Basins north of Grove Basin - Cannock Extension

[stort_mark]

Wonder if any of the BCN experts can answer some questions.

What were the two basins almost at the current end of the Cannock Extension? There are two infilled basins on the east side of the canal..about 400 yards before the end.

 

On a slightly related note, where does the infamous 'bandit country' start and end? I know about the Harden estate, but can anyone recommend safe (or at least safer) mooring points either side of bandit country.

[stort_mark]

Just realised that they are the Conduit Colliery Basins - only one is shown on Wikipedia map and mentioned in one book - but there were two. Connected by tramway to Conduit Colliery. Useful background also at http://www.bhills-history.fsnet.co.uk/coal_mining.htm

Edited January 27, 2008 by stort_mark

[Hairy-Neil]

Just realised that they are the Conduit Colliery Basins - only one is shown on Wikipedia map and mentioned in one book - but there were two. Connected by tramway to Conduit Colliery. Useful background also at http://www.bhills-history.fsnet.co.uk/coal_mining.htm

 

Also try 'The Other Sixty Miles' By Richard Chester-Browne. Published by The Birmingham Canal Navigations Society

[pearley]

My 1984 BCN guide shows them both as Conduit Colliery. It shows two railway tracks between the basins and one either side.

[Hairy-Neil]

I've just checked my copy of 'The Other 60 Miles' and there's no mention of the basins. Only the derelict part of the Cannock Extention beyond the A5 crossing makes it in.

 

BTW, there's a copy of this excellent book on Ebay ATM, currently at the bargain price of £1.00 clicky

[weed slipper]

I've just checked my copy of 'The Other 60 Miles' and there's no mention of the basins. Only the derelict part of the Cannock Extention beyond the A5 crossing makes it in.

 

BTW, there's a copy of this excellent book on Ebay ATM, currently at the bargain price of £1.00 clicky

Hello, first time on here so hope this works.

As far as I know the basins north of the A5 (now filled in and under Norton Canes Builders Merchants) served the Conduit colliery, the two to the south (and again east of the extension) which I think are the ones you meant were for a different pit.

The name of it escapes me at the moment, but the pit buildings are in use today as a crane repair/test business just south of the A5 by the "shant"bridge near the Rising Sun Hotel. A tramway ran to the basins, bits of rail used to be ploughed up untill about 15 years ago.the basins have now sunk due to subsidence.

As to the safe moorings whilst in bandit country you have Sneyd, The Fingerpost (formerly the Royal Oak Pelsall) opposite our yard on the extension, Brownhills visitor facility and Longwood top lock.

The wyrley is good at the moment due to low weed and high water.

[MartinClark]

As far as I know the basins north of the A5 (now filled in and under Norton Canes Builders Merchants) served the Conduit colliery, the two to the south (and again east of the extension) which I think are the ones you meant were for a different pit.

The name of it escapes me at the moment,

 

Looking at www.old-maps.co.uk it would seem that both pits were called Conduit Colliery. It may have been that both pitheads led to parts of the same mine workings underground or else there were two separate pits owned by the same company. I'm sure I have heard of other pits that had more than one shaft giving access so that seems a possible answer. The basins both north and south of the A5 could therefore have been known as Conduit Colliery basins.

[stort_mark]

Hello, first time on here so hope this works.

As far as I know the basins north of the A5 (now filled in and under Norton Canes Builders Merchants) served the Conduit colliery, the two to the south (and again east of the extension) which I think are the ones you meant were for a different pit.

The name of it escapes me at the moment, but the pit buildings are in use today as a crane repair/test business just south of the A5 by the "shant"bridge near the Rising Sun Hotel. A tramway ran to the basins, bits of rail used to be ploughed up untill about 15 years ago.the basins have now sunk due to subsidence.

As to the safe moorings whilst in bandit country you have Sneyd, The Fingerpost (formerly the Royal Oak Pelsall) opposite our yard on the extension, Brownhills visitor facility and Longwood top lock.

The wyrley is good at the moment due to low weed and high water.

 

Thanks for this; you obviously have great local knowledge! I think there were around 4 pits in the area and the old maps (one is the 1889 1:10,000 but I have seen others online through to around the 1920s) show the Conduit Colliery up at the A5, Cathedral Pit just to the SE of it, Wyrley Common Pit a few hundred metres south, and Coppice Colliery to the north of Coppice Lane (served by the Slough Arm?). And, of course, Grove Pit.

 

There was a second Conduit Colliery in Norton Canes (or it extended a long way) - to the east of Walsall Road - as well as Norton Green Colliery, and I assume that they were both served by the wharfs (one of which now lies directly underneath Conduit Road off Betty's Lane there and the other longer one just to the east (with a big basin just to the south of the old railway line).

 

Thanks also for the tips on moorings. I am hoping to rent a boa to see the area, but my family are still needing some persuading that Walsall, Tipton and Ocker Hill are a better holiday destination than Stratford, Oxford or Tenerife.

 

I have also managed to trace the line (using old maps overlaid onto Google Earth) right the way up to Hednesford: so much gone, but so much to see.

 

My next question is that in July 1960, the canal sank 20 feet and the banks had to be constantly shored up: where exactly was this?

[MartinClark]

I am hoping to rent a boa to see the area,

 

That should be useful - the Wyrley and Essington does snake around a lot!

 

[stort_mark]

That should be useful - the Wyrley and Essington does snake around a lot!

 

 

And given that a fair amount seems to be shallow, it will be a feather boa.

[weed slipper]

And given that a fair amount seems to be shallow, it will be a feather boa.

You are right Mark about shallow bits on the Wyrley. The worst is from New Cross Bridge by Bentley Bridge retail park up to Lane Head bridge where I picked up a nice carpet on saturday!

Having said that we still did Broad Street basin to Norton Canes in 4 hours which is a personal best. Another boat did the reverse trip in 5 hours on thursday. By far the worst thing on the wyrley(appart from kids) is the weed. Shallows and rubbish arnt actualy that bad but throw in the weed and you are looking at 6hrs plus.The council houses have been torn down in Goscote so that horror is gone.

Hope you can make it up here as we need all the traffic we can get, if you have any trouble report it to BW using their own complaint procedure (on their site). This way complaints are logged and local BW have evidense of problems and can ask for money from national BW to sort it out. Will ask the old man about Cathedral Pit and the subsidense in the 60s.

 

M

[Hobbler]

Thanks for this; you obviously have great local knowledge! I think there were around 4 pits in the area and the old maps (one is the 1889 1:10,000 but I have seen others online through to around the 1920s) show the Conduit Colliery up at the A5, Cathedral Pit just to the SE of it, Wyrley Common Pit a few hundred metres south, and Coppice Colliery to the north of Coppice Lane (served by the Slough Arm?). And, of course, Grove Pit.

 

There was a second Conduit Colliery in Norton Canes (or it extended a long way) - to the east of Walsall Road - as well as Norton Green Colliery, and I assume that they were both served by the wharfs (one of which now lies directly underneath Conduit Road off Betty's Lane there and the other longer one just to the east (with a big basin just to the south of the old railway line).

 

Thanks also for the tips on moorings. I am hoping to rent a boa to see the area, but my family are still needing some persuading that Walsall, Tipton and Ocker Hill are a better holiday destination than Stratford, Oxford or Tenerife.

 

I have also managed to trace the line (using old maps overlaid onto Google Earth) right the way up to Hednesford: so much gone, but so much to see.

 

 

I believe there were as many as 9 pits in the Conduit Group , one was known as Jerome Pit as the Manager was the father of Jerome K Jerome . The basin on the other side of the A5 was I think called the Norton Springs Branch .

 

My next question is that in July 1960, the canal sank 20 feet and the banks had to be constantly shored up: where exactly was this?

[AMModels]

I know tat they used a particular brand of clay to shore up the depressions, it was called red tockey (not sure of the spelling) and was carried to the site by boat and then shovelled over the side into the area where the brickies were building up the banks, there were and probably still are places where you need a very long shaft to be able to reach the bottom due to the subsidence causing a very deep hole in the canal bed. The bank work was filled using ashes from power stations and companies who used coal along the canal as a back load and was backfilled by shovel by the boatmen, along with some of the red tockey to give it 'body'.

[pearley]

You are right Mark about shallow bits on the Wyrley. The worst is from New Cross Bridge by Bentley Bridge retail park up to Lane Head bridge where I picked up a nice carpet on saturday!

Having said that we still did Broad Street basin to Norton Canes in 4 hours which is a personal best. Another boat did the reverse trip in 5 hours on thursday. By far the worst thing on the wyrley(appart from kids) is the weed. Shallows and rubbish arnt actualy that bad but throw in the weed and you are looking at 6hrs plus.The council houses have been torn down in Goscote so that horror is gone.

Hope you can make it up here as we need all the traffic we can get, if you have any trouble report it to BW using their own complaint procedure (on their site). This way complaints are logged and local BW have evidense of problems and can ask for money from national BW to sort it out. Will ask the old man about Cathedral Pit and the subsidense in the 60s.

 

M

We came from Walsall to Wolverhampton last week, staying at Sneyd on Friday night and Bentley Bridge on Saturday. Agree about the worst part being Lane Head to Bentley Bridge bur we also had trouble just after leaving Birchills Junction where builders seem to have thrown a lot of rubbish into the bridge hole. Took us ages to free ourselves from a scaffold pole in the water. E-mailed BW but don't know if they've sorted it.

 

You forgot to mention Walsall Town Arm as a mooring. We've moored there several times with no problems and the Wharf Inn serves a good pint of Highgate Saddlers bitter.

[weed slipper]

We came from Walsall to Wolverhampton last week, staying at Sneyd on Friday night and Bentley Bridge on Saturday. Agree about the worst part being Lane Head to Bentley Bridge bur we also had trouble just after leaving Birchills Junction where builders seem to have thrown a lot of rubbish into the bridge hole. Took us ages to free ourselves from a scaffold pole in the water. E-mailed BW but don't know if they've sorted it.

 

You forgot to mention Walsall Town Arm as a mooring. We've moored there several times with no problems and the Wharf Inn serves a good pint of Highgate Saddlers bitter.

Looks like I got it wrong about which pit was served by which basin, according to the wise old oracle the old man. These basins served Conduit No2. The crane business I mentioned is Cathedral Pit which linked to the Slough Branch.A lot of the Extension has sunk over the years, when the M6 Toll was built through the line of it you could see how far down the brickwork goes. We have pictures of the canal north of the A5 full of abandoned joeys. Apparently the bit that sank 21 foot in a week was just north west of Norton Canes. Interesting about the "tockey".

Glad to hear someone moored in the basin in Walsall without problem, personaly I wouldnt let the boat out of my site there. If you are on it or can see it from the pub thats not so bad. Some little Bs nicked all the mushroom vent tops of the trip boat a while back!

[AMModels]

weed slipper, who's your old man? He might know mine...

[SteveE]

We have pictures of the canal north of the A5 full of abandoned joeys. Apparently the bit that sank 21 foot in a week was just north west of Norton Canes.

 

The Bantock butty from which our boat was constructed in the 60's was rescued from the Canock extension. I have two pics taken around that period but would be interested to see others.

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SteveE

[richardf]

I used to moor at Dennis Coopers yard - Canal Transport Services - he gave really good talks about the Cannock Extension Canal - and mentioned the boats that were left and ultimately backfilled when they abandoned the length after the A5. It would be worth talking to him about photos - he has retired now, but I believe Matthew (his son) now runs the business. Dennis is a wealth of knowledge on this canal

[stort_mark]

Great photographs...but such a sad end to all the boats.

Anyone know how many were rescued. Presumably these are all undergound now. When you say that it was to the NW of Norton Canes...where is that? The area now covered by new housing? Or in the countryside before Rumer Hill? If so, would that be in the 'completely destroyed part' where the mine was, or in the section that can still be traced on the ground?

 

...Just curious!

[weed slipper]

weed slipper, who's your old man? He might know mine...

The old man is Denis Cooper, I,m Matt.

Will try to prise some more info out of him re the extension etc.

All this reminds me of many a night in the back room of the Holly Bush listening to tales about the old days, hence the slight inability to get the facts exactly right!

[SteveE]

Great photographs...but such a sad end to all the boats.

Anyone know how many were rescued. Presumably these are all undergound now. When you say that it was to the NW of Norton Canes...where is that? The area now covered by new housing? Or in the countryside before Rumer Hill? If so, would that be in the 'completely destroyed part' where the mine was, or in the section that can still be traced on the ground?

 

...Just curious!

 

 

As far as I can tell it was Here, but others may know more.........

SteveE

[stort_mark]

All this reminds me of many a night in the back room of the Holly Bush listening to tales about the old days, hence the slight inability to get the facts exactly right!

 

Keep the memories coming! It's all interesting stuff. After all, an inability to get the facts exactly right has never stopped a journalist!

[Heartland]

The images of the abandoned coal boats on the Cannock Extension is now a rare insight into that period when the north part of the Cannock Extension was abandoned. The east side basins on the canal still in water served a section of the Conduit pits, although the major Conduit pits (Jerome & Norton Green) were north of the A5 and it was No 3, or Jerome, that had that wide basin and pit tub tramways alongside.

 

On the West side are the disused basin that served Wyrley Grove Colliery. There was a colliery railway bridge that crossed the canal to serve the screens of this pit and take the coal to the LNWE/LMS/BR Norton Branch. A narrow gauge rope worked tramway also brought coal down from Wyrley No 3 pit. The standard gauge mineral railway served Cathedral Colliery before Grove opened and the locomotive shed was initailly located there. This shed and premises did survive and perhaps still does, although I have not been there for some years.

 

Ray Shill

[Capt Ahab]

I always understood that the collaped section was near the Churchbidge Locks / Rumer Hill Junct and is therefore in the bit destroyed by opencast mining- But I may be wrong.

 

We came from Walsall to Wolverhampton last week, staying at Sneyd on Friday night and Bentley Bridge on Saturday. Agree about the worst part being Lane Head to Bentley Bridge bur we also had trouble just after leaving Birchills Junction where builders seem to have thrown a lot of rubbish into the bridge hole. Took us ages to free ourselves from a scaffold pole in the water. E-mailed BW but don't know if they've sorted it.

 

You forgot to mention Walsall Town Arm as a mooring. We've moored there several times with no problems and the Wharf Inn serves a good pint of Highgate Saddlers bitter.

Not sure about Walsall Town Arm - nb Firefly had her windows stove in when she was there a week before this years Challenge.

[RLWP]

 

Not sure about Walsall Town Arm - nb Firefly had her windows stove in when she was there a week before this years Challenge.

 

Maybe it was OK in 2008 - they certainly don't do any good bitter now

 

Richard