BilgePump

Hell's bells. That's three times what my boat cost!

Yup, was sorely disappointed when I bought a set of 3 for £15 only to realise that they were just 3x99p bike lights with a colour tint. Chocolate fireguard/teapot comes to mind.

Only have limited experience of north west narrow canals but I would say that there was still improvement from the seventies through to the new millenium, things started getting a bit iffy and have then gone seriously downhill since the creation of CaRT a decade ago. Nowadays, there are no banksmen, no proper lock keepers, no blue workboats. Almost everything is paid contractors and unpaid volunteers. Sell off assets, reduce maintenance and redundancy in the system and you have the perfect storm that was the near Todbrook failure in 2019 and the consequent problems of water availability on the Upper Peak and Macc

Another vote for a Le Creuset kettle here. We got one about 25 years ago for the boat, wasn't silly expensive at the time. Kept it when boat sold. Our one though has the removable whistle, which can scald your fingers; the lever and hinged one would be better. Also, it was important not to overfill it or it would splurt water out. Other than that, a chunky, decent piece of kit that's still in sound condition.

Wow! Uruk was home to the eponymous hero king, Gilgamesh. In that tale there is also a reference to a flood survivor, the immortal Utnapishtim and his wife. (Yes, he's basically an early Noah). Anyway, old tablets unearthed referenced the use of copious amounts of bitumen to seal reed boats at the time. This lecture is well worth the hour watch.

Yep, early on we got into the habit of holding a hand over the burner, putting on the closed simmer ring, check again after removing, then top up with fuel. The flame can be near invisible at times and the process only takes a few seconds but helps avoid the situation that Ronaldo describes. There is a cheap insert for a Trangia to take gel fuel and I agree, that would certainly be an improvement safety wise for one on a boat.

Not trying to be pedantic Alan but I think you've found the solution to soaring home heating costs. Meths is approx 80% weight of water by volume, say a litre is 800 grams, muliplied by the stated 7.4kWh and you have almost 6 megawatt hours! From a litre! British Gas are now charging me 7.735p per kWh or £77.35 per megawatt hour. Over £460 for 6 megawatt hours. Perhaps your quoted figures are watt hours per gram or kilowatt hours per kilogram of fuel.

Too true, and I bet she wasn't the first or last to do that. A meths burner/Trangia on concrete or damp grass outside is fine, kick it over and it will just burn itself off. Do it over anything remotely flammable like tablecloths, tent canvas, boat cushions etc and a real fire would develop very quickly. Similar applies to a flaming sambuca or any other high alcohol/flame combination! As an aside, in this thread I'm not trying to champion alcohol/meths stoves or diminish anyone else's suggestion of alternative fuels, it's just that I've used it for years, it's a relatively safe fuel and stoves using it can be simple to maintain and quick to get started if they have fuel in them. Criticism about the safety of unsecured camping stoves on boats applies across the board but is certainly valid with a regular Trangia.

The spirit in an origo burner soaks into a doughnut of mineral wool / glassfibre and the stove itself on my sailing boat is firmly attached behind the companionway step with an aluminium heatshield protecting the GRP of the boat. It would take a full-on knockdown for the burners to end up on the floor and I doubt that I'd be cooking in such extreme weather. The worry with the Trangia and a bowl of meths is a valid one though. I have kicked one over (unlit) in the past. Had been using it on the step, left it there,, went out on deck, went back down below and knocked it over, a small teacup worth of meths on the floor. Mopped it up but it did make me more cautious about the scenario that you raise. Problem is that all of the single burner camping stoves, meths, paraffin or gas, are designed for use on solid ground or a firm tabletop, not inside a tiny boat that is bobbing around. To give them a bigger, square footprint I've used them in the past sitting inside a biscuit tin. Slight improvement but far from ideal. It's one of the reasons that I'd like a twin burner that can be secured to the cupboard top in the little cruiser on the canal. Meths is the only fuel that I'm happy to replenish a stove with inside the boat, also the only fuel that I'm happy to store inside the cabin. I use it a lot for cleaning things off, it's one of the few things that shifts Sikaflex! Obviously, just like any fuel, treat it with respect, extinguisher and fire blanket nearby. Even good old H2O can be used on a meths fire unlike other fuels.

Good find. Cheers, not seen that one before. Certainly a lot cheaper than an Origo. A trangia alcohol burner is similarly only rated at 1kW and I've lived with one of those for years. Not as fast for sure as gas/paraffin but not horrendous

Thanks everyone for your suggestions. It does seem as I thought, that alcohol stove options are pretty limited. In the past I've used an old German Turm 144 or Turm Sport alcohol stove alongside the Trangia, or occasionally an Optimus Mark 5 paraffin stove. Not ideal having different makes of stoves in different housings sitting on the side just to heat two pans, especially in such a cramped space. Also, there seems to be a greater amount of maintenance and fiddly parts associated with the non-Trangia or Origo stoves and the Turm ones are pretty slow into the bargain. I did wonder about getting two new Trangia type burners and making a single metal case for them to sit in but I've already got a ton of projects to do, so it would probably end up on the proverbial back burner even if started. Yes, there's often an Origo twin burner or two on ebay but they usually fetch north of £250 for a decent one. That's just way beyond what I can afford to spend on a stove when there are other boaty priorities for any cash. As they're a lot bigger than a Trangia I'd need to leave it on the boat and with it being a little cruiser on a towpath mooring I'm not sure I'd want to have something of that value and relatively portable sitting there. I did wonder if there were any cheap lookalikes coming out of China but couldn't find anything of the Origo type. Nice stoves but seems a brace would probably cost about the same as an Origo! I actually have an Optimus 535 (well, it's my dad's really) which is similar and works well but it's paraffin so not my ideal choice. We had it on a cabin cruiser decades ago, used it when camping with the car and I cooked on it at home a few years back when they redid the gas-mains meaning a week without piped supply. Definitely effective. I think that there was an alcohol version of it, but again getting into pricy kit from a pocket and theft perspective.

For over thirty years I've done my camping cooking and small boat onboard cooking using a Trangia alcohol stove. Just don't like portable gas, having known two experienced camping friends have little canisters go up on them. The idea of it happening in a tiny GRP boat, especially when sailing and at anchor, makes me shudder. Nothing at all against proper piped gas installations in a narrowboat, but don't have a narrowboat these days! Anyway, as a Trangia is as basic as stoves come, for boat cooking I'd always wanted a two burner Origo, but they are pretty bloomin' pricey. Luckily for me, the old sailing boat that I got last year came with no electronic goodies but it did come with a rather dated Origo. It's great, so now I want one for the little GRP cruiser on the canal, but certainly can't afford or justify the money for a real one. I haven't come across anything of a cheaper lookalike type but wondered if anyone else had come across a reasonably priced alternative.

^^^ What he said! A lifeboat won't fit the narrow canals so if you are restricting yourself to wider waterways with the budget for a 30k project narrowboat, then a far more cautious approach would seem to be a decent GRP boat. There is a 32' Princess twin diesel looks tidy on ebay BIN of under £20k https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144463278958 . You can get narrowbeam cruisers like a Creighton for less. Broads cruisers ain't mega-pretty but they offer good space. Such boats aren't perfect for liveaboard but I would rather try and live on a dry GRP boat for a year than inside a damp and leaking building site inside a steel shell. A good GRP cruiser will be easier to maintain on a budget with DIY skills and there should be a healthy resale market for it, should you decide to give up the boat or upgrade to something bigger.

I'm aware of that. Was responding to a previous poster who said that he had seen one drift through, which kind of amazed me. eta: Hyde Bank tunnel is 308 yards long according to my ancient Nicholson guide to the North West

Hyde Bank tunnel (just before Marple aqueduct and locks) is quite long with no path, and horses went over the top. I'm amazed that momentum would take a boat through there.

but it were on t'internet as of an oor ago afta ye posted it 😁

Probably. Twenty years ago, trying to explain to a friend about t'internet, he said there was nothing on here that he would be interested in. Said to him, think of the most random thing. Response was, Jesus with a baseball bat. Yep, someone was selling little figures of JC with a baseball bat in his hand (in addition to the ones where he was toting a machine gun with kids around him, because you know he was a NRA advocate).

Going out on a limb here but would suggest a 14kg bog standard Danforth, 10m of chain and more of 14mm rope. Anything heavier and it gets difficult to deploy even in perfect conditions. Anything smaller and it's going to struggle holding a boat like the OP's. You may only need it once in a blue moon but an anchor is of no use if it is either too cumbersome to lift in an emergency or buried beneath junk in a locker.

So, a boat to use on the canals costs £30k? Yes, if you desire a 30k boat (and that probably won't get a decent steel boat today). No! If you want to enjoy the canals but cant' afford a steel narrowboat, get a kayak or a cheap GRP cruiser instead and enjoy the waters. CaRT get more off me each year for my little boat than it is worth (and it cost me even less). Why do I bend over to pay the bills each month? Because I enjoy farting around on the canal. I doubt that anyone would fund me for enjoying my hobby.

My friend has three horses and they consume most of her teacher's wages. Lovely animals but not cheap to run! They make boats look relatively tame by comparison.

Could well have been. It would have been before Covid that I last saw it.

Used to see that boat a bit on the upper peak. Always made me smile and the skipper cheery and courteous at bridges etc. I love it. It's a well kept boat with a few personalised additions.

I'd suspect that even a baby seagull outboard could get the boat moving in a flat calm, but it certainly wouldn't be much use at stopping it. A grown adult can pull along a fair size narrowboat but there's a lot of skidding and being dragged along the towpath when it comes to bringing it to a halt once it has built up any momentum. We had 35hp on a 60ft boat that started life as a 45ft. Was plenty for canal use but felt that it was possibly just a bit short of ponies to punch against a serious tide on a river, once the shell was extended. Could have been hard work for the engine. Previously we had 25hp I think on a 35' boat. Based on that I'd reckon the suggested 25-30hp sounds fine for a 36' boat. For secondhand boats, unless the engine is obviously underpowered then it's going to be about its condition, age, hours of use, maintenance, make and availability of spares and engineers, reliability etc. Rare vintage engines look fantastic but are for the knowledgeable enthusiasts. The rest of us should just look for well maintained, moderate hours, modern engines that are well understood by engineers who may be tasked to work on them. There are still plenty of BMC engines out there with life in them if they haven't been ragged and never maintained.