DIY boat build

[W+T]

Always fancied building a boat from scratch myself, but never decided what material to use, steel or GRP, either wide or narrow, spose it depends on where i want to cruise, that will come when i decide on the material.

Now price will be big on the decision, i dont mind it of GRP/plywood but would you avoid that and stick with steel. Even had the idea of doing a kingspan shell and laying GRP upon that, that way you get a built in insulation and easy to form the shell, just messy i guess.

I will/would be building this at home, but i have heard that to build a boat from scratch at home you need planning permission, is this some daft tail i have heard of? sounds a bit daft to me.

 

Can anyone give me there ideas of what they did and why they did it that way, i see from this site and others that a lot of folk are not fond of, as they say `plastic boats` but why?

 

wayne

[carlt]

It depends what size you want.

 

Personally I would avoid a grp home build (unless it's a little dinghy) because of the chemicals involved so wood or steel are your main options.

 

So, are you a woodworker or metalworker?

 

I've never heard of planning permission needed but I have only built small wooden boats.

 

A 72' narrowboat may be different.

[O'Mali]

I did think about having a go with Diabond. I use it all the time at work for cladding buildings with.

 

It is good stuff and there are some cheaper brand names on the market now.

 

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&s...s&oq=diabon

Edited February 7, 2010 by O'Mali

[W+T]

It depends what size you want.

 

Personally I would avoid a grp home build (unless it's a little dinghy) because of the chemicals involved so wood or steel are your main options.

 

So, are you a woodworker or metalworker?

 

I've never heard of planning permission needed but I have only built small wooden boats.

 

A 72' narrowboat may be different.

 

 

At the minute i am thinking of about a 40`x8` maybe 10`, i am best at metal work and engineering but can do most things realy.

As for the chemicals do you mean the pong given off with GRP, i was thinking that myself, neibourghs wouldnt like that so much.

 

I did think about having a go with Diabond. I use it all the time at work for cladding buildings with.

 

It is good stuff and there are some cheaper brand names on the market now.

 

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&s...s&oq=diabon

 

Whats that then matey?

[O'Mali]

Whats that then matey?

Aluminium composite, the link will tell you about it but what I like is you can cold form it and back up the joints only with GRP.

[W+T]

Aluminium composite, the link will tell you about it but what I like is you can cold form it and back up the joints only with GRP.

 

Thats another idea to go at, sounds good stuff too.

 

 

Who has a build blog to have a look at, like to see what you have built, what plans you used or even totaly desined your own.

[BlueStringPudding]

I find OSB is fine if you don't mind dissolve-in-the-bag bulkheads...

[casper ghost]

Hi. We've just built a steel narrowboat from scratch. For some ideas you could have a look at my blog, though we are very ameteur. Ther blog does show alot of problems we encountered. Determination and comitment are the main things you need. It's all too easy to start and never finish

[W+T]

Hi. We've just built a steel narrowboat from scratch. For some ideas you could have a look at my blog, though we are very ameteur. Ther blog does show alot of problems we encountered. Determination and comitment are the main things you need. It's all too easy to start and never finish

 

 

Thanks for that, i have a quick look through and i like the design, very nice, and different, nice long front deck and pointy....if thats the tech term

Take a bit of doing i bet, definatley not a quick job, i need a good long project to keep my mind busy.Will have a good read through.

[Bob the welder]

Always fancied building a boat from scratch myself, but never decided what material to use, steel or GRP, either wide or narrow, spose it depends on where i want to cruise, that will come when i decide on the material.

Now price will be big on the decision, i dont mind it of GRP/plywood but would you avoid that and stick with steel. Even had the idea of doing a kingspan shell and laying GRP upon that, that way you get a built in insulation and easy to form the shell, just messy i guess.

I will/would be building this at home, but i have heard that to build a boat from scratch at home you need planning permission, is this some daft tail i have heard of? sounds a bit daft to me.

 

Can anyone give me there ideas of what they did and why they did it that way, i see from this site and others that a lot of folk are not fond of, as they say `plastic boats` but why?

 

wayne

i did my 67 foot boat in the garden .play clip .bobVisit My Website

[Teadaemon]

40'x8' is a very big boat indeed for a first project.

 

It's probably better to pick your construction material after you've decided on a design - some designs are more suited to some materials than others.

 

I very strongly recommend that you either buy a stock plan off a qualified naval architect, or commission a custom design. Don't build anything without plans and don't try to design it yourself unless you're happy to spend a lot of time learning basic naval architecture (also bear in mind that mistakes cost a lot less when they're made on paper rather than in wood or steel).

[W+T]

40'x8' is a very big boat indeed for a first project.

 

It's probably better to pick your construction material after you've decided on a design - some designs are more suited to some materials than others.

 

I very strongly recommend that you either buy a stock plan off a qualified naval architect, or commission a custom design. Don't build anything without plans and don't try to design it yourself unless you're happy to spend a lot of time learning basic naval architecture (also bear in mind that mistakes cost a lot less when they're made on paper rather than in wood or steel).

 

 

Good advice there, i am looking into designs as we speak and will definatley getting plans drawn up.

 

Where have you found the best suppliers for the steel, i am still at the stage of costing, is it much cheaper to build your own shell? what wre the costs of your shell excluding tools.

[casper ghost]

Where have you found the best suppliers for the steel, i am still at the stage of costing, is it much cheaper to build your own shell? what wre the costs of your shell excluding tools.

 

The steel for our 60 foot boat was about 7k, another 1k for renting land and craning into water. Stern gear stuff is a couple of hundred, windows vary alot, can be bought for under 1k. The propeller, second hand about a hundred, new up to 5 hundred.

[carlt]

I very strongly recommend that you either buy a stock plan off a qualified naval architect, or commission a custom design. Don't build anything without plans and don't try to design it yourself unless you're happy to spend a lot of time learning basic naval architecture (also bear in mind that mistakes cost a lot less when they're made on paper rather than in wood or steel).

I wonder how many clonecraft, on the English canals have had any input, whatsoever, from a naval architect.

 

Not really relevant, to the OP, but if anyone fancies a crack at building a small, attractive, wooden boat then I can highly recommend "Building your first wooden boat" by George W. Barnes.

 

He explains how to build a Downeast Skiff the traditional way, intuitively, rather than using plans, producing a very nice, stable little boat.

[Teadaemon]

I wonder how many clonecraft, on the English canals have had any input, whatsoever, from a naval architect.

 

Not really relevant, to the OP, but if anyone fancies a crack at building a small, attractive, wooden boat then I can highly recommend "Building your first wooden boat" by George W. Barnes.

 

He explains how to build a Downeast Skiff the traditional way, intuitively, rather than using plans, producing a very nice, stable little boat.

 

It's a fair point that most narrowboats haven't been designed by a naval architect, but are basically copies of a small selection of traditional designs. I would however suggest that the attentions of a naval architect are unlikely ever to be a bad thing, even for a narrowboat. Since the OP isn't planning to build a narrowboat, I'd suggest that at least waving the plans under the nose of a naval architect would be a good idea. The going rate for a stock plan varies a bit, but I saw some of Paul Fisher's designs on his website that would cost somewhere between £150 and £300 - not a great deal compared to the other costs of building a boat, really.

 

I mention Paul Fisher as he's the only NA I've actually bought plans from myself (albeit for a 12' canoe), there are plenty of others out there.

 

BTW Carl, I should remember that reading your posts can be injurious to the state of my wallet - £14.50 for a hardback 1st edition of that book, thanks to bookfinder.com and Abebooks.

 

It's just occurred to me that I still haven't answered the question in the OP - what to build a 40' x 8-10' displacement motor cruiser/barge from, as an amateur building a single vessel in the back garden?

 

The answer is that all materials have their pros and cons, and it largely comes down to personal preference. The two methods I wouldn't recommend are conventional GRP with a female mold, and traditional wooden construction. The former because it's expensive for a one-off, and the latter because it requires a large amount of skill and is very wasteful of expensive wood. This still leaves quite a few options, which I'll try to cover below:

 

Wood/glass/epoxy composites

 

The way to go if you want a wooden boat, with many different techniques possible (cold molded, strip planking, ply on frame, stitch and glue plywood, clinker (aka lapstrake) glued ply, and probably others I can't recall). Sheathing the outside with glass cloth and epoxy produces a boat with similar durability and maintenance requirements to GRP, and the various materials and techniques can be used to easily produce a wide variety of shapes, so it's relatively easy to build a pretty boat using these methods.

 

Steel or aluminium

 

If you're familiar with working with steel or aluminium, and have access to the necessary equipment, then there's a lot to recommend them. Building in steel is likely to be one of the cheaper methods (more expensive than ferrocement, but the steel boat will have a much higher resale value due to market prejudice against ferro boats). On the downside, unless you get a good design or have the ability to produce curved plates, it is possible to produce a really, really ugly steel boat.

 

Ferrocement

 

A bit of an odd choice in the second decade of the 20th Century, but there's quite a few ferro hulls built by amateurs that are now celebrating their half century. The ones that were built properly are lasting very well. Probably the cheapest way to build a hull (though the cost of the hull is probably less than a third of the cost of the whole boat, whatever it's made from, within reason), and good designs for ferro tend to have lots of curves in them, so they can look very good too. You're unlikely to find any designs specifically for ferrocement produced since about 1980, but it can work well with a lot of designs for traditional wooden construction (the key is to get a design with nice, full curves to maximise the strength of the ferrocement skin).

 

Anything else

 

Whilst I have occasionally come across boats constructed from other materials (cupro-nickel, leather skin on steamed ash frames, Bakelite panels on oak frames, to name but three), I would suggest that it's probably not advisable to experiment on a project of this size, particularly with aluminised polyethylene (which in the absence of a really effective cathodic protection system, will fairly rapidly become plain polyethylene anywhere the lacquer gets scratched).

[carlt]

BTW Carl, I should remember that reading your posts can be injurious to the state of my wallet - £14.50 for a hardback 1st edition of that book, thanks to bookfinder.com and Abebooks.

"Boat Building Simplified" by Herbert J.Ashcroft

 

Another lovely little book describing "The Ashcroft Method" a very early form of cold-moulding.

[casper ghost]

I've never heard of planning permission needed but I have only built small wooden boats.

 

The Council took a Court Order out against my Dad as he built his second steel narrowboat in the garden in 1984. They argued that it was a hobby akin to a business and as such needed planning permission. The council won in court, my dad didn't defend the action. That set a precedent which is still valid today, it was publicised in the waterways magazines at the time. Mind you the court said he was allowed 6 months to finish the build as in it's current state the shell would have been unsafe to move and it wasn't going to take him that long to finish anyway

 

Edited to correct date....

Edited February 10, 2010 by casper ghost

[W+T]

Can i ask what a navel architect does, i understand that he designs boats/hulls etc, but on a NB?, does the bow/stern need to be a certain design?

I was thinking of my own design then giving it to planner to set out plans for me to work from, does that sound viable?

 

A few have said that a 40x8 steel canal boat is a big first project, if this is so what would you suggest to start with, it doesnt sound or look much more to make say a 30 foot NB than a 40x8 , i dont fancy doing one and then doing another at a later date.

 

Thanks folks

 

wayne

[Lee J]

Wayne,

 

Take a look at the kit's

 

http://www.dutch-barges.net/

 

Lee

[W+T]

Wayne,

 

Take a look at the kit's

 

http://www.dutch-barges.net/

 

Lee

 

Nice one Lee, been looking for these, looks a few more grtand and all is cut for you to `air fix` together, a good way to make a bit less work and get a luxmotor.

Very good consideration matey.

 

Thanks Lee

[Teadaemon]

Can i ask what a navel architect does, i understand that he designs boats/hulls etc, but on a NB?, does the bow/stern need to be a certain design?

I was thinking of my own design then giving it to planner to set out plans for me to work from, does that sound viable?

 

A few have said that a 40x8 steel canal boat is a big first project, if this is so what would you suggest to start with, it doesnt sound or look much more to make say a 30 foot NB than a 40x8 , i dont fancy doing one and then doing another at a later date.

 

Thanks folks

 

wayne

 

You are correct that a naval architect designs boats, performing the necessary performance and stability calculations, and may produce a bill of materials and construction sequence in addition to detailed plans (though equally, many who are used to working with professional boatbuilders might only produce a set of lines for the hull, and leave the rest to the boatbuilder). Whilst it is possible to build a narrowboat by simply copying features from existing narrowboats, I would suggest that the generally fairly modest price of a set of plans prepared by a naval architect would be a good investment. A 40' x 8' boat, even a 'fat narrowboat' is different enough that simply copying the features of a narrowboat and making them a bit wider is not guaranteed to produce a decent boat.

 

For a first project, I'd recommend a small rowing or sailing dinghy - I'm currently trying to sort out the materials to build a Cartopper by Phil Bolger - an 11'6" x 4' dinghy for oar, sail, or outboard power, with plans from the book Instant Boatbuilding With Dynamite Payson. That way, even if you decide you're actually not that keen on boatbuilding, there's still a chance that you'll end up with a finished boat, unlike a great many people who've started off with a big project (and 40' x 8', or even 30' x 6'10" are definitely big projects).

[Biggles]

W+T

 

I am building a Nic Branson design although its not on his website. See my blog in the sig.

 

For me as a welder steel is the best option.

 

Biggles

[RLWP]

<snip>

 

A few have said that a 40x8 steel canal boat is a big first project, if this is so what would you suggest to start with, it doesnt sound or look much more to make say a 30 foot NB than a 40x8 , i dont fancy doing one and then doing another at a later date.

 

Thanks folks

 

wayne

 

 

How about this: link

 

Richard

 

In a material not listed so far I think

Edited February 10, 2010 by RLWP

[Biggles]

For a first project, I'd recommend a small rowing or sailing dinghy

 

 

So a 60 x 12 widebam NB design is not recommended ? :-) lol

[W+T]

You are correct that a naval architect designs boats, performing the necessary performance and stability calculations, and may produce a bill of materials and construction sequence in addition to detailed plans (though equally, many who are used to working with professional boatbuilders might only produce a set of lines for the hull, and leave the rest to the boatbuilder). Whilst it is possible to build a narrowboat by simply copying features from existing narrowboats, I would suggest that the generally fairly modest price of a set of plans prepared by a naval architect would be a good investment. A 40' x 8' boat, even a 'fat narrowboat' is different enough that simply copying the features of a narrowboat and making them a bit wider is not guaranteed to produce a decent boat.

 

For a first project, I'd recommend a small rowing or sailing dinghy - I'm currently trying to sort out the materials to build a Cartopper by Phil Bolger - an 11'6" x 4' dinghy for oar, sail, or outboard power, with plans from the book Instant Boatbuilding With Dynamite Payson. That way, even if you decide you're actually not that keen on boatbuilding, there's still a chance that you'll end up with a finished boat, unlike a great many people who've started off with a big project (and 40' x 8', or even 30' x 6'10" are definitely big projects).

 

 

Well i wasnt expecting you to suggest a 11` dinghy, cant see tracey sleeping under the stars to often with a stove so close at her toes

 

I have seen boats of all shapes and sizes built and likly without an architect as one or two were along the lines of a skip, as it goes i think it would be a good idea to get a set of plans drwan up then but thats all i can see therm use for on a boat that only ever goes around 5 knots.

 

 

 

Hi Richard, i guess it could be made water proof with a good coating of water proof PVA glue , better check with a navel architect firs though before i use that type of material