Battery Charging problem or not

[by'eck]

Just looked at your inverter, couple of points:

 

It is modified sine wave, and therefore some types of meter might misread the voltage.

 

It has a power saving mode so at light loads it will not be producing normal output voltage.

 

So I wouldn't spend too much time worrying about its output voltage as there are too many variables. Concentrate on checking the genny voltage with another meter, and more importantly the charge voltage on the batteries when the strange behaviour is happening. I can't find any info on the genny but maybe it too has a power saving mode that is upsetting the charger?

 

Surely the OP's Tracer Combi when fed with AC via a generator will be in charger mode only, i.e. the inverter part won't be functioning since this obsolete device doesn't appear to have any power assist mode.

 

When I mentioned a heavy load causing this issue in post #16 (if not a charger fault) I meant an external load dragging down battery volts although admit this may also be a red herring.

[bizzard]

A burger bun cut in half would make an excellent pair of ear muffs, sesa-me

[rogeriko]

A modified sine wave inverter will read 180v on a multimeter so the inverter output is correct and so is your meter. The generator on the other hand is pure sine wave so that should read 240. That's the first problem to be solved and maybe that's why the batteries are not charging in which case its your only problem. Always measure the generator voltage under load plug in a 1kw load and then measure the voltage.

 

For those that need to know the reason a modified sine wave inverter only measures 180v its because the waveform is flat topped instead of a curved peak and as the meter only reads the average the flat wave dosnt go as high as the sine wave because it is delivering more power more of the time. UK electricity is actually 380v peak to peak but averages out at 240v.

[bargemast]

A burger bun cut in half would make an excellent pair of ear muffs, sesa-me

 

Great another good idea, if that won't make my charger work properly again, what will ?

 

Peter.

[bargemast]

A modified sine wave inverter will read 180v on a multimeter so the inverter output is correct and so is your meter. The generator on the other hand is pure sine wave so that should read 240. That's the first problem to be solved and maybe that's why the batteries are not charging in which case its your only problem. Always measure the generator voltage under load plug in a 1kw load and then measure the voltage.

 

For those that need to know the reason a modified sine wave inverter only measures 180v its because the waveform is flat topped instead of a curved peak and as the meter only reads the average the flat wave dosnt go as high as the sine wave because it is delivering more power more of the time. UK electricity is actually 380v peak to peak but averages out at 240v.

 

 

OK rogeriko, that's what I will try tomorrow afternoon, when I check the generator output I'll connect a 1Kw electric heater to it and then check the reading.

 

Right now I live in the hope that it's only a problem because of a too slow running genny, as that would be within my limited capacities to cure.

 

Peter.

[smileypete]

Have a look at voltmeter and ammeter while batts are charging.

 

Once the charge voltage reaches 'absorption voltage' (about 24.8V in your case) the charger limits it from going any higher, from that point charge current is then limited by what the batts can absorb, not what the charger is capable of putting out.

 

I suspect the batts may be defective/sulphated with high internal resistance, so the charge voltage soon hits the absorption voltage level, and charge current then 'tails off' too quickly before they're fully charged enough in a reasonable time.

 

Would be worth checking with a hydrometer, if one cell almost dead compared to the others, the batt is probably kaput, some info on hydrometers on this topic:

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=70385

 

If there's a bit of life on all the cells, some careful EQ may restore some capacity, but that said if they're 3 years old and in bad shape then it may well be best to call it a day and buy a new set, try and go for non sealed ones if living 'off grid'.

 

cheers, Pete.

~smpt~

Edited October 7, 2014 by smileypete

[bargemast]

Have a look at voltmeter and ammeter while batts are charging.

 

Once the charge voltage reaches 'absorption voltage' (about 24.8V in your case) the charger limits it from going any higher, from that point charge current is then limited by what the batts can absorb, not what the charger is capable of putting out.

 

I suspect the batts may be defective/sulphated with high internal resistance, so the charge voltage soon hits the absorption voltage level, and charge current then 'tails off' too quickly before they're fully charged enough in a reasonable time.

 

Would be worth checking with a hydrometer, if one cell almost dead compared to the others, the batt is probably kaput, some info on hydrometers on this topic:

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=70385

 

If there's a bit of life on all the cells, some careful EQ may restore some capacity, but that said if they're 3 years old and in bad shape then it may well be best to call it a day and buy a new set, try and go for non sealed ones if living 'off grid'.

 

cheers, Pete.

~smpt~

 

Hello Pete, I'm sad to say that I haven't done anything in my engineroom, no testing, nothing at all, as I slipped yesterday on some leaves while walking and hurt my back which was already very bad before I fell, so everything I have to do has to wait at least a couple of days.

 

I opened my sealed batteries a couple of days ago, only to see if there was still some acid over the plates, and the levels were all fine, didn't check with a hydrometer as that was broken quite a while ago, but now I've got a new one, so as soon as I'm a bit more mobile and able to flex I'll start with the hydrometer check.

 

Cheers,

 

Peter.

[smileypete]

Oh sorry to hear that, get well soon, and no moving heavy stuff like batteries around!

 

cheers, Pete.

~smpt~

[ditchcrawler]

 

Hello Pete, I'm sad to say that I haven't done anything in my engineroom, no testing, nothing at all, as I slipped yesterday on some leaves while walking and hurt my back which was already very bad before I fell, so everything I have to do has to wait at least a couple of days.

 

I opened my sealed batteries a couple of days ago, only to see if there was still some acid over the plates, and the levels were all fine, didn't check with a hydrometer as that was broken quite a while ago, but now I've got a new one, so as soon as I'm a bit more mobile and able to flex I'll start with the hydrometer check.

 

Cheers,

 

Peter.

I know how you feel, I have had a bad sock day most days for the last week.

[Detling]

You mentioned that the genny is German in which case it will be 220V and not 240V as that is the European standard and so 211V in not that far out.

[bottle]

Yes but the 'harmonised' European voltage is 230v

 

but

 

The parameters allow a variation on that of + or- 10% (207 to 253)

 

So we kept 240 and the other European countries kept 220, for cost reasons.

[bargemast]

It's right that my GEKO genny is a German built one, but in the specifications is written 230V (+/- 8%) I checked yesterday with the genny running it gave 223 V, so that's at least one good point.

 

I'm still not in good enough shape to do the rest of the tests, and hope I will be able to continue later this week.

 

Peter.