You're gonna need a bigger boat!

[Albion]

It's true that if the rudder catches on something, the wheel may spin very, very fast if it's a mechanical system.

 

On 2 of my barges (38m) I had mechanical steering, on 1 I had 28 turns lock to lock (180°) and on the other 30 turns, so you can imagine what will happen to the wheel when the rudder catches on something, and you better don't have a knob or a spike if you're standing close to a suddenly fast spinning wheel, as it could easily break your wrist or do even more serious damage to you.

 

Peter.

 

Hi Peter,

Yes, the description that you give of the mechanical ratio of the mechanical system would mean that the wheel rim would be travelling at a hell of a speed if the rudder was caught suddenly. It's possibly why there seems to be a law about it in France.

 

 

OK. Wide beam, Dutch barge style or something else?

 

Both my bf and Dad (who will probably end up doing alot of the work) are quite keen on the idea of getting a wide beam sail away. I can see why from my Dads point of view. Its going to be a heck of alot easier to fit out a big rectangle than something with various rooms.

I however as i've already said would like a wheel house mostly for having a light room (i do alot of crafts so having natural light is useful) also I imagine a bit higher view is nice.

I'm also interested in something different. Theres a tug near by that I really want to go and have a look at.

 

Obviously a lot will depend on the mooring we end up getting but for now this is just me playing with ideas. What would you go for?

 

My choice would be a Dutch Barge style boat, but I would say that wouldn't I having just bought one . The wheelhouse is a useful and sociable space. They look more stylish than a wide beam nb as well.

Disadvantages: Well perhaps the gunwales will be wider than a wide beam nb which narrows the cabin a bit. Also, depending what waterway you intend to cruise on the wheelhouse might have to be lowered and raised occasionally. IIRC, you are on the G&S, or somewhere down there so you may not have a wheelhouse demount issue. Look carefully at the various DB makers because the wheelhouse air drafts vary enormously.

Roger

[Dekazer]

Our old neighbour is selling his DB at the moment (still on sale AFAIK): http://apolloduck.net/147450 (That's our wee boat next to it in the photos).

 

Good friends of ours lived on it and had plenty of space - as a couple. It always felt massive to us when we went round It did have a pretty deep draught but wasn't bad to steer. And the history of it's fascinating. That's part of the appeal of old DBs I think. Good luck with your search!

[Chickadee]

Thanks for that Dekazer, I like the look of it but I think both my bf and Dad are thinking more of a wide beam now

I will keep it in mind though if I manage to change there minds.

 

Just having a bit of a look on various sites and I spotted these two boats.

 

http://www.theusedboat.co.uk/stock_details.asp?bro_no=400 Orca

 

http://www.theusedboat.co.uk/stock_details.asp?bro_no=659 Khan

 

I wondered if anyone knew why they would be the same price? As far as I can tell Orca is newer but shorter and Khan is older and longer but not quite as wide. I don't know about engines other than the very basics, (I leave that all to the men folk while I pick out pretty material and bake cake )

 

I remember someone saying the other day about new and used over pricing so do you think these prices are fair? I'm totally day dreaming here obiously the one is sold so we wouldn't be considering that anyway but i'm just trying to do as much research as I can and get to know wide beams a little better.

[Hippoclides]

Thanks for that Dekazer, I like the look of it but I think both my bf and Dad are thinking more of a wide beam now

I will keep it in mind though if I manage to change there minds.

 

Just having a bit of a look on various sites and I spotted these two boats.

 

http://www.theusedboat.co.uk/stock_details.asp?bro_no=400 Orca

 

http://www.theusedboat.co.uk/stock_details.asp?bro_no=659 Khan

 

I wondered if anyone knew why they would be the same price? As far as I can tell Orca is newer but shorter and Khan is older and longer but not quite as wide. I don't know about engines other than the very basics, (I leave that all to the men folk while I pick out pretty material and bake cake )

 

I remember someone saying the other day about new and used over pricing so do you think these prices are fair? I'm totally day dreaming here obiously the one is sold so we wouldn't be considering that anyway but i'm just trying to do as much research as I can and get to know wide beams a little better.

Hard to tell how boats get priced, I guess it's a compromise between what the owner wants for them and what the broker thinks they'll sell for. I think the owners of some more recent widebeam boats, bought as luxury liveaboards, are thinking of them like houses and expect to get back what they paid. It seems to take them a long time to accept this isn't going to happen and finally drop their prices. Generally the second-hand market is much weaker than it was before the recession and an old hand recently advised me to start by offering 30% less than asking price on any boat that took my fancy! That might be a bit extreme but I often see it mentioned on here that many go for 10-20% less than asking.

 

Khan is quite unusual, I haven't seen very many widebeam "narrow boats" for sale that are that old, most seem to be five years or less. So either they only became common relatively recently, or a lot of recent buyers are regretting their decision and trying to sell their boat on. You might be able to bargain the price down a bit on the basis of age, particularly if a survey threw something up. The interior design is also a break from the norm, although I couldn't say that I like it myself. Nice floor, though. No idea about the relative quality of the enginges but the solar panels and wind turbine may have added something to the price.

 

I've never bought a boat (yet) but have been looking at widebeams for sale for a while, so hope this is of more help than not!

[Chickadee]

Blimey! We hardly bartered on our boat 3 years ago. Although that was after the guy doing the survey told us it was worth more than they were asking for it so we just wanted a quick sale after that.

 

I hadn't thought about the wind turbines and solar pannels adding that much to it but I guess they are quite expensive to buy. I really like the quirkyness of Khan and the open feel to it. Interior wise it looks well looked after too and not like a posh static van which seems to be the general look of wide beams. We're not ready to move just yet though so hopefully if its over priced it might be around for a while.

I'd rather get a sail away so we can do exactly what we want inside but i'm not sure how long I can handle sleeping at other peoples houses for. Although I guess once we've got the stove and porta loo in we could make shift a bed...

[Albion]

Blimey! We hardly bartered on our boat 3 years ago. Although that was after the guy doing the survey told us it was worth more than they were asking for it so we just wanted a quick sale after that.

 

Just take a look at the general advertisements in the back of the magazines; there are entry after entry saying 'price reduced'. If that doesn't mean that there are good prices to be had then I don't know what does

Bargain hard if you're going down the second-hand route; it must make sense in this financial climate.

Roger

[Chickadee]

Just take a look at the general advertisements in the back of the magazines; there are entry after entry saying 'price reduced'. If that doesn't mean that there are good prices to be had then I don't know what does

Bargain hard if you're going down the second-hand route; it must make sense in this financial climate.

Roger

 

Yeah we will now for sure! When we got our boat unfortunatly it was just the tail end of it being the other way round!

 

Shame theres not more wide beams about. I can see this being the other issue. We got to look over a fair few narrow boats before we settled on one now we'll have to compromise more I guess.

[Hippoclides]

Shame theres not more wide beams about. I can see this being the other issue. We got to look over a fair few narrow boats before we settled on one now we'll have to compromise more I guess.

From what I've seen there seems to be much less variety in widebeams. Smaller boat builders don't tend to go for them so there are fewer unusual layouts or quirky interiors. There are a lot of full-fitted Liverpool boats on sale, nothing wrong with that, but they do tend to be pretty similar. The choice in interiors generally seems to boil down to how big the shell is and whether you want an extra cabin or not. But there are exceptions, Khan is one with its open-plan interior, and there are some trad sterns around but they're much less common than cruisers.

 

Anyway, good luck with your search!

[Chickadee]

Bigger boat, Yup! I think we've finally decided on a bigger boat thanks to a friendly neighbor who let us look round his lovely dutch barge the other day. It was as i'd imagined (which isn't suprising the amount of them i've looked at on AD) and although his was alot bigger than what we need I've fallen hard for a boat with a wheel house. I don't think a wide beam will quite hit the spot. I'm also totally scared about steering one but also super excited to give it a go. We've given ourselves 4-6 months to get our current boat sorted and sold and find our new bigger toy. As that will be winter i'm hoping we might pick up a bargain.

Maybe we started to small with our 42ft and now my longing for more space has got a bit out of hand but I can't bring myself to move off the water just yet! We're also thinking this will be the boat that we might have kids (or atleast one kid) on so we need space for them to.

 

EEeeee! Exciting!!

[blackrose]

Bigger boat, Yup! I think we've finally decided on a bigger boat thanks to a friendly neighbor who let us look round his lovely dutch barge the other day. It was as i'd imagined (which isn't suprising the amount of them i've looked at on AD) and although his was alot bigger than what we need I've fallen hard for a boat with a wheel house. I don't think a wide beam will quite hit the spot. I'm also totally scared about steering one but also super excited to give it a go. We've given ourselves 4-6 months to get our current boat sorted and sold and find our new bigger toy. As that will be winter i'm hoping we might pick up a bargain.

 

I think most barge owners would rather have a Dutch barge than a NB style widebeam. They are completely different boats and all other things being equal (size, age, equipment, etc), a NB style widebeam will generally be much cheaper. However, if it's the wheelhouse that's the dealbreaker, you could always find a NB style widebeam with a wheelhouse.

[Chickadee]

I've seen a few of the widebeams with a wheel house and i'm not really a fan. Doesn't look right to me. Although I haven't actually been on one so then I might change my mind.

[Orca]

Great thread title!

 

The remains of her still lye on a sandbank around Martha's Vineyard for what it's worth.

 

(For 'her', see Avatar)

Edited July 26, 2011 by Orca

[Robbo]

I think most barge owners would rather have a Dutch barge than a NB style widebeam. They are completely different boats and all other things being equal (size, age, equipment, etc), a NB style widebeam will generally be much cheaper. However, if it's the wheelhouse that's the dealbreaker, you could always find a NB style widebeam with a wheelhouse.

 

I live on a replica Dutch barge and I agree, a wide beam isn't the same! You do feel to get more room on a wide bean though for the same size, the gunnels are a lot wider on a Dutch barge.

Edited July 27, 2011 by Robbo

[Chickadee]

I live on a replica Dutch barge and I agree, a wide beam isn't the same! You do feel to get more room on a wide bean though for the same size, the gunnels are a lot wider on a Dutch barge.

 

That is a good point about the gunnels. The DB we went on the other day was rather a big one so my view is probably a little skewed of how nice they are inside size wise. Widebeams do seem to be a nice large rectangle shape that you could do anything with.

 

There are a couple of wide beams for sale near us, maybe I better go see if I can have a look around these and see how I feel then. (the one I love the look of so who knows I might fall for that one ) I guess I could always get a pram style cover for the back end if i'm still hankering after that space with light to work in. I'd probably use it most in the summer anyway.

 

I think i'm confusuing myself here! I think maybe it will be more of a case of what is avaliable once we've sold our boat as there is only so long I can spend with the inlaws which is probably where we'll end up inbetween times.

 

Its a good job my Dad is consulted to check out all the technical stuff i'm so drawn by my heart i'd probably end up buying a totally beautiful but useless reck.

[Robbo]

That is a good point about the gunnels. The DB we went on the other day was rather a big one so my view is probably a little skewed of how nice they are inside size wise. Widebeams do seem to be a nice large rectangle shape that you could do anything with.

 

To be honest, even though with wider gunnels on a dutch barge, you get the same useable floor space, as cabinets, etc tend to be under the gunnels anyhow.. Nice rectangle shape? One of the reasons why people prefer the dutch barges is because there not rectangle!

[Chickadee]

Thats true... and i do like things out of the ordinary (obviously as i'm already living on a boat )

 

I think at the end of the day it will come down to what we can afford and whats avaliable when we're ready to buy. I'm sure my Dad would love us to get a widebeam sailaway for him to play with.

[blackrose]

I'm not sure if anyone already mentioned this, but your choice might depend on which waterways you intend to be on.

 

If it's a big river like the Thames then a Dutch barge will be fine. However, the one area in which a narrowboat style widebeam may have an advantage is on some broadbeam canals. Despite checking the nominal depth of canals and bridge heights with BW before starting their journeys, some Dutch barge owners have had problems navigating canals due to the draught and air-draught of their vessels.

 

At 2'2" my widebeam draws less than many narrowboats and the air-draught is about the same as most narrowboats, meaning I can easily get under the low bridges on the broadbeam canals.

Edited July 29, 2011 by blackrose

[Chickadee]

Yeah, thats the other thing that would lean us towards a widebeam. I think we would be more limited with anything with a wheelhouse on which rivers we can go on and how far up we can go up them. Today i'm leaning more towards a widebeam for sure.

[Chickadee]

Does anyone have any opinions either way on widebeam builders. Was just looking at Cuttwater and I like the shape of them and that they've been in the business a few years but i'm just looking at the images so not really the same as seeing it in the flesh.