Boat painting

[LEO]

There's a guy painting a 40' narrowboat near me, doing all the work by himself. So far he's taken about a week in preparation and has just got a coat of primer on. Ok, he's not removing the windows and mushroom vents but he's doing a good job and having talked to him about paint he seems to know what he's doing. Anyway, I asked him about doing my 12' x 57' widebeam and he quoted me £1,800 (not including paint), which having seen some of the figures on this thread seems like a very good price.

 

Hi,

 

Seems a good price, but guarantee, cash or VAT, covered dock, sign writing, proper disposal of waste materials, colour schemes and 3rd party insurance to cover accidents to your or other's property?.

 

Albi

[Phil Speight]

Hi,

 

Seems a good price, but guarantee, cash or VAT, covered dock, sign writing, proper disposal of waste materials, colour schemes and 3rd party insurance to cover accidents to your or other's property?.

 

Albi

Wether it`s a good price or not depends on what you consider a "good job" and what it looks like in a couple of years time. That said it may well be very good value for money - but that doesn`t stop a job costing five times as much ALSO being good value for money. The world is full of people who "know" about paint. I spend hours a week listening to them and banging my head against a metaphorical wall.

Phil

[denboy]

There will always be a basic end of the market and a prestige end of the market whether you pay £500 or £8000 (there are more red oxide and grey primer boats out there than shinny ones )its upto the customer if hes happy then fine you gets what you pay for at the end of the day although if i had an expensive paint job i would be a bit nervous of scrapping it with the over hanging foliage that nobody seems to cut down

[Bones]

I am pleased Gibbo asked this question because I have been wondering too. What I DO know is that the paint jobs done professionally are by far better than those not. I also know that some boatyards who biuld and paint boats are absolutely APPAULING at doing things like sign writing, which just ruins the look of the boat. I wonder whether the price is so high because it is a price that can be charged, or do the actual materials cost and enormous amount, and are the painters paid the same as footballers? I think this is what is interesting to know. Do other painters give guarantees for their work?

 

I dont think the average person can do as good a paint job as the professionals, and painting is a skilled job. The professional jobs look so much better than those done by hand.

 

Personally I would love to have my boat painted professionally, it would really make a huge improvement. The problem is I can't justify paying nearly half what I paid for the boat on the paint work. All I can do is do my best to protect the steel and do it myself.

 

 

 

There will always be a basic end of the market and a prestige end of the market whether you pay £500 or £8000 (there are more red oxide and grey primer boats out there than shinny ones )its upto the customer if hes happy then fine you gets what you pay for at the end of the day although if i had an expensive paint job i would be a bit nervous of scrapping it with the over hanging foliage that nobody seems to cut down

if you scrape a hand painted boat it isn't pretty, but these professionally done ones have so many layers on them you really have to scrape it hard to get anywhere near the primer!

[Malarky]

Quality of finish depends on how easy you can touch up the paint without it "shreeking" at you, and the extent of preparation, the desired finish can affect price, but a major factor is dependant on if the painter is required to restore the metalwork or not, and unless it is done by the painter, no guarantee is possible.

These potential requirements put the price in the kind of bracket that could be percieved only a rich idiot would pay, then you'r sitting on a thin line of paying through the nose and being ripped off into the bargain, so regardless of what people think of them, some will pay an extra few grand for the peace of mind that they are getting what they want... a job well done and out of the way, leaving peace of mind, and time to contemplate whatever it is "rich idiots" think about!

There is no reason a £12000 job can't be done for £2000, but you'll be very lucky to find it, and you'll never get that kind of workmanship on demand.

[Gibbo]

Well I went to see another boat painter today. Saw one in progress, all stripped back to bare metal where required (not everywhere). Looked at three they'd just completed, very, very nice finish, looked almost like they'd been sprayed. Lovely. 5 or 6 coats in total (depending upon what they actually need). Quote for my 70 footer, £4500. Now that's more reasonable in my eyes. I've booked her in.

 

Gibbo

[Bones]

thats good Gibbo!

 

I forgot to add in my previous post that I am saving up for a boat paint job and Phil Speight will be getting my business.

[Mukiwa]

thats good Gibbo!

 

I forgot to add in my previous post that I am saving up for a boat paint job and Phil Speight will be getting my business.

You won't regret it. We have just had our 2nd paint job from Phil and it is worth every penny. I have tried cheaper in the past and it did not take long for problems to show.

With Phil you will get design genius, impressive quality, attention to detail, a finish to die for, and longevity. Although I have had no reason to test it I'm sure you will also get excellent after sales service. Phil is passionate about his reputation and ensures that every job enhances it.

[smileypete]

Personally I would love to have my boat painted professionally, it would really make a huge improvement. The problem is I can't justify paying nearly half what I paid for the boat on the paint work. All I can do is do my best to protect the steel and do it myself.

 

I'd consider getting someone like Phil to do the sides and possibly front/back then do the rest myself with his paint.

 

cheers,

Pete.

[Phil Speight]

You won't regret it. We have just had our 2nd paint job from Phil and it is worth every penny. I have tried cheaper in the past and it did not take long for problems to show.

With Phil you will get design genius, impressive quality, attention to detail, a finish to die for, and longevity. Although I have had no reason to test it I'm sure you will also get excellent after sales service. Phil is passionate about his reputation and ensures that every job enhances it.

You`re very kind - thank you. ( And cheers by the way ). However, before even more of my fellow painters decide to hate me I must say this; a lot of the things we can afford to do because of the price we charge are to hopefully prevent problems later that MAY NOT ACTUALLY ARISE. In otherwords we sometimes do things that later prove to have been unnecessary. It could therefor be said that we have done too much and consequently charged more than could have been the case. It gives us reassurance to know though that we have done all that could practically have been done to ensure a long lasting job. It`s a choice I made years ago . It makes us pricey ( to say the least as some would have it ) but enough customers agree with the policy to keep us in work. I`m retiring soon (though the dock will carry on producing exactly the same standard of work ) and I wouldn`t want to change the way things are done at Dadford`s so late in the day even if I saw some sense in doing so.Which I don`t.

There`s plenty of work to go round - so vive le difference - or whatever the foreign chappies say.

Phil

[Smelly]

I've seen some of your work recently Phil; you'll probably remember "Sometime" and I believe you did the signwriting...

 

If I had the money I'd be at your door.

 

Nuff said.

[bag 'o' bones]

Interesting thread.

A few questions:

 

Why are 12 coats of paint better than say four?

 

Cars used to be brush painted and now are sprayed with modern paints that adhere better than any enamel are thinner and lasts a lot longer?

 

Something i've noticed on here that the boating fraternity *seem* resistive to new ideas?

[Phil Speight]

Interesting thread.

A few questions:

 

Why are 12 coats of paint better than say four?

 

Cars used to be brush painted and now are sprayed with modern paints that adhere better than any enamel are thinner and lasts a lot longer?

 

Something i've noticed on here that the boating fraternity *seem* resistive to new ideas?

Good points.

Assuming we are talking about a synthetic enamel based paint system - which I have been throughout ; the steel industry would recommend a minimum of 6 coats ( for instance , two each of primer , undercoat, and gloss ) to protect the steel . We prefer to put more coats on 1) because it allows us to rub down more thoroughly , 2) it gives a deeper and richer finish which should last very well and make a solid foundation for any subsequent repaints and/or repair work,

3) it is often necessary these days to put a number of coats on some "chrome" colours ( most reds and yellows for instance ) because the lawmakers seem to object to the widespread use of lead chromate in paint which affedts the opacity.

Spray finishes are very often quicker and (should be cheaper) and can have a very fine finish. However , in my experience, this finish is often acheived by buffing the paint with rubbing compound - at the expense of film thickness in a method where there is going to be less paint applied anyway. We`ve repainted a number of sprayed boats - and very often they`ve not been painted long before the owners have felt the need to book them in with us. This is not to say that boats don`t get well painted with spray guns - many do . Incidentally, the adhesion of enamel paint is not in question if it has been properly done . If you don`t cut any corners it will stick like the proverbial whatsit to a blanket.

Modern car finishes are of a sophistication way beyond any sprayed narrow boat finishes.and it isn`t really a valid comparison - but one of the many totally uncontraversial reasons we would never give up our brushes is that we just couln`t afford the sort of facilities we would need to spray paint properly.

Then again , why bother - we`re happy enough as we are! I don`t see why the spray or brush question is even remotely contentious. Each has it`s virtues ,

I don`t think there is much competition between the ywo and it is good that both are there for the customer to choose from.

Phil

Edited August 17, 2008 by Phil Speight

[blackrose]

Hi,

 

Seems a good price, but guarantee, cash or VAT, covered dock, sign writing, proper disposal of waste materials, colour schemes and 3rd party insurance to cover accidents to your or other's property?.

 

Albi

 

Probably not, that's why he's not quoting £8000

[blackrose]

Wether it`s a good price or not depends on what you consider a "good job" and what it looks like in a couple of years time. That said it may well be very good value for money - but that doesn`t stop a job costing five times as much ALSO being good value for money.

 

Yes, of course, and I didn't say an expensive job wasn't good value for money - but it's not good value for me because it's not what I want. I'll be doing a DIY job on my boat because the finish is not so important to me. I won't use expensive "marine paint" as I don't think it matters what you use, it can always get scraped off when you move. (I make an exception for deck paint because I don't want to use sand and safety on decks is paramount). Personally I don't want a perfectly smooth finish on my boat because it just highlights the scratches & scrapes. An 'industrial' rollered orange peel finish is fine by me and it's easy to touch up.

Edited August 18, 2008 by blackrose

[Ott3r]

I hope that I'm not hijacking this thread, but as it seemd to be on the right topic.... I'm also looking at repainting my boat, and being on a tight budget, I want to do most of the work myself. At the moment the biggest job that I can see ahead is the preparation. I was considering getting a company to do the preparation using Ultra High Pressure water jetting.. I've been quoted £800 for the job, and was wondering if anyone else has used his sort of service, and whether the knowledgable folks out there think that it's a good option?

[Malarky]

Well I went to see another boat painter today. Saw one in progress, all stripped back to bare metal where required (not everywhere). Looked at three they'd just completed, very, very nice finish, looked almost like they'd been sprayed. Lovely. 5 or 6 coats in total (depending upon what they actually need). Quote for my 70 footer, £4500. Now that's more reasonable in my eyes. I've booked her in.

 

Gibbo

 

 

I hope that I'm not hijacking this thread, but as it seemd to be on the right topic.... I'm also looking at repainting my boat, and being on a tight budget, I want to do most of the work myself. At the moment the biggest job that I can see ahead is the preparation. I was considering getting a company to do the preparation using Ultra High Pressure water jetting.. I've been quoted £800 for the job, and was wondering if anyone else has used his sort of service, and whether the knowledgable folks out there think that it's a good option?

 

To keep costs down, don't start by throwing good paint away!

Edited August 19, 2008 by Malarky

[tomandsophie]

I never used to understand why it cost so much money to get a boat painted. Then I had a go at doing it myself! I spent around 4 weeks painting our brand new boat 3 years ago. It looked absolutely amazing when we launched and I thought to myself "Why would anybody pay £6000 or more to have somebody do what I have just done in 4 weeks?". However, 3 years on and I'm now spending my summer holiday (primary school teacher) painting again! Not that my paintjob was bad, but it's beginning to reach the end of its life. I have just spent 4 full days sanding the roof (rusty bits back to shiny metal), putting on 2 coats of primer, and I have just today finished putting on the first topcoat of Anti-Slip Deck paint (thanks Phil Speight, excellent stuff!). It takes a long time and is really hard work. One day, when I can afford it, I'll pay somebody who really knows what they're doing. Here's hoping...

[kitman]

Can someone explain to me where the price of between 6 and 12 grand comes from for repainting a 70 foot boat?

 

I've seen many of them done on a commercial basis and it's 2 weeks work (max) for a painter and his chimp.

 

I'm curious why the price seems to be 4 times what it should be. Have I missed something?

 

Gibbo

 

 

I didn't know other painter's were charging 12 grand for a re-paint now Gibbo, I need to put my prices up! <Rubs hands together> OOOO Money Money Money!! It's not funny, in a rich man's world!!

 

Damn my chimp will be happy, more bannanas for you Chimpey!

 

[Phil Speight]

I didn't know other painter's were charging 12 grand for a re-paint now Gibbo, I need to put my prices up! <Rubs hands together> OOOO Money Money Money!! It's not funny, in a rich man's world!!

 

Damn my chimp will be happy, more bannanas for you Chimpey!

 

Likewise - 12 grand would be very nice ! Who`s charging that much anyway?

Phil