Newbie query - upgrading power generation for a liveaboard?

[MtB]

This is the 12 v fridge freezer I had in mind.

 

http://www.engelaustralia.com.au/2products_details.asp?pid=11&productid=21627

 

And yes, twin tub camping style washing machine. No hairdryers, irons, toasters...

 

 

Electric kettle presumably though!

 

That fridge is worrying. When it breaks down, who is the UK service agent?

[svetlovska]

http://www.engelfridges.co.uk

[Arthur Brown]

200w of solar will suit an electrofrugal adult for say four months June to September (ish according to the weather), 600w will cover you for three months with your indicated load and assist greatly for the couple of months either side of summer.

 

The trouble is that for the winter four months solar is next to useless giving about 8% of it's rated output.. Here is where you will need an additional power supply.

 

Some modern engines already have a big alternator (say up to 150 amps rating).

 

Also look at a shore line fitment, and a portable petrol generator. There really is little as bad as flat batteries and no power source to charge them.

[MtB]

 

The trouble is that for the winter four months solar is next to useless giving about 8% of it's rated output..

 

 

Got a link or other evidence to justify that unrealistically high figure?

[OldGoat]

svetlovska, on 26 Jun 2016 - 9:50 PM, said:

http://www.engelfridges.co.uk

I tried to find out any real technical details of these units, but found none. So here's my suppositions:-

This type of cooler is designed for camping and the cooling is provided by a peltier effect device which is very inefficient. Basically you prechill / freeze everything before you set out in your car / camper.

They are not designed to cool things down or freeze anything

They are very small

They are quite expensive.

 

IMHO at that sort of price you'd be better off with a compressor (more efficient) unit from Shoreline who adapt small domestic units.

Midland chandlers also stock a range.

Even if I'm wrong about the way in which the cooling is provided, it's too small to be of practical use for a liveaboard, its insulation will be poor because of the unit's size.

 

http://www.shoreline-marine.co.uk/fridge-freezers/fridge-freezers---medium/fridge-over-freezer-fk196

 

For best results - if you don't want to shop every day go for a unit with a separate compartment to freeze / maintain frozen food and a normal fridge below (or above).

 

Been there, done it....

[valrene9600]

http://www.engelfridges.co.uk

£1000 approx.

[Robbo]

I tried to find out any real technical details of these units, but found none. So here's my suppositions:-

This type of cooler is designed for camping and the cooling is provided by a peltier effect device which is very inefficient. Basically you prechill / freeze everything before you set out in your car / camper.

You'll find that they are not, they are a compressor type fridge and I believe have a danfoss controller/compressor.

 

Edit; looks like it's not a danfoss but a swing motor/compressor.

 

Edit2; Here's a danfoss vs swing quick google page- http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=24039.0

 

 

To the OP, you'll find that a danfoss and Ensel type fridges are very similar in consumption. So I would get the fridge / freezer that will work for you. For me a top loading fridge/freezer wouldn't be convenient so I would rather have a standard undercounter version even tho that usually means more power used.

 

Isotherm do nice fridges as well. Some have ASU which means they run on full power when your batteries are been charged by cooling a storage plate and using this first when your batteries are not been charged which sounds good if you have solar. (However a discussion is it better too have a bigger battery bank for the storage?!).

 

Whatever fridge you decide on you can improve the efficiency by improving the insulation and ventilation of the heat pipes.

Edited June 27, 2016 by Robbo

[chubby]

My tuppence worth

 

I live aboard . On my own . 4x 110ah batteries . 400w solar . 40 A tracer solar controller . Smartgauge . Big victron inverter (2.5kw ) .

My batteries are 3 years old . Since fitting solar 2.5 ish years ago i ve never run my engine solely for charging .

BUT ,

I use electricity according to time of year & SOC indicated by Smartgauge .

From March till October i run my 12 v fridge . In winter it is turned off .

From March till October i run a hoover & a 3.5 kg twin tub machine when ivwant to as often as i want to .

In winter i might do one or the other . I might do neither according to my SG readings .

I run an eberspacher for one hour everyday in summer . Every two days in winter .

Hardly ever watch TV , preferring radio . No computer - all needs met by iphone .

So my electrical needs are few . The simplicity of boat life is part of its attraction ( for me ) .

 

If u are willing to adjust your needs according to your boats ability to provide power it can potentially go a long way . Of course , if u are able to install & pay for more equipment then great but it might not need to be " extravagant " as such .

Plenty of solar , a good sized battery bank ( for your possible electrical requirements ) , low energy lighting , low energy TV , no fridge in winter ( i keep my provisions in a bow locker ) , and maybe get yourself a decent suitcase generator for winter charging & washing machine usage etc .

The best advice on this thread so far i think is " wait & see " how it goes if this is your first liveaboard boat .

It maybe that u don t need lots of pricey equipment afterall & u may be ok if u monitor your electrical usage ?

Ultimately , i guess i m saying that you can probably meet your needs without necessarily having kit with all the bells and whistles but if after some time u think u would prefer it then perhaps do so .

For now , solar , a decent genny , Smartgauge & a cautious attitude to power consumption might suffice .

Like i say , just my thoughts

cheers

[OldGoat]

Robbo, on 27 Jun 2016 - 12:25 PM, said:

You'll find that they are not, they are a compressor type fridge and I believe have a danfoss controller/compressor.

 

Edit; looks like it's not a danfoss but a swing motor/compressor.

 

Edit2; Here's a danfoss vs swing quick google page- http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=24039.0

 

 

To the OP, you'll find that a danfoss and Ensel type fridges are very similar in consumption. So I would get the fridge / freezer that will work for you. For me a top loading fridge/freezer wouldn't be convenient so I would rather have a standard undercounter version even tho that usually means more power used.

 

Isotherm do nice fridges as well. Some have ASU which means they run on full power when your batteries are been charged by cooling a storage plate and using this first when your batteries are not been charged which sounds good if you have solar. (However a discussion is it better too have a bigger battery bank for the storage?!).

 

Whatever fridge you decide on you can improve the efficiency by improving the insulation and ventilation of the heat pipes.

 

I'm obliged...

I read the thread and the swing compressor looks interesting; there must be some clever engineering as the 'swing' seems to be like a solenoid which doesn't sound very efficient.

I'll stick with the weekender concept - most of the respondents talk about keeping their beer cool.

 

For the OP - I suppose you have to consider how much perishable food you need to store and how often you intend to shop. We like to go at least 3-4 days without having to shop - but our aim is cruising the system, so we cover the ground - some of which is quite isolated in terms of reasonable shops.