them.

I would rather the money was spent on maintaining the canals. BW are now pleading poverty so do we really want them to spend loads of money on enforcement?

Sue

[romarni123]

I have done, and their failure to deal with the issue is the subject of a current complaint to BW.

 

Then tell them you will reduce your mooring payment to equal the overstayers untill the situation has resolved itself and they have moved

 

I would rather the money was spent on maintaining the canals. BW are now pleading poverty so do we really want them to spend loads of money on enforcement?

Sue

 

They can use the money off the fines they get for late payment

[mayalld]

Then tell them you will reduce your mooring payment to equal the overstayers untill the situation has resolved itself and they have moved

 

I don't have a mooring permit that I could withold payment for (I am on a mooring where the mooring provider makes a single mooring agreement payment to BW)

 

 

I would rather the money was spent on maintaining the canals. BW are now pleading poverty so do we really want them to spend loads of money on enforcement?

Sue

 

Yes, because failing to invest in enforcement inevitably means that compliance falls.

[alan_fincher]

It would be also useful if you could establish that the boats you show staying there over 2 weeks were not boats with home moorings whose owners simply found it convenient to leave their boats on a visitor mooring until they wanted to use it again. I perceive this as a major problem affecting visitor moorings in our area.

This is a very valid question, I believe.

 

A lot of the boats we see filling popular mooring spots in London seem to be ones left unattended as a convenience. I'm not even suggesting they are doing anything wrong, as they may not be overstaying, but the reality is that boats left in this way block spaces for use by someone who just wants to be there a night or two in exactly the same way as a "continuous moorer" does.

 

Maybe the distinction would be clearer if genuine CCers were not such a rare breed.

I don't actually think they are.

 

A genuine CCer often looks no different to a non CCer, and will pass through a neighbourhood quite quickly and "legally", and then probably not be seen there again for years.

 

I suspect you don't notice the genuine CCers, but can't fail to notice the "bridge hoppers" or "continuous moorers" that are permanently on your patch.

 

For that reason, I wouldn't even want to hazard a guess about how many people making the CC declaration are constantly moving about, and how many never go more than 5 or 10 miles from a certain spot.

 

Trouble is that many real CCers end up with bad press that they in no way deserve.

[romarni123]

Because we could not cc this year we went into a marina, We went to tamworth thursday the same people are there who have been there for over two years outside the office but its ok they have had aletter

[drunkensailor]

The issue is that on occasion, the mooring spot that is unavailable is the best (or only) mooring spot for some miles. It may be that a particular village can only reasonably be reached by mooring there.

 

Go on, give me an example of this.

[mayalld]

Go on, give me an example of this.

 

Furness Vale, Upper Peak Forest Canal, north of bridge 30. There is a length of mooring that will accomodate perhaps a dozen boats. It is perpetually full of the same boats that claim to be CCers.

 

North of that length, there is nowhere suitable for mooring that is within a reasonable walking distance of Furness Vale. South of it, mooring is not permitted (marina opposite), and further South there is nowhere suitable for mooring until you are far closer to Whalley Bridge.

[cotswoldsman]

Furness Vale, Upper Peak Forest Canal, north of bridge 30. There is a length of mooring that will accomodate perhaps a dozen boats. It is perpetually full of the same boats that claim to be CCers.

 

North of that length, there is nowhere suitable for mooring that is within a reasonable walking distance of Furness Vale. South of it, mooring is not permitted (marina opposite), and further South there is nowhere suitable for mooring until you are far closer to Whalley Bridge.

 

So when you stopped and asked them if they were all CCers they said yes, what was your answer to them? Were they displaying CCer licences?

Edited August 17, 2010 by cotswoldsman

[Tiny]

Furness Vale, Upper Peak Forest Canal, north of bridge 30. There is a length of mooring that will accomodate perhaps a dozen boats. It is perpetually full of the same boats that claim to be CCers.

 

North of that length, there is nowhere suitable for mooring that is within a reasonable walking distance of Furness Vale. South of it, mooring is not permitted (marina opposite), and further South there is nowhere suitable for mooring until you are far closer to Whalley Bridge.

 

 

Now that used to be a favourite overnight mooring - until they came along. The same is true of many old favourites on the Macclesfield - now taken over by Constant moorers - who often seem to be on brand new boats - which looked like they were designed for mooring rather than cruising.

 

On another canal - a very busy one with limited quiet mooring they do move from one choice site to the other but as one lot leave the next move in - we reckon it is all arranged by phone. Whoever is in its all the same sites with the same cast of regulars shuffling around.

 

On yet another canal BW obviously decided not to bother as all the short term moorings became 14 day ones and the boats moored there don't obey that rule as the moorings are ideal for all services and have convenient car parking nearby.

 

None of these mentioned is near London or Oxford where, frankly BW have handed all the moorings to Constant mooriers by extending the permit moorings enormously in the last twenty years.

[rgreg]

Go on, give me an example of this.

 

There was a good example posted on the forum last night. One of our members is visiting the Lancaster canal and was unable to get moored in Lancaster yesterday, which is a shame. Moorings in the city are regularly taken up by some boaters who claim to be "cc ers" but rarely, if ever, move off the canal.

[Chris Pink]

Now that used to be a favourite overnight mooring - until they came along. The same is true of many old favourites on the Macclesfield - now taken over by Constant moorers - who often seem to be on brand new boats - which looked like they were designed for mooring rather than cruising.

 

I am not familiar with this area so I had a look on Google maps and there appears to be miles of empty towpath to the south of Furness Vale, why is this not suitable for mooring?

[Tiny]

I am not familiar with this area so I had a look on Google maps and there appears to be miles of empty towpath to the south of Furness Vale, why is this not suitable for mooring?

 

Try visiting and you may find out.

[Denis R]

On another canal - a very busy one with limited quiet mooring they do move from one choice site to the other but as one lot leave the next move in - we reckon it is all arranged by phone. Whoever is in its all the same sites with the same cast of regulars shuffling around.

I heard the very same words to describe the stretch between Blisworth and Buckby bottom. There's no shortage of mooring spots mind you, so it can support quite a reasonable sized community and the 'passing throughs' too, so doesn't seemed to have created too much tension...

[Guest]

This;

 

"The problem is that bridge hoppers tend to congregate in honeypot locations, to the extent that the use of their favoured locations becomes all but impossible for leisure users."

 

is not a reasoned argument, it is simply an unsubstantiated and incorrect assertion complete with offensive generalisation.

 

I can see the potentially 'generalisation' bit, but the offensive bit is eluding me...

[cotswoldsman]

Now that used to be a favourite overnight mooring - until they came along. The same is true of many old favourites on the Macclesfield - now taken over by Constant moorers - who often seem to be on brand new boats - which looked like they were designed for mooring rather than cruising.

 

On another canal - a very busy one with limited quiet mooring they do move from one choice site to the other but as one lot leave the next move in - we reckon it is all arranged by phone. Whoever is in its all the same sites with the same cast of regulars shuffling around.

 

On yet another canal BW obviously decided not to bother as all the short term moorings became 14 day ones and the boats moored there don't obey that rule as the moorings are ideal for all services and have convenient car parking nearby.

 

None of these mentioned is near London or Oxford where, frankly BW have handed all the moorings to Constant mooriers by extending the permit moorings enormously in the last twenty years.

 

What does the design of one of these mooring boats look like?

 

All done by phone!!!! Yes I do believe Elvis Presley lives in Wigan!!

 

 

There was a good example posted on the forum last night. One of our members is visiting the Lancaster canal and was unable to get moored in Lancaster yesterday, which is a shame. Moorings in the city are regularly taken up by some boaters who claim to be "cc ers" but rarely, if ever, move off the canal.

 

Lancaster is always difficult to moor and when I was there last summer the moorings were certainly not taken by CCers the big problem on Lancaster canal is the locals take the best moorings and leave the boat for the week empty and just visit at weekends and if $ X $ were to see this post he would confirm that.

[Naughty Cal]

Lancaster is always difficult to moor and when I was there last summer the moorings were certainly not taken by CCers the big problem on Lancaster canal is the locals take the best moorings and leave the boat for the week empty and just visit at weekends and if $ X $ were to see this post he would confirm that.

 

How do you know they were not CCers. Did you ask them all?

[cotswoldsman]

How do you know they were not CCers. Did you ask them all?

 

Yes

[mayalld]

So when you stopped and asked them if they were all CCers they said yes, what was your answer to them? Were they displaying CCer licences?

 

Last time I passed, with the exception of those boats who displayed no licence at all, all the boats were, indeed, displaying a CC-er licence

[rgreg]

Lancaster is always difficult to moor and when I was there last summer the moorings were certainly not taken by CCers the big problem on Lancaster canal is the locals take the best moorings and leave the boat for the week empty and just visit at weekends and if $ X $ were to see this post he would confirm that.

 

Yes, I agree that people leaving boats there is a problem. There certainly are also some (local) boaters who do not have a permanent mooring on the Lancaster canal and are regular moorers at the popular spots, which includes Lancaster city. Some of these also leave their boats there sometimes. IMO 7 days is too generous for Lancaster and 48 hours would be more appropriate.

[cotswoldsman]

Yes, I agree that people leaving boats there is a problem. There certainly are also some (local) boaters who do not have a permanent mooring on the Lancaster canal and are regular moorers at the popular spots, which includes Lancaster city. Some of these also leave their boats there sometimes. IMO 7 days is too generous for Lancaster and 48 hours would be more appropriate.

 

yes they should be 48 hours I agree

[mayalld]

I am not familiar with this area so I had a look on Google maps and there appears to be miles of empty towpath to the south of Furness Vale, why is this not suitable for mooring?

 

Well, as I said, the length immediately south of the mooring area in question is opposite Furness Vale Marina (actually an off-side mooring with herringbone pontoons), and mooring is not permitted opposite (for the very good reason that it would prevent boats in the marina from getting in and out of their moorings).

 

From Station road (by Furness Vale Railway Station), southwards, there is insufficient depth of water and/or underwater obstructions which make mooring impossible. Not only because it would be difficult to get ashore, but because the navigation channel is so narrow that a moored boat would actually block the canal in many places.

 

The next possible mooring going south is close to Bridgemont Junction.