Family history - where to start?

[mrscloudinspector]

Hope you may be able to point me in the right direction!

 

I was always aware of a great, great relative working on a narrowboat but have recently found out that it was in fact my great grandfather on my mums side with the surname Rose. He apparently owned a working boat with another chap whose surname was Wild and the boat was aptly named 'Wild Rose'. It is possible that he carried cement or pottery and as he lived in Leigh it is assumed that he worked locally.

 

There is one surviving daughter who we are going to contact to see if she has anymore information but he died in his forties of lung cancer and his children were all quite young so she may not be able to shed any more light on it.

 

I would love to try and find out more so my question is where do I start? Have I got enough info to even make a start?!

 

Obviously I was really chuffed to find this out and although I was told this story as a child I had forgotten all about it, so it seems that it was in my blood all along lol!

 

Thanks

[Derek R.]

I have not done this myself, but the local records office should have some results on names as will the census records which will go back to 1851. Another member of the forum has boating family and has done quite a bit of research, it might be useful to contact her via a Private Message, look for Jeannette Harrison in the members list. The very least is that she may be able to point you to some fruitful links.

 

Derek

[Guest]

My daughter is currently researching our family history using the ancestry web site.

 

I was sceptical at first but it seems very good, though of course it's not free.

[ChimneyChain]

My mum also uses the ancestry web thing. She managed to get back to the 1600 on my mums side and 1773 in my dads side.

 

Darren

[keble]

Hope you may be able to point me in the right direction!

 

I would love to try and find out more so my question is where do I start? Have I got enough info to even make a start?!

Obviously I was really chuffed to find this out and although I was told this story as a child I had forgotten all about it, so it seems that it was in my blood all along lol!

Thanks

Hi, I have spent many years researching family history, both pre-Internet and with Internet!

The basic principle is to start with the known and work backwards. You will be dealing with uncertainties; as long as you are aware that any link may be wrong then OK. It happened to me!

 

In your case this is the daughter. Find out what you can about her first.

 

Census records were made every 10 years, but you can't see any in the last 100 years. They are useful to find any other family members.

But you can see births marriages and deaths records back to 1837. These are government records.

Before 1837 you have to go to church records, and now they are for baptisms, marriages and burials.

 

You can access a lot of records through ancestry.com, some for free, some for a fee. I was very impressed.

In the old days you trudged round to county record offices and used a microfiche viewer!

 

There are many FH societies, based on counties and sometimes occupations, they can be very helpful.

 

Good luck!

[cotswoldsman]

do you have any first names?

[Québec]

The Lancashire Births, Marriages and Deaths index is available online and is free.

 

http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/index.php

 

You can search by years (as many as you like) and by borough.

 

But as others have said, a first name and even some roughly calculated dates would be very useful.

[Pluto]

A volunteer at the Boat Museum has transcribed the Wigan local authority boat register, and there is no boat called Wild Rose on the list. I am not sure if Leigh has a register, otherwise the ones to check for a narrow boat working to Leigh are Manchester and Runcorn. The registers start in the mid-1870s.

[pete harrison]

A volunteer at the Boat Museum has transcribed the Wigan local authority boat register, and there is no boat called Wild Rose on the list. I am not sure if Leigh has a register, otherwise the ones to check for a narrow boat working to Leigh are Manchester and Runcorn. The registers start in the mid-1870s.

I have transcripts of all of the Health Registers listed above on my database (including Leigh) and the most likely possibilty is Manchester 244 (26 March 1879). Although WILD ROSE is recorded by name and the issue date is given no other details are listed except a transfer in 1924 to John Thomason (Thompson ?), Manchester. I am unable to confirm whether this is a narrow or wide beam boat at present. This boat was sunk by October 1941.

 

The reason for my vagueness is that the Manchester Helath Register is only complete from entry 951 (26 November 1909) onwards. Prior to this only the registration date, registered number, boat name and cancellation are given, some of which I have subsequently been able to fill in but most is clearly a little sketchy. My Health Registration database lists 18088 individual registrations (about 70% of the total registered) and there are only two other boats named WILD ROSE, one a wide beam steamer on the River Thames and the other a narrow boat on the canals of the midlands with a traceable history back to 1891. Clearly the latter is also a possibility.

Edited August 9, 2013 by pete harrison

[jeannette smith harrison]

I can find records of two Rose buriels @ Braunston in late 1800 also records of some living in Brentford but give occ as painters & living in Cathrine wheel yard (this is where Thames Boatmen & Lighterman gen lived) Canal Boatmen living in the Hams end of the High Street will check records for Church used by Lighterman ect.also come across Richard Rose ,Sarah Galley & John Earl as owners of two Barges opperated with ten lighter men on the Thames.

In my own records apart from a Wild as master of a Barge & lighter on the Stroudwater Navigation in late 1700 the nearest i have in Canal boat familys is Wilde or Wilday/Wildey. Sorry forgot to mention have small info on Wild Rose but as Pete says little is known & as expected his records are more & acurate than i would ever have.

Jeannette

Edited August 11, 2013 by jeannette smith harrison

[Québec]

Using the free search on Ancestry.co.uk

 

The 1881 census shows a boatman Stewart Rose living at Braunston. Born c. 1811 in Sanley, Derbyshire.

Married to Mary Rose. Had a son also called Stewart born in 1850, also a boatman.

 

They are the only ones that come up if you enter 'Rose' and 'boatman'.

 

Name: Stewart Rose

[steward Rose]

Age: 70

Estimated Birth Year: abt 1811

Relationship to Head: Head

Spouse: Mary Rose

Gender: Male

Where born: Sanley, Derbyshire, England

Civil Parish: Braunston

County/Island: Northamptonshire

Country: England

Street Address: The Green

Marital Status: Married

Education:

Occupation: Boatman

Registration District: Daventry

 

Name: Stewart Rose

[steward Rose]

Age: 31

Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850

Relationship to Head: Son

Father: Stewart Rose

Mother: Mary Rose

Gender: Male

Where born: Braunston

Civil Parish: Braunston

County/Island: Northamptonshire

Country: England

Street Address: The Green

Occupation: Boatman

Registration District: Daventry

Sub-registration District: Daventry

 

If you enter 'Wild' and 'boatman' this comes up:

 

Name: John Wild

Age: 60

Estimated Birth Year: abt 1821

Relationship to Head: Head

Spouse: Elizabeth Wild

Gender: Male

Where born: Manchester, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Manchester

County/Island: Lancashire

Country: England

Street Address: 18 Lees St

Marital Status: Married

Occupation: Boatman

Registration District: Manchester

Sub-registration District: Market Street

 

They had a daughter, Annie, was was aged 22 and a machinist.

[StarUKKiwi]

Fascinating - do they have an equivalent in Cheshire does anyone know - I have discovered my great-grandfather, on my Grandmother's side) was born on a narrowboat - he was called Josiah Preston and apparently his father had a fleet of narrowboats that went between Stoke and Middlewich (as far as I can tell) but I don't have nay boat names

[pete harrison]

I can find records of two Rose buriels @ Braunston in late 1800 also records of some living in Brentford but give occ as painters & living in Cathrine wheel yard (this is where Thames Boatmen & Lighterman gen lived) Canal Boatmen living in the Hams end of the High Street will check records for Church used by Lighterman ect.also come across Richard Rose ,Sarah Galley & John Earl as owners of two Barges opperated with ten lighter men on the Thames.

In my own records apart from a Wild as master of a Barge & lighter on the Stroudwater Navigation in late 1700 the nearest i have in Canal boat familys is Wilde or Wilday/Wildey.

Jeannette

I have records of 5 boatman with the surname Rose, and another 5 with the surname Wild - all named as master of different boats within the health registers. All of the Rose's were masters of wide boats, 4 of which were in the north west and 1 in the south east. 4 of the boatmen named Wild worked wide and narrow boats for S.U.R.C.C. with the last one being Birmingham based.

Fascinating - do they have an equivalent in Cheshire does anyone know - I have discovered my great-grandfather, on my Grandmother's side) was born on a narrowboat - he was called Josiah Preston and apparently his father had a fleet of narrowboats that went between Stoke and Middlewich (as far as I can tell) but I don't have nay boat names

I have nothing for Josiah Preston, which suprises me if he operated a fleet of narrow boats. I wonder if Mr Preston traded under a different name to his own ?

 

edit - I do have 2 boatmen with the surname Preston (one in 1878 and one in 1898), and both are in the north west but working for large carriers.

Edited August 11, 2013 by pete harrison

[jeannette smith harrison]

Quebec

Mary Ann Rose & Stewart Rose are the two I mentioned that are buried in All Saints Braunston Church yard. I have no record of a son

Stewart so I will cert follow that up. Only the Parish book records are available for the Church yard as when they did a cleansing of the

grounds in the 50's & knocked down most of the existing headstones they failed to take records thinking they had them all

, only to later discover that they had gone missing so they know who was buried in the grounds but not where.

most frustrating both my Nanny's parents & two of her siblings are buried in the church grounds but I don't know the exact grave location.

I have checked the record I have of boatmen buried in the Boat mans cemetery across the road but no Rose ,Wild or sim name exists.

John Wild is the one I mention on the Stroud navigation in 1795.

 

Peter

 

All my leads & record seem to indicate that these two family's where mostly Thames bargemen or Lightermen so unless someone has any other

name connections or info iv Exhausted all my knowledge.

I have nothing at all on a Preston boatman

[Québec]

1911 census. Enter 'Wild' and 'boatman' there is only one entry for the whole UK:

 

Name: James T Wild

Age in 1911: 31

Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880

Relation to Head: Son

Gender: Male

Birth Place: Rochdale, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Rochdale

County/Island: Lancashire

Country: England

Street Address: 8 Williams Place

Marital Status: Single

Occupation: Boatman

Registration District: Rochdale

Registration District Number: 470

Sub-registration District: Castleton No 1

ED, institution, or vessel: 4

Piece: 24607

 

He was the son of Sabrah Williams, a widow.

[jeannette smith harrison]

1911 census. Enter 'Wild' and 'boatman' there is only one entry for the whole UK:

 

Name: James T Wild

Age in 1911: 31

Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880

Relation to Head: Son

Gender: Male

Birth Place: Rochdale, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Rochdale

County/Island: Lancashire

Country: England

Street Address: 8 Williams Place

Marital Status: Single

Occupation: Boatman

Registration District: Rochdale

Registration District Number: 470

Sub-registration District: Castleton No 1

ED, institution, or vessel: 4

Piece: 24607

 

He was the son of Sabrah Williams, a widow.

Nice one Quebec this one never showed up in my search. I note that in 1911 he is reg under a house address & not a boat ,Williams place is v close to the river Coln do you think that he could have been a day boatman on the river Barges as well??

[Québec]

What's odd is the Leigh connection for Rose, as there doesn't seem to be one unless, of course, the occupation was other than boatman. Then you can take your pick.

[Offcumden]

Fascinating - do they have an equivalent in Cheshire does anyone know - I have discovered my great-grandfather, on my Grandmother's side) was born on a narrowboat - he was called Josiah Preston and apparently his father had a fleet of narrowboats that went between Stoke and Middlewich (as far as I can tell) but I don't have nay boat names

Cheshire BDM website may be of interest to you.

[mayalld]

Fascinating - do they have an equivalent in Cheshire does anyone know - I have discovered my great-grandfather, on my Grandmother's side) was born on a narrowboat - he was called Josiah Preston and apparently his father had a fleet of narrowboats that went between Stoke and Middlewich (as far as I can tell) but I don't have nay boat names

 

Assuming that you are talking about Birth, Marriage and Death Records, then yes.

 

A number of counties in the UK have similar sites (actually, Cheshire was the first of these sites), although coverage is far from universal.

 

There is also a national (England and Wales) site at http://www.freebmd.org.uk/

 

Both national and local sites contain broadly the same information. However the national (GRO) indexes are useful, because they deal with cases where people are in the "wrong" place, because events are registered where they happened, rather than where the people lived, and they provide the information that will help you order from a single source. These indexes also include those records that are NOT available from some local offices due to record damage in WWII

 

Local (county) indexes sometimes come up trumps where the return from the local register office to the GRO contained an error, and the entry at the GRO is incorrect.

 

If researching your family history, the first piece of advice is to take any family story with a HUGE pinch of salt. So often, people attempt to build a family tree around a "known" fact that proves to be inaccurate. The second piece of advice is beware of rip-offs. Genealogy is big business, and there are no end of scammers trying to sell a service to provide "Official Government Certificates" for 30 quid (or more) a time (you can get them yourself for less than a tenner).

 

Work backwards from known individuals to build up names and dates. Flesh these people out from the census that tells you where they lived, and with whom, what their job was. Only once you have built that framework would I try to look at canal records for more flesh to put on the bones. Don't imagine for a moment that all the answers are on-line.

 

If anybody is looking at doing this and wants some help, PM me.

[Pluto]

Nice one Quebec this one never showed up in my search. I note that in 1911 he is reg under a house address & not a boat ,Williams place is v close to the river Coln do you think that he could have been a day boatman on the river Barges as well??

He was probably working on the Rochdale Canal where boatmen would have had houses, as did many of the boatmen on northern canals, where the income from wide boats was more than on narrow boats in the midlands and south in the 20th century.

[mrscloudinspector]

Wow!

 

Thank you to everyone for your input and information - I have been away for a few days and just got chance to check.

 

I think my next step will be to contact my Great Aunt, his daughter, to find out as much as I can - first names, locations etc- then I can then start to make further enquiries.

 

I will keep you posted!