Manchester Ship Canal

[davidk65]

I understand that to cruise part of the ship canal in a narrow boat, Ellesmere Port to River Weaver, a sea license is required.

Does anyone know what does this entail:

a) As regards to the boat its self? What about such things as length of ropes required as well as the length of an anchor warp? c) Is this information available and from what source. d) How much is this certificate likely to cost?

I have spoken to a few individuals about this but they do seem to have different views.

I recently asked my BSS examiner about a sea certificate and he said I would need a surveyor for that.

 

David

[Liam]

Hi David,

 

The best thing you could do is give Mike Carter (Surveyor) a call on 07831 184495. He did the certificate for Ariel when I went from the River Weaver to Ellesmere Port (and return) last year at Easter. He's based on the River Weaver near Northwich, so local, and will be able to advise you fully. One thing to keep in mind is that you need to have your certificate in to the Harbour Masters Office at least 3 days before you intend to do the trip.

 

You can contact the Harbour Master who I beleive is still Colin Chambers on 0151 3271461.

 

Liam.

[MartinClark]

I understand that to cruise part of the ship canal in a narrow boat, Ellesmere Port to River Weaver, a sea license is required.

Does anyone know what does this entail:

a) As regards to the boat its self? What about such things as length of ropes required as well as the length of an anchor warp? c) Is this information available and from what source. d) How much is this certificate likely to cost?

I have spoken to a few individuals about this but they do seem to have different views.

I recently asked my BSS examiner about a sea certificate and he said I would need a surveyor for that.

 

IWA has published Ellesmere Port to Manchester, Notes for Small Craft.

 

The Ship Canal Company will expect you to have read the notices linked on this page:

http://www.shipcanal.co.uk/marine-msc/

Of particular interest will be:

Pleasure Craft Rules

Safety Guidance for Small Boat Passage of the River Mersey which includes such things as necessary rope lengths for MSC locks.

[Albert Smith]

I've not navigated the Manchester Ship Canal for many years but I always took a pilot on board, I believe you are exempt if your vessel is less than 50 metres.

 

Private vessels have to have a survey by an approved surveyor and have insurance to specifically cover the MSC. Peel Ports are the people to contact.

 

Albert.

[MartinClark]

There is a right of navigation on the Ship Canal but it is subject to quite strict conditions which must be satisfied.

 

Here is a summary of the conditions, as I understand them:

You will need:

- A boat safety certificate

- Admiralty charts for the Ship Canal (AND Mersey estuary if appropriate)

- Full navigation lights

- An anchor of sufficient depth

- 2 mooring ropes at least 120 feet long for use in locks

- A copy of the Ship Canal Company's map and regulations

- Third party liability insurance for at least £??? million (not sure of current figure)

(which the boat may have anyway)

- A certificate of seaworthiness, issued by an MSC approved surveyor such as an Associate of the Institute of Royal Naval Architects.

(I am told that Jalsea Marine on the River Weaver at Northwich will come out to survey a boat if it is not convenient for the boat to visit them. They have a special arrangement with the Ship Canal Company and the booking arrangements can be made through them. Others have made other recommendations in previous threads on this forum.)

 

When booking, you will need to pay any lock charges, which can become expensive if you are doing a long section of the canal.

 

Peel Holdings will not allow hire boats or shared ownership boats to use the canal.

 

Small craft such as narrowboats may use the Upper Reaches, i.e. between Lowry Footbridge, Pomona Dock and the upper limit of navigation. They will need a Boat Safety Certificate and a fee of (currently) £22 to navigate Pomona Lock. Booking for this is made through the Bridgewater Canal offices. (Boats with a Bridgewater Canal licence do not need to pay to use Pomona Lock.)

[john4647]

Copied and pasted from a previous thread on this subject.

 

 

First contact should be with the Manchester Ship Canal Company: Colin Chambers 0151 327 1461. He will send you an exceedingly useful pack with a form, a list of surveyors and a map which makes no sense at all ’til you are on the canal when it becomes invaluable.

You need to have a certificate of seaworthiness signed by one of the MSC’s accredited surveyors though there does seem to be considerable flexibility as to who actually does the survey. We used Brian Taylor (01606 836689) who is nominally retired (but still does MSC surveys) and lives canalside in Middlewich. The survey is not onerous, cost us £30.

The form needs to be returned to the Manchester Ship Canal Company at least 2 days before you want to go on the canal with a cheque for £20.63. If you are short of time then talk to Brian or PMF Boat Services 01928 712260 as they have a stock of forms so you can cut out one postal delay. Other than standard boat safety requirements you must have an anchor and life jackets. VHF radio is desirable but not essential, a mobile phone does well and in our case was the only thing that worked from where we were moored outside Weston Marsh Lock. There is a requirement for 55′ long ropes, you will need these if you go through any of the locks on the MSC but not really required at Ellesmere Port and Weston Marsh.

Once you drop down to Elsemere Port you will see that there is a swing bridge across the final lock. Top gates to that lock are chained up. Very strangely it is the Local Council that swing the bridge.

Contact Robbie Bunker on 0151 356 6693 or 07786 277556 to swing the bridge; Contact BW on 01606 723800 to open the lock; note – their hours are 08:30 to 16:30. A useful BW contact was Judith Brackley on 01606 723821.

Note: You need to give everybody at least 48 hours notice.

We did the journey from Ellesmere Port to the River Weaver in about 1 hour. Top Tip: When you are talking to BW make sure that the office are clear as to when you are leaving Ellesmere Port and when you arrive at Weston Marsh. It is not so much of an issue when you are going to Ellesmere Port but if it is windy then it is awkward waiting for BW outside Weston Marsh Lock. Ring BW when you enter the MSC, ring them again when you are waiting outside the lock.

Lots of boats make this passage, don’t worry about it too much!

 

Colin Chambers has now retired and you need to speak to Hugh.

 

We did the trip last year and nobody checked the ropes although we did have them.

 

Navigation lights are not required if you are travelling in daylight.

[davidk65]

There is a right of navigation on the Ship Canal but it is subject to quite strict conditions which must be satisfied.

 

Here is a summary of the conditions, as I understand them:

You will need:

- A boat safety certificate

- Admiralty charts for the Ship Canal (AND Mersey estuary if appropriate)

- Full navigation lights

- An anchor of sufficient depth

- 2 mooring ropes at least 120 feet long for use in locks

- A copy of the Ship Canal Company's map and regulations

- Third party liability insurance for at least £??? million (not sure of current figure)

(which the boat may have anyway)

- A certificate of seaworthiness, issued by an MSC approved surveyor such as an Associate of the Institute of Royal Naval Architects.

(I am told that Jalsea Marine on the River Weaver at Northwich will come out to survey a boat if it is not convenient for the boat to visit them. They have a special arrangement with the Ship Canal Company and the booking arrangements can be made through them. Others have made other recommendations in previous threads on this forum.)

 

When booking, you will need to pay any lock charges, which can become expensive if you are doing a long section of the canal.

 

Peel Holdings will not allow hire boats or shared ownership boats to use the canal.

 

Small craft such as narrowboats may use the Upper Reaches, i.e. between Lowry Footbridge, Pomona Dock and the upper limit of navigation. They will need a Boat Safety Certificate and a fee of (currently) £22 to navigate Pomona Lock. Booking for this is made through the Bridgewater Canal offices. (Boats with a Bridgewater Canal licence do not need to pay to use Pomona Lock.)

 

Hi Martin.

Thank you and John for the information. I Have copied all the responses to my questions as each one gave sound advice. Thanks again.

David.

[MartinClark]

I notice a discrepancy in the information about ropes!

 

In the information I copied and pasted it mentioned 120ft ropes whereas John's source mentioned 55ft.

 

Having had a look through the MSC document Safety Guidance for Small Boat Passage of the River Mersey in the appendix Safety Guidance Checklist it mentions "long mooring lines (25m)" which is 82ft! If that is the length required for Eastham Lock presumably it is also the length required for the other locks, although this information is not easy to find on the MSC website.

 

In any event the ropes have to be long enough to go from the boat up to the lock edge, around a bollard which is some way back from the edge and then back down to the boat again.

 

Has anyone who has been on the MSC got the documentation that specifies what length the ropes should be?

[Pie Eater]

I notice a discrepancy in the information about ropes!

 

In the information I copied and pasted it mentioned 120ft ropes whereas John's source mentioned 55ft.

 

Having had a look through the MSC document Safety Guidance for Small Boat Passage of the River Mersey in the appendix Safety Guidance Checklist it mentions "long mooring lines (25m)" which is 82ft! If that is the length required for Eastham Lock presumably it is also the length required for the other locks, although this information is not easy to find on the MSC website.

 

In any event the ropes have to be long enough to go from the boat up to the lock edge, around a bollard which is some way back from the edge and then back down to the boat again.

 

Has anyone who has been on the MSC got the documentation that specifies what length the ropes should be?

The paperwork I have from my trip says

 

"At least two warps each being not less than fifty feet in length and of sufficient strength".

 

Steve

[RLWP]

I notice a discrepancy in the information about ropes!

 

In the information I copied and pasted it mentioned 120ft ropes whereas John's source mentioned 55ft.

 

Having had a look through the MSC document Safety Guidance for Small Boat Passage of the River Mersey in the appendix Safety Guidance Checklist it mentions "long mooring lines (25m)" which is 82ft! If that is the length required for Eastham Lock presumably it is also the length required for the other locks, although this information is not easy to find on the MSC website.

 

In any event the ropes have to be long enough to go from the boat up to the lock edge, around a bollard which is some way back from the edge and then back down to the boat again.

 

Has anyone who has been on the MSC got the documentation that specifies what length the ropes should be?

 

It's a bit academic really. Most narrowboats are travelling between Weston Marsh Side Lock and Ellesmere Port. Neither need incredibly long lines

 

Richard

[Timleech]

It's a bit academic really. Most narrowboats are travelling between Weston Marsh Side Lock and Ellesmere Port. Neither need incredibly long lines

 

Richard

 

Especially since the Side lock was closed even well before my time

 

Pedantically there's Weston Mersey side lock which gave direct access to the Mersey for Weaver traffic, the lock from the Weaver Navigation to the Ship Canal is Marsh lock, or Weston Marsh lock. The change in levels is usually only a foot or two, so massive lines are certainly not required there.

 

Tim

Edited April 14, 2011 by Timleech

[RichardN]

I notice a discrepancy in the information about ropes!

 

In the information I copied and pasted it mentioned 120ft ropes whereas John's source mentioned 55ft.

 

Could most of the discrepancy be that the guide is for the Mersey? John's source was our blog here: http://indigodream.wordpress.com/2009/09/03/manchester-ship-canal-notes/ I have left the MSC papers on the boat but will have a check tomorrow night. My memory was that this was the figure that was in the MSC notes but interesting that Pie Eater has 50'. I tend to amend these pages on the blog as I learn more for future reference, 50/55' is not too much difference but I will be interested to know if something has just changed dramatically to 120' so that I can amend ready for next time.

Mind you that won't be for a while - this year we are going east, next year will be mainly round London so sadly we won't be that way for 2 years or so.

[MartinClark]

but I will be interested to know if something has just changed dramatically to 120' so that I can amend ready for next time.

 

No, the reference to 120' came from something posted back in 2004 or earlier. I can't remember where it originated now!

[RLWP]

Especially since the Side lock was closed even well before my time

 

Pedantically there's Weston Mersey side lock which gave direct access to the Mersey for Weaver traffic, the lock from the Weaver Navigation to the Ship Canal is Marsh lock, or Weston Marsh lock. The change in levels is usually only a foot or two, so massive lines are certainly not required there.

 

Tim

 

Ah, yes. Not the Side lock...

 

Well, it was only our second day on Tawny Owl

 

Richard

[davidk65]

Since starting this thread and taking up the various suggestion that have been made, I have contacted a surveyor who has supplied me with the following which I have cut and pasted from his response as below:

 

ARTICLES TO BE CARRIED BY A PLEASURE CRAFT IN THE HARBOUR.

 

 

1. An adequate anchor and cable.

 

2. At least two warps each being not less than fifty feet in length and of sufficient strength.

 

3. Such navigation lights and equipment for signalling by sound as will enable the pleasure craft to comply with the International Regulations for Preventing Collisions at Sea and with the Company's Bye-Laws.

 

4. At least two fire extinguishers of a suitable type approved by the Ministry of Transport and maintained in accordance with the Ministry recommendations.

 

5. Sufficient life saving apparatus for as many passengers and crew as the pleasure craft is designed to carry.

 

6. An Admiralty chart or other chart approved by the Company for the Harbour and adjacent waters.

 

7. A copy of the Company's Bye-Laws for the time being in force.

 

8. A current tidal almanac.

 

 

 

In connection with the above, I have asked for further clarification if all items are required when cruising the MSC from Ellesmere Port to River Weaver.

 

 

David.

[RLWP]

I've mentioned this before in other threads, because of our inexperience (we'd only owned Tawny Owl for less than a week), the MSC insisted we had a pilot for the trip. He carried the tide tables, almanac, charts and stuff. As it was a morning passage, we didn't need navigation lights

 

Have fun, we did

 

Richard

[Keeping Up]

I was told that there is no need for nav lights if you are travelling by day, and no need for charts or tide tables if you are only travelling between Ellesmere Port and the Weaver.

 

I found Huw Jones (MSC Eastham, 0151 327 2038, huw.jones@shipcanal.co.uk) to be very helpful indeed, why not ask him for any definitive answers.

[davidk65]

I was told that there is no need for nav lights if you are travelling by day, and no need for charts or tide tables if you are only travelling between Ellesmere Port and the Weaver.

 

I found Huw Jones (MSC Eastham, 0151 327 2038, huw.jones@shipcanal.co.uk) to be very helpful indeed, why not ask him for any definitive answers.

 

Thank You.

Have phoned Huw Jones as you suggested. Very helpful. He is sending me via email an information pack. His opinion was that as we would be coming out of the boat museum locks on to the MSC and only going as far as the River Weaver entrance locks and not using any of the MSC locks most of the requirements about lights and length of ropes he did not see them applying; but we would need a certificate.

 

David.

[Keeping Up]

We got our certificate from Brian Taylor at Middlewich. He was very helpful and gave us some useful tips.

 

Here are some pictures from our trip from Weston Marsh to Ellesmere Port this morning.

 

 

 

The channel to/from Weston Marsh is now very clearly marked with red and green buoys:

 

View from Weston Marsh by Keeping Up, on Flickr

 

 

 

Some parts of the Ship canal are very pretty; this is Ince Cutting.

 

 

Ince cutting by Keeping Up, on Flickr

 

 

 

This was the only vessel we encountered that was actually moving at the time:

 

 

MSC workboat by Keeping Up, on Flickr

 

 

 

This one and several others came past Ellesmere Port immediately after we had left the canal:

 

 

Bigger than us by Keeping Up, on Flickr

Edited June 20, 2011 by Keeping Up