Mooring Wardens/14 Days

[sueb]

I agree completely with what you write but don't expect a good response from this forum.

 

The smug ones who have their mooring will never ever ever agree with you.

 

There was even someone a few days ago that wrote that the canals were full and hence no-one else should even think about bringing a boat onto the system. Not many people have rendered me speechless in this forum but she did.

 

It is down to British Waterways to manage the system for us, how we wish to use them.

 

Snipped

 

I don't believe I said that no one should even think about bringing a boat onto the system. What I hoped I said was that I was suprised that people who wanted a mooring and wanted to stay in one place should buy a boat anyway. Of course it is up to BW to manage the system, but how can they if people buy boats before they have anywhere to put them.

Sorry if you are speechless again.

Sue

[honey ryder]

if I find something, such as a message from BW stuck to my doors/boat when i get home, this really annoys me.

 

Ive never had one for overstaying yet, they have been either for telling me that its a 14day mooring a day after I arrive or telling me im moored on a no mooring yellow line.

I would prefer they save their bits of paper and come waving them at me if I overstay.

I know its a 14 day mooring... I can read the signs funnily enough, i dont need someone stating the obvious.

i think the patrols or wardens are just doing their job, I dont mind that really, as it keeps everyone in check and can help avoid too many people taking the pish with visitors moorings.

Ive met so many canal shufflers since coming into london, Im at risk of becoming one of them myself. That is not my intention at all, but when everyone around you is doing it, its hard not to think, sod it and flout some rules.

although, by the sound of my engine tonight, we may not be going anywhere for a few days.

Edited February 27, 2008 by honey ryder

[Hobbler]

Glos/sharpness last summer floods.Trapped but still hassled by BW.

Please continue with youre journey,we were told.But my journey is through glos lock.

We all had to shuffle about, so they looked as if they were doing there job.

Remember there was no boats going on or off the glos/sharpness for well over a month.

 

As this happens regularly on the G & S there is an established precedent for boats that are unable to continue their journey .

If Bw are advising you that you are unable to proceed through Gloucester Lock due to water levels being dangerously high ( they cannot actually stop you if you choose to ignore the lock keepers advice but to do so would invalidate your boat insurance) then you should claim "Safe Haven" and then Bw are obliged to provide you with a mooring until such time it is safe to proceed.

[Yoda]

if I find something, such as a message from BW stuck to my doors/boat when i get home, this really annoys me.

 

Ive never had one for overstaying yet, they have been either for telling me that its a 14day mooring a day after I arrive or telling me im moored on a no mooring yellow line.

I would prefer they save their bits of paper and come waving them at me if I overstay.

I know its a 14 day mooring... I can read the signs funnily enough, i dont need someone stating the obvious.

i think the patrols or wardens are just doing their job, I dont mind that really, as it keeps everyone in check and can help avoid too many people taking the pish with visitors moorings.

Ive met so many canal shufflers since coming into london, Im at risk of becoming one of them myself. That is not my intention at all, but when everyone around you is doing it, its hard not to think, sod it and flout some rules.

although, by the sound of my engine tonight, we may not be going anywhere for a few days.

 

Now you have an interesting point. It's abit like leaving the papers hanging out of the letterbox. If you boat is broken into because someone had fixed a letter to the boat as above while you were out or had left it for a couple of days, who is liable for the losses? If you can prove that the letter told the perb. that you were not in, then the liability is with BW and the person whom applied the letter. If you sued for damages, they would be in guarno.

[nmptwentyone]

I disagree. It is the ones that call themselves continuous cruisers but are not that are the pests, and why shouldn't they be moved on so others can benefit from a nice mooring slot. Genuine CCers are no problem to anyone.

 

As for mooring wardens being unreasonable, the only comments I have heard from people who do CC, and needed to stay a little longer at a mooring was how helpful and understanding BW employees were.

 

the majority of BW wardens are not employees of BW.

[Chris-B]

the majority of BW wardens are not employees of BW.

 

 

Whilst the majority of mooring wardens are not directly employed by BW we are acting for and on behalf of BW. I have a signed contract with BW stating my "duties" and remit.

And before accusation or wild guesses are made the reason I became a mooring warden was primarily due to being fed up the system being abused by an increasing number of "continual cruisers"

If I do my small and insignificant little bit and every body else does the same then the system works. No I do not want to see linear after linear mile of moored boats or huge great megalith marinas But there has to be an workable visitor mooring system to allow the majority not minority the chance to moor up

 

Edited to add :

In the years of being a warden I have stopped 2 boats being broken into, got an ambulance for one gentleman who had fallen and injured himself on his boat and had not got a mobile phone . Given people advice on pubs,shops,launderette,boatyards etc etc It's not all about putting bits of paper on boats

Edited February 28, 2008 by Baldock

[StoneHenge]

Well put Baldock, and I agree no-one wants that situation and too many people taking the p*ss when the rest of us pay our way.

[nmptwentyone]

As for mooring wardens being unreasonable, the only comments I have heard from people who do CC, and needed to stay a little longer at a mooring was how helpful and understanding BW employee’s were.

The majority of BW wardens are not employees of BW. But boaters who get a free mooring. No money changes hand, no contracts signed. The new wardens in my area are made up from cc-ers who moored in the area and have now been given a "mooring" (mooring = in most of the cases being allowed to stay where they were and put a sign up with mooring warden written on it. no mooring permit and to be honest no mooring. just suck out on there own, on the tow path, in the country side). I know most of them and have nothing against any of them if its what they want. Some of them will bend over backwards to help you out. Others will be waiting at your boat at 14 days and 1 minute, ticket in hand! I realise now this was probably the wrong place to post. Internet access is not something the majority of live aboard "bridgehoppers" (as you have called them) have. To the person who wrote how scandalous it was to only move up and down a 20-mile stretch and not cruise the system. Has it occurred to you people cant afford to do that. They need to work; some have kids on the boat who need to go to school. 20-30 miles is the best they can do! Im sure some would love to do more.

This subject comes up time and time again. The conclusion is quite simple and sadly it does seem to be about money and there is no point in pretending it isn't. In my view there are two classes of person involved here:Those who love the canals for their history, culture and lifestyle and are prepared to pay their way honestly and conscientiously for the facilities that they use - this class includes genuine continuous cruisers who are exploring the inland waterway network by means of a progressive and continuous journey.Those who are looking to work the system and claim to be continuous cruisers when in fact they have no intention of making the qualifying progressive and continuous journey let alone explore the system. Very often this class stay on the same 20-mile stretch of canal and the only reason why they class themselves as continuous cruisers is because they see it as a way of avoiding paying for a mooring. In my view such an attitude is indefensible.

Who on earth do you think you are?! Classes of person, your right with that one! One with money, one without. Both wanting to enjoy the canals, how dare you suggest otherwise, just because they are going about a different way to you! In a way they can afford! People have lived on boats since long before it became popular with the retired/holiday-retreat “class” of boater with £60k+ boats. (Nothing against that “class” of boater (“class” - not a word I would have chosen to use)) get out there and enjoy, good on them! But as for the other “class”, a “class” I could say im a part of I suppose. BW make no allowance for people of this “class”. There are only two out-dated options. Those that have a mooring and those that don’t! I could get a mooring if I wanted, but why? My boat would never be on it? We like moving around amongst, what was a bit of a waterbased community. We both work so can only go so far before we have to head back. I wonder what goes through all of your minds when reading my posts. 100’s of boats turning up opposite your moorings, playing music loud and staying for months! Quite possibly as you’re on the phone to BW, credit card in hand paying £2000+ for a years mooring a licence. Ill tell you what goes through my mind. People who don’t want to be cooped up, end to end in a town centre mooring, but want to choose a nice spot out of town or at an out of town canalside pub. (We don’t moor in built up areas, only ever in the countryside, so cant view it any other way). As long as they are doing no harm, causing no bother to anyone, not obstructing navigation, why can’t they stay longer than 14 days with no involvement from BW? You only move them elsewhere, the boats don’t disappear! I’m not suggesting the site becomes a permanent mooring. Boats naturally move on. If it gets too busy the mooring warden manages the area. From my experience if visitor moorings get too busy people move on, it’s the nature of the lifestyle.Maybe I was wrong to say try not to think about the £££’s. £££’s is what its all about. Remove that “class” of cc-ers from the system they don’t make us as much money. Money comes from the leisure industry, both hire boats and people that can afford a boat as a leisure interest. True, true maybe you say, canal system needs cash for maintainance after the cuts. It does, but could we have a different approach? I know im not going to win battles on here because it’s not representative of boaters on the whole canal system.

Well put Baldock, and I agree no-one wants that situation and too many people taking the p*ss when the rest of us pay our way.

give the p*ss takers another option. they dont have a mooring because they like moving. so there is only one other option on the leicence! im sure there are real p*ss takers out there, but i dont think they are as rife as you think

But there has to be an workable visitor mooring system to allow the majority not minority the chance to moor up

visitor mooringing, actual vistor moorings in prime location, yes 14 days or less, on the nose. out of town section of towpath near a bridge, few dog walkers passing by, more, managed by the warden. too busy? move longest stayer on. issue with money? charge more for the leicence for this type of boater. why do you people only see black and white? we are all in it together, you and the "p*ss taking" (not your post i know) "bridgehopper".

[cotswoldsman]

here we go again THEM against US!!!!!

[nmptwentyone]

Why is it that the "Permanant Residents" on BW Leisure moorings dont experience this harassment?

 

because they pay to moor there. if they moved away from there mooring and went somewhere else they would be in the same situation. mooring permit on you boat makes no difference if your not moored on you mooring.

[GUMPY]

To the person who wrote how scandalous it was to only move up and down a 20-mile stretch and not cruise the system. Has it occurred to you people cant afford to do that. They need to work; some have kids on the boat who need to go to school. 20-30 miles is the best they can do! Im sure some would love to do more.

 

 

They are taking the P*** I refer you to the quote in post 3 from BW

 

Unacceptable reasons for staying longer than 14 days in a neighbourhood or locality are a need to

stay within commuting distance of a place of work or of study (e.g. a school or college).

 

 

I know im not going to win battles on here because it’s not representative of boaters on the whole canal system.give the p*ss takers another option. they dont have a mooring because they like moving. so there is only one other option on the leicence! im sure there are real p*ss takers out there, but i dont think they are as rife as you think

 

You are either blinkered or just ignore them

 

There are two near me that have been in the same pound, about half a mile, for over 3 years.

 

There is another that arrived a month ago that has only moved out of the local town for the first time in TEN years because he was ticketed.

 

If you want to live in one area and dont want to follow the guidelines, get a mooring in that area or get off the cut.

 

 

 

Julian

[cotswoldsman]

Well put Baldock, and I agree no-one wants that situation and too many people taking the p*ss when the rest of us pay our way.

 

Don't understand "Pay our way"

[Chris Pink]

because they pay to moor there. if they moved away from there mooring and went somewhere else they would be in the same situation. mooring permit on you boat makes no difference if your not moored on you mooring.

 

Unfortunately (?) that does not seem to be the case, there are plenty of people down this way who have mooring permits and then go and moor where they like for as long as they like and i have never heard (and i know a few) of any being ticketed.

 

get off the cut

 

This is the sort of inflammatory remark that does no one any good. It is not down to you (luckily) who is able to have a boat and who is not.

 

 

And the real issue under debate here is some kind of view on who is 'entitled' to use the canal. Well, (luckily) the canal is a publicly-owned resource that we can all use. I suggest that those with money who don't want to see the whole gamut of boat users should pool their resources and build themselves a private canal where they can say who does and who doesn't get to use it. Because this one sure as hell ain't it.

[nmptwentyone]

They are taking the P*** I refer you to the quote in post 3 from BW

 

Unacceptable reasons for staying longer than 14 days in a neighbourhood or locality are a need to

stay within commuting distance of a place of work or of study (e.g. a school or college).

You are either blinkered or just ignore them

 

There are two near me that have been in the same pound, about half a mile, for over 3 years.

 

There is another that arrived a month ago that has only moved out of the local town for the first time in TEN years because he was ticketed.

 

If you want to live in one area and dont want to follow the guidelines, get a mooring in that area or get off the cut.

Julian

 

YES i said they are out there. im not talking about 3, 4, 5 years stayers, have you not read anything ive wrote? they are the piss takers.

 

YES the good book does say that. in black and white as well, who would have thought! god forbid we should question it?! obviously working a treat!

 

You all have just read in the book that its wrong and jump all over what i say with worse case examples. when did i write "good on the bloke who's been in the same spot years without paying!" a bit of flexablity and a new approach to boater without moorings is what i suggest. why should we have moorings if we are not going to use them.

 

...and regarding your order for me to "get off the cut". this is a discussion forum. not an outlet for you to bark orders. disagree with what i say, but dont tell me to do anything.

Edited February 28, 2008 by nmptwentyone

[StoneHenge]

im sure there are real p*ss takers out there, but i dont think they are as rife as you think

 

Unfortunately there are some though, and they do take the p*ss big time. There are at least 15 boats near us (and they are just the ones I've seen), who do exactly that. Some of them have licenses, some don't, but none of them have a mooring, and all of them NEVER move. That is just not how it should be.

 

It's a shame because some of them are actually really nice people, but they are still taking liberties, however nice they are.

 

Like I said, I am in no better position than you are mate. I am currently a 'continuous cruiser' for all intensive purposes because we had to leave our mooring. We can't move far because of work and school commitments, I am breaking the rules, I have told BW this, and asked them for a mooring, but they can't help, all the private ones are full. We actually want one. Not to live on, because like you, we never used the one we had anyway, but so we have a base, and so we can justify us not being able to travel all that far around the system because of commitments.

 

I'm not having a go at you, you enjoy boating, you love moving around, and you do actually MOVE, it's a good thing. It's the ones that never do that are spoiling it for everyone else.

[carlt]

In the years of being a warden I have stopped 2 boats being broken into, got an ambulance for one gentleman who had fallen and injured himself on his boat and had not got a mobile phone . Given people advice on pubs,shops,launderette,boatyards etc etc It's not all about putting bits of paper on boats

Err...I think that makes you a nice person, baldy, not a warden.

 

You don't need BW's nod to help people out.

 

In my years on the cut I've given people advice, rung an ambulance for an old boy who had collapsed, pulled a suicidal woman out of the cut, towed many people who have broken down, helped people by lending tools, refloating their sunken boats and fixing bits and pieces.

 

Never put a bit of paper on a boat though.

[Chris Pink]

It's the ones that never do that are spoiling it for everyone else.

 

How exactly are they spoiling it for you?

 

Don't understand "Pay our way"

 

When i have had discussion with BW employees about who exactly is complaing and causing BW to assume this perceived 'personality' the answer i always get is a. it is local parishes that don't like the boats that have appeared in recent years (occasional and usually one of two vociferous people) and b. (more importantly given the reactions on this post) people with berths in marinas or online moorings that object to someone getting what they see as 'something for nothing', when actually the reality is it is 'nothing for nothing'.

 

I pay £900 per year for my licences and for that I expect to get what the law entitles me to (and incidentally that i helped to restore to working trim).

[Chris-B]

Err...I think that makes you a nice person, baldy, not a warden.

 

You don't need BW's nod to help people out.

 

In my years on the cut I've given people advice, rung an ambulance for an old boy who had collapsed, pulled a suicidal woman out of the cut, towed many people who have broken down, helped people by lending tools, refloating their sunken boats and fixing bits and pieces.

 

Never put a bit of paper on a boat though.

 

I totally agree Carl and many many others on the cut tend to walk around with their eyes open for situations that either evolve or are already there and are prepared to assist to the best of their abilities

My comments were only referenced to the "mooring warden" tag as If I had not been a warden it would have been unlikely that I would be walking that particular section when the incidences occured..Or people knew which boat to knock on and ask a question.

 

With reference to the OP, I see a mooring warden’s remit as a point of contact FIRST and foremost if a boat has overstayed and has not/will not moved on after the allocated time despite a POLITE request then the ticket system is the next stage. I would prefer to have a chat/cup of tea/make a new friend than issue a ticket any day

Edited February 28, 2008 by Baldock

[StoneHenge]

How exactly are they spoiling it for you?

 

Because they are the ones more likely to let their BSS slip, not renew a license and therefore be a potential danger to themselves and others. Not those who have moorings or continually cruise who probably maintain their boats at the correct level of safety.

 

Some of the boats I have seen would not pass a BSS and I for one would not want to be near one when they have a has explosion.

[carlt]

Some of the boats I have seen would not pass a BSS and I for one would not want to be near one when they have a has explosion.

You are making an assumption that the BSS is based on the scruffiness of the boat.

[doomed1]

Because they are the ones more likely to let their BSS slip, not renew a license and therefore be a potential danger to themselves and others. Not those who have moorings or continually cruise who probably maintain their boats at the correct level of safety.

 

Some of the boats I have seen would not pass a BSS and I for one would not want to be near one when they have a has explosion.

 

 

And they are the ones more likely to forget there mothers birthday.

[Chris-B]

You are making an assumption that the BSS is based on the scruffiness of the boat.

 

 

Thats Baldock failed then

[StoneHenge]

You are making an assumption that the BSS is based on the scruffiness of the boat.

 

Not at all, it's based on the fact that a lot of those boats do not have valid licenses, and do not have moorings. Not on the outside although you can tell a neglected boat from one that has simply not had a paint job in a while.

 

If they are not willing to pay out for a license, then what makes anyone think they are bothered about insurance, or a BSS certificate?

[BlueStringPudding]

Not at all, it's based on the fact that a lot of those boats do not have valid licenses, and do not have moorings. Not on the outside although you can tell a neglected boat from one that has simply not had a paint job in a while.

 

If they are not willing to pay out for a license, then what makes anyone think they are bothered about insurance, or a BSS certificate?

 

We've got a valid license, insurance and BSS certificate, and the worst faded, peeling, rusty paintjob in Warwickshire!

[StoneHenge]

We've got a valid license, insurance and BSS certificate, and the worst faded, peeling, rusty paintjob in Warwickshire!

 

Exactly my point, never judge a book by its cover.