Top gate paddles

[Philip]

Undoubtedly one of the most feared feared features on locks by many and in some cases, for very good reason! However, I'd be interested to know who leaves them (on narrow locks with baffles) for a few minutes until the lock is nearly full and who puts them up quickly with the ground paddles. To me, as long as the boat is short enough in length, for the jets of water not to reach the front deck of the hull and providing it is a narrow lock, they are safe and pretty fun to watch as well!

 

I know the Shropshire Union, Staffs and Worcs, Trent and Mersey and Leeds and Liverpool canals have them on the top gates, does anyone know of any other canal that has top gate paddkes?

 

I also prefer the traditional style of gate paddle (however stiff they are) that take a couple of turns to get up and with a long rack, rather than these modern, noisy mundane looking paddles found on the Shroppie, Trent and Mersey and Llangollen Canals!

[Liam]

So you like getting your boat covered in the water which pours through the paddles at an alarming rate aswell as have your boat bobbing around like a cork?

 

Madness

[DHutch]

We always leave the paddels till there atleast 95% covered.

 

- Otherwise, as liam says, it all get a bit crasy, and the people sitting on the foredeck get wet!

 

 

Daniel

[Liam]

Bit of randomness here... but it's on the subject of getting wet/safety

 

Always remember to close your bow, and if poss stern doors when locking. You can either end up with something simple like a wet doormat or even worse - a cabin fit for a frog. Also remember to close side hatches/doors, the water sometimes comes out of the brick word and into where ever your side door leads....

 

A while ago I was moored up between the tunnels at Saltesford on the T&M, and a hire boat came out of the lock and its side doors were hanging off because they didn't close them and they were obviously caught on the tunnel wall... something else to keep in mind!

[dor]

Shroppie etc top gate paddles:

 

Half open until the cill is covered, then open up fully.

 

I consider it irresponsible to do it any other way, even with as 50' boat in a 70' lock.

 

I was once in Beeston stone lock when a couple came along and whacked open all the top paddles before I could say anything. Te boat was tossed about like a cork and the people on the boat were terrified.

 

After my reaction and words I don't think that couple will do it again in a hurry.

 

Too much can go wrong in a lock, especially when it starts filling - you need to be in control.

[Bernie]

It's only a few years since a man was killed at Audlem locks because someone opened all of the paddles too quickly. the boat shot forward and he was thrown from the stern. OK he probably wasn't paying attention but it doesn't change the situation.

[Philip]

It's only a few years since a man was killed at Audlem locks because someone opened all of the paddles too quickly. the boat shot forward and he was thrown from the stern. OK he probably wasn't paying attention but it doesn't change the situation.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

How many years ago was the Audlem incident? Anyway most have baffles so the water shoots out to the side and smashes on the lock chamber wall. I saw someone at Wheaton Aston Lock over Easter going up, the boat right up to the sill, top gate paddle up first, but because it had baffles, it didn't pour into the front deck, just splashed against the gunwall sp?. Just my opinion, but if a top gate has a gate paddle, providing it has a full baffle (not with those slits some of them have), they are on the whole, usually, reasonably safe! We've been boating on the Shropshire Union and Llangollen canals for about 20 years now, we've so far only had concerns with Wardle Lock, when the ground paddle current used to pull the boat forward uncontrollably, until they fixed the ground paddles to wind only half way. Apart from that lock, no worries over 20 years with any of the locks, even with top gate paddles. I suppose that might be down to how alert we are in locks (like if a particular lock pulled us forward quickly, we'd drop the top gate paddle and wait at least until its over the sill).

[Bernie]

How many years ago was the Audlem incident?

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No more than 6.

[paulf]

Theres some on the GU south , top of the Hanwell flight if I remember correctly . I didnt use them we werent in a rush . After watching hire boaters getting hung up on cills on the caen hill flight and such like last week, I think gate paddles could be very dodgy for the inexperienced boater .

 

regards Paul

[Paul@CW]

Like many I only open them when the water is right up to them. My 5 year old loves to watch the force of them when you are filling an empty lock though.

[DHutch]

My 5 year old loves to watch the force of them when you are filling an empty lock though.

 

Hehe! - fun isnt it!

 

And of cause, theres not reason not to use the gate paddles straight away if the lock is empty (and i also enjoy watching the water!! - Especailly the ones that done have any baffles!)

 

 

 

Daniel

[Philip]

Hehe! - fun isnt it!

 

And of cause, theres not reason not to use the gate paddles straight away if the lock is empty (and i also enjoy watching the water!! - Especailly the ones that done have any baffles!)

Daniel

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Are there any without baffles now? All the L & L locks have baffles, as does Hoole Lane Lock in Chester. Well, I suppose they're baffles, those baffle types look like a fan!

 

Incidently, I'd like to know off anyone who knows, the 7th lock down on the Audlem flight (next to bridge 77), had the rack on the top gate paddle in October 2000, then when I next went through in June 2002, it had snapped off and looked off for some time. If anyone knows what month in what year roughly it snapped, or remembers if the rack was on or off in 2001, could you tell me please - you might think it crazy, but gate paddles are one of numerous items about the canals I'm eagerly interested in!

[DHutch]

Are there any without baffles now?

 

No, i dont think so. you have to make do with ons that just have lovers now!

 

 

 

Daniel

[Guest]

After watching hire boaters getting hung up on cills on the caen hill flight and such like last week, I think gate paddles could be very dodgy for the inexperienced boater .

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Paul

Being inexperienced, I dont understand the connection between gate paddles, relative to ground paddles, and getting hung up on the cill.

Or do you mean that inexperienced enough to get hung up on the cill, means inexperienced enough to be caught out by gate paddles?

 

Peter

[DHutch]

Paul

Being inexperienced, I dont understand the connection between gate paddles, relative to ground paddles, and getting hung up on the cill.

Or do you mean that inexperienced enough to get hung up on the cill, means inexperienced enough to be caught out by gate paddles?

 

Peter

 

I can only assume he means the latter. I cant see how you could get hung up on the cill while using the gate paddels (or not) as you only use the paddels at that end when going up!

 

 

Dainel

[Guest]

Daniel

Thats what I thought, but when you're new there's always the doubt that mabey you haven't understood something ....

[paulf]

Sorry if I confused you all , We saw a catalogue of errors on the K&A over Easter mainly Hire boats . I dont like to point the finger at hire boats as some of them are infinitely more experienced than myself . But we did watch boats at alverchurch. One pulled out with the instructor on board did the fifty yards to the bridge hole instructor jumps off lesson over . We then followed them until they met a boat coming the other way at the wrong time and ended up wrong side of the canal and in the bankside bramble bush . We did chuckle , been there done that I thought . Then various other incidents culminating in another boat `hung up` on a cill on the devizes flight with the 2 crews just stood watching the poor guy .Everyone at a loss as to what to do . My point is I could imagine the inexperienced tackling top gate paddles and ending up sunk quite easily . When I look back , I was fortunate that the first lock I ever encountered had top gate paddles . At the time I had never worked a lock or knew how . Luckily , A bw chap was coming the opposite way and I asked him . He took the time to show us what to do . sorry for any confusion .

 

Regards Paul

[bottle]

Although I do not condone the low level of tuition at Alvechurch on the K&A.

 

Alvechurch always send "The Boaters Handbook" to all hirers perhaps these were the ones that did not read it before their holiday.

 

I personally always hire from Alvechurch but have not used their K&A site. All the sites I've used have always done an excellent handover and tuition if required.

 

I have no connection with them except hiring their boats

[Guest]

My point is I could imagine the inexperienced tackling top gate paddles and ending up sunk quite easily . When I look back , I was fortunate that the first lock I ever encountered had top gate paddles .                                     

                                              Regards Paul

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Paul (anyone)

I'm having trouble understanding the problem here. The only locks I've done on our own are from the marina - Otherton at Penkridge on the S&W, north west up towards Great Heywood.

Is it a case of I've never seen what you are talking about? Or is it just "top gate paddles in general"?

When we did our Inland Waterways Helmsman Course, we were told always to open ground paddles first, and only open the gate paddles when the water had stopped surging. All paddle opening to be done slowly at first, with caution and watch the water. Thats what I've done on the two occasions we've been out on our short runs and we've never had any problems.

What am I missing here?

 

Peter (confused)

[bottle]

<SNIPPED>

we were told always to open ground paddles first, and only open the gate paddles when the water had stopped surging. All paddle opening to be done slowly at first, with caution and watch the water.

 

Peter (confused) 

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Peter this is absolutely correct and is the safest way. Having done the course you will be safer than most others on the cut.

I have not done the course yet but read all the books, I could find on the subject, before my first trip.

I also arrived early and discussed every aspect (?) of boating with the marina staff to make sure I was on the right lines with my theory.

[jmj]

How soon how far and how fast I open gate paddles varies from lock to lock - on a shallow lock they might be underwater to start with, so they can be opened early and quickly, on a deep lock with no baffles, I would start once the water is up to the bottom of the gate paddle and continue to gradually open as the level rises, always being prepared to drop them if necessary - I think this bit is where beginers can get in trouble by just standing there watching as the boat sinks rather than dropping the paddles and sorting it out.

 

Therefore I would say that if you know what you're doing there is no hard and fast rule, but if you are unsure then never open them until they are fully covered.

 

Of course, some locks only have gate paddles so all you can do is open them carefully. I can't recall where I've seen this, and by now this might have changed, but I'm sure I've seen it somewhere?????

[Philip]

How soon how far and how fast I open gate paddles varies from lock to lock - on a shallow lock they might be underwater to start with, so they can be opened early and quickly, on a deep lock with no baffles, I would start once the water is up to the bottom of the gate paddle and continue to gradually open as the level rises, always being prepared to drop them if necessary - I think this bit is where beginers can get in trouble by just standing there watching as the boat sinks rather than dropping the paddles and sorting it out.

 

Therefore I would say that if you know what you're doing there is no hard and fast rule, but if you are unsure then never open them until they are fully covered.

 

Of course, some locks only have gate paddles so all you can do is open them carefully. I can't recall where I've seen this, and by now this might have changed, but I'm sure I've seen it somewhere?????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The locks on the Trent and Mersey near Shardlow - Swarkestone, Stenson, Weston, Aston, Shardlow, Derwent Mouth etc I think have two gate paddles on each top gate, so 4 overall, but with no ground paddles, Stenson as well is about 12 foot!

How deep is Derwent Mouth? It doesn't say in the Nicholson's, or the Pearson's.

[Tim]

I think you'll find that there is no stated depth to Derwent mouth lock as the river will vary considerably in depth from time to time.

 

I think some of the locks between Readind and Newbury are gate paddle only, I remember a particularly viscious one somewhere along here (can't remember which though!) which needed care, especially with 70ft.

[Tim]

Brain cells restored to full working order, it was Towney Lock.