Who enforces permanent cruising?

[Sir Nibble]

Well since you're asking the question in such a rhetorical way, I expect you can answer your own question.

 

You obviously have your definition of who is and isn't a boater and you're entitled to your opinion, but I don't accept what i think is a rather limited view, the same as I don't accept the opinion of some liveaboards who think that you're not a boater unless you're living on your boat.

 

Tell me something Snibble, there are people in my marina at Brentford who have never moved their boat since they arrived more than 18 months ago, apart from once when we had to shift around because they were dredging the basin. One woman brought her boat down from Chester to London two years ago but she hasn't moved it since. I have a friend who has a boat in France but he hasn't moved his boat for over a year. He's owned about 10 different boats over about 30 years.

 

Are these people boaters or not? th, 6 months, a year...Can you tell me exactly when someone ceases to be a boater to because they haven't moved their boat? Is it 2 weeks, a mon.? Or does it also depend on what type of mooring they are on and how much they are paying?

 

I'd really like a definitive answer.

You obviously have your definition of who is and isn't a boater

No, I don't. It just occurred to me that we all like to think that we are joined together by a shared enthusiasm, where are the boundaries of the group. I do not doubt that if you look you will find a newsgroup of masochists all keen to help and encourage one another, can one claim the support of that network on the grounds of once having been beaten up? Same thing, different motive. Is a copper on duty at a football match part of the same group identity as the fans?

 

Can you tell me exactly when someone ceases to be a boater to because they haven't moved their boat? Is it 2 weeks, a mon.?

No, I cannot tell you that. I have not raised this issue to promote my own "predjudice". I have mooted a point to debate, and I come to it without a preconcieved answer to argue for, what do you think?

Or does it also depend on what type of mooring they are on and how much they are paying?

Of course not. I do not have a hidden agenda, if anything, mooring is what you do when you're NOT boating, or is it? I dunno. Again, what do you think?

I'd really like a definitive answer.

Me too but I doubt you will get one, but you might witness a consensus.

 

Edited to add, if you hire a boat to go boating, you are a boater. Ar what point having handed the boat over do you stop being a boater? How about if like some of our members you hire every year, surely then you are a boater all year round, aren't you?

Edited May 8, 2008 by snibble

[Lee J]

If they were willing to provide positive input to the forum, I can't see the problem.

 

What was the saying "don't judge a man till you've walked a mile in his shoes"

 

Paul

 

And as Billy Connolly said:

 

"then you'll be a mile away, and you've got his shoes"

 

Lee

[blackrose]

No, I cannot tell you that. I have not raised this issue to promote my own "predjudice". I have mooted a point to debate, and I come to it without a preconcieved answer to argue for, what do you think?

 

Of course not. I do not have a hidden agenda, if anything, mooring is what you do when you're NOT boating, or is it? I dunno. Again, what do you think?

 

I thought I'd already made it clear what I think in post 37. I think there are many different kinds of boater and none is any more valid than the other.

[Chris Pink]

"Is it 2 weeks, a mon.?"

 

I move that it should be 10 minutes.

 

 

"I do not doubt that if you look you will find a newsgroup of masochists all keen to help and encourage one another"

 

Now there's an image!

 

 

A boater is somebody who is boating, when they are not boating they are not a boater. Simple. When they are driving they are a driving, when they are picking their nose they are a nose-picker.

 

Standing on a boat looking at ducks is boating, therefore geezer who annoyed Snibble so much is a boater. When he is in Sainsbury's he is a shopper.

[Sir Nibble]

I thought I'd already made it clear what I think in post 37. I think there are many different kinds of boater and none is any more valid than the other.

So to clarify, WITHOUT wishing to dispute your opinion. Polishing brass makes you a boater, provided the brass is part of a boat?

The old biddie with a mop who cleans the decks of HMS Belfast after the visitors have gone is a sailor, the character who turns the lights on on HMS Alliance Is a submariner, and presumably, the bloke who bottles oxygen for NASA is an astronaut.

This is like walking on eggshells!

I suppose Carl is right, we are what we define OURSELVES as and all and any group identity is a falsehood.

 

geezer who annoyed Snibble so much

No one has annoyed me!!

This is what makes it so much like walking on eggshells, is it impossible to raise a point for discussion without the assumption (In the face of my clear statement in plain English that the bloke DOESN'T upset me) that there must be a hidden agenda?

Edited May 8, 2008 by snibble

[blackrose]

Dont worry Blackrose - I move mine constantly in order to make up for the non-movers, to keep the average score high. That way we are all boaters! :-)

 

Yes, I realised I wasn't doing my bit so I've made a move for a few weeks. Actually I couldn't bear the thought of being stuck in that basin for the whole summer!

 

Just to change the subject, here are a couple of pictures. I'm always amazed at how the surroundings can change so completely in a short time. I went for a stroll into Denham village yesterday evening - one days cruise and it's a million miles from Brentford.

 

Denham Deep

 

View back down from the lock

 

The white thing you can see in front of my bow is not a swan feeding - it's a plastic bag hanging from a rope containing a couple of bottles of beer. I'm managing without a fridge until I get around to finishing my gas installation.

[GSer]

Yes, I realised I wasn't doing my bit so I've made a move for a few weeks. Actually I couldn't bear the thought of being stuck in that basin for the whole summer!

 

Just to change the subject, here are a couple of pictures. I'm always amazed at how the surroundings can change so completely in a short time. I went for a stroll into Denham village yesterday evening - one days cruise and it's a million miles from Brentford.

 

Denham Deep

 

View back down from the lock

 

The white thing you can see in front of my bow is not a swan feeding - it's a plastic bag hanging from a rope containing a couple of bottles of beer. I'm managing without a fridge until I get around to finishing my gas installation.

 

 

Hi sorry to change the subject, but what lense were you using on the second picture? It appears to have distorted the image in such a way as to make your boat look 'fat'

 

Paul

[blackrose]

So to clarify, WITHOUT wishing to dispute your opinion. Polishing brass makes you a boater, provided the brass is part of a boat?

The old biddie with a mop who cleans the decks of HMS Belfast after the visitors have gone is a sailor, the character who turns the lights on on HMS Alliance Is a submariner, and presumably, the bloke who bottles oxygen for NASA is an astronaut.

This is like walking on eggshells!

I suppose Carl is right, we are what we define OURSELVES as and all and any group identity is a falsehood.

 

I completely agree, but weren't you the one questioning how we should define boaters in posts 34 & 40?

 

Now you seem to be saying we don't need to define it - anyway, I agree there's no need and no point.

Edited May 8, 2008 by blackrose

[carlt]

I think the people polishing brass, switching the lights off or mopping the decks may well be enthusiasts who, for whatever reason don't have the opportunity to feel the boat move.

 

That doesn't mean their opinion is less valid, or, in some cases make them less knowledgeable than any other enthusiast.

[blackrose]

Hi sorry to change the subject, but what lense were you using on the second picture? It appears to have distorted the image in such a way as to make your boat look 'fat'

 

Paul

 

Either that or the lens has distorted the others making them look too thin...

[Sir Nibble]

I completely agree, but weren't you the one questioning how we should define a boater in post 34?

 

Now you seem to be saying we don't need to define it - anyway, I agree there's no need and no point.

My intention was less to ask how we SHOULD define a boater and more how we MIGHT define a boater. I hope you would agree that there is an important destinction beyond weaselly backtracking semantics.

 

It is frequently mentioned how difficult it can be to have a conversation by text without the subtle visual nuances of face to face contact. Just "Shooting the breeze" as our colonial masters would have it, I think an offhand remark which was never intended to be an issue has collided with coming from a known hater of anyone without a brand new narrowboat immovably ensconced in an expensive marina, has perhaps caused a reflex action by the more liberal minded to scuttle off and defend a position so inclusive, that having once built an Airfix battleship makes one a boater.

Her's another odd bit. I'm a Liberal. Capital L, I believe firmly that NOTHING should be banned or restrained without a good reason. I don't object to people living on the towpath out of the way. I don't object to people owning dogs, doing drugs or pogo sticking without knee and elbow protection. However, if I make a statement that "People living on 24 hour moorings are being unfair to the rest of us" somehow, I always end up being represented as anti CC, judgemental, snobbish and an all round fascist! This cripples my ability to interact in almost any way beyond "Beer beer beer beer beer", and it only gets worse as I struggle to be understood.

[blackrose]

My intention was less to ask how we SHOULD define a boater and more how we MIGHT define a boater. I hope you would agree that there is an important destinction beyond weaselly backtracking semantics.

 

Mmm... should, might... weasely backtracking semanitics...

[moggyjo]

I'm not rough? am I?

And nor is Tim & Di.

[CHRI5 Blessed]

when were those pictures taken blackrose? recent or a couple of years? denham i would say is one of the nicest country parts of the southern grand union!

 

ya know for long term mooring without paying, there is plenty of room between cowley peachy junction and bulls bridge junction! also traffic needs increasing along that stretch, it is starting to get really weeded up, i got a pair of under pants on my prop on monday!!!! im damn glad i have a weed hatch! i dred to think where those under pants were before my prop!

 

Chris Gray.

[Chris Pink]

MHowever, if I make a statement that "People living on 24 hour moorings are being unfair to the rest of us" somehow, I always end up being represented as anti CC, judgemental, snobbish and an all round fascist!

 

As one of the people who has taken issue with you in the past, i don't think you are being entirely fair. As you say this is a debating forum and disagreement goes with the territory. However, I do not know of anybody who has disagreed with you about people living on 24 hour moorings, myself included. I don't think it was implied that geezer was living on a visitor mooring.

[CHRI5 Blessed]

one of the things is if nobody paid for a mooring permit then where will BW get money to maintain the canal between locks?

 

Chris Gray

[nbtafelberg]

Bored now...

 

Websters Dictionary

 

boater

One entry found.

 

boater

 

 

Main Entry:

boat·er Listen to the pronunciation of boater

Pronunciation:

\ˈbō-tər\

Function:

noun

Date:

1605

 

1 : one who travels in a boat 2 : a stiff hat usually made of braided straw with a brim, hatband, and flat crown

 

Good enough for me

[nbtafelberg]

one of the things is if nobody paid for a mooring permit then where will BW get money to maintain the canal between locks?

 

Chris Gray

 

They have to maintain the locks too.

[CHRI5 Blessed]

They have to maintain the locks too.

 

yes but that would be why we pay cruising liscenses so we can cruise! i wonder when they first initiated moorings fees?

 

Chris Gray

[Chris-B]

yes but that would be why we pay cruising liscenses so we can cruise! i wonder when they first initiated moorings fees?

 

Chris Gray

 

(editied cos I typed a load of bollocks)

Edited May 8, 2008 by Baldock

[blackrose]

when were those pictures taken blackrose? recent or a couple of years? denham i would say is one of the nicest country parts of the southern grand union!

 

ya know for long term mooring without paying, there is plenty of room between cowley peachy junction and bulls bridge junction! also traffic needs increasing along that stretch, it is starting to get really weeded up, i got a pair of under pants on my prop on monday!!!! im damn glad i have a weed hatch! i dred to think where those under pants were before my prop!

 

Chris Gray.

 

They were taken yesterday evening Chris.

 

You'd have to be pretty hardcore to want to moor up anywhere between Bulls Bridge & Cowley. I can't get through that section fast enough! It's not only weeds and rubbish, there's about 500 yards of wooden & metal fencing that has either fallen in or is in the process of falling in the canal around Horton Bridge 193 (on the left hand side as you're going North/West). I don't understand why BW are letting it happen? Surely the owner of the land is legally obliged to prevent waterways pollution or obstruction caused by the neglect & dereliction of his/her property? It annoys me that BW don't start proceedings against these people.

 

Before that when I was going through Southall I saw a pile of old mattreses and beds around the back of the houses/garages that are just waiting to be blown in.

 

Edit: There are load of new developments being built along that section since I went through a couple of years ago, so who knows, one day Yiewsley may be upmarket & desirable... (No, probably not )

Edited May 8, 2008 by blackrose

[carlt]

yes but that would be why we pay cruising liscenses so we can cruise! i wonder when they first initiated moorings fees?

 

Chris Gray

I think you're confusing buying individual items from a grocers, with maintaining a transport network.

 

The canals weren't put there for you to "cruise" and the maintenance of towpaths used to be done at the expense of locks. I remember a time when you needed a "lock gate maintenance kit", on board, just to get through a flight but you could walk for miles on the towpath (though, admittedly, it wasn't quite so sterile on the towpaths, as now).