Facilities and fittings legal requirements for a narrowboat

[David Mack]

3 hours ago, Atom Dan said:

 

Combine those two things, and I end up needing to get the boat documented and into a fit state to cruise to the mooring, and then I can continue fitting it out as and when cash becomes available. 

What do you actually need to do to get the boat cruiseable? Is the engine in and fitted and working? Headlight can be a torch, horn can be a handheld airhorn. Fire extinguishers and smoke alarms can be bought quickly and fitted. Do you need anything else?

With little in the way of fitted equipment the BSC should be straightforward, and licence can be obtained straight afterwards. And then you are away.

 

Edited September 8, 2021 by David Mack

[Atom Dan]

1 minute ago, David Mack said:

What do you actually need to do to get the boat cruiseable? Is the engine in and fitted and working? Headlight can be a torch, horn can be a handheld airhorn. Fire extinguishers and smoke alarms can be bought quickly and fitted. Do you need anything else?

With little in the way of fitted equipment the BSC should be straightforward, and licence can be obtained straight afterwards. And then you are away.

 

 

Yeah, I'm definitely starting to think that way now. The outboard is in my shed at home, but was serviced last year, left clean and empty of fuel since, so should be immediately usable, I think. 

 

A couple of external jobs to do - seals and a bit of paint - and very basic interior jobs to make it roughly habitable for a few days while I move it.

 

I have smoke + CO2 alarms (twin pack I picked up somewhere), and extinguishers which previous owner gave me, still in the box. I've also got a BW key and some other bits and pieces. May need some new ropes and a bargepole. 

 

So I'm not far off really. That's why I posted this question, to check if there was any requirement for a toilet to be fitted, or heating etc. I feel like I read that once, but I can't find any reference now, and no one on this thread seems to think it's an issue. Very encouraging. 

[Machpoint005]

4 hours ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

The problem with nav lights on Narrowboats is that it is pretty well impossible to fit them in a way that complies with the regulations. Just plonking them on the cabin as builders normally doesnt.

 

Technically according to the bye laws we were suposed to have them on the North Eastern waterways like The A&C and NJC but we never had them, not many did.

 

Our boat came with them on the front corners of the cabin. There are now no bulbs in them, but they look OK.

[MtB]

1 hour ago, Atom Dan said:

So I'm not far off really. That's why I posted this question, to check if there was any requirement for a toilet to be fitted, or heating etc. I feel like I read that once, but I can't find any reference now, and no one on this thread seems to think it's an issue. Very encouraging. 

 

Not sure anyone has actually answered this question. No, you don't need to install a toilet. Or a water heater, or even the outboard. Just get a BSS bod in to do an inspection as it stands, I suggest, and s/he will give you a list of stuff needed to make it pass, unless it passes anyway. Much of BSS revolves around engine fuel handling and gas safety, and if your boat has neither on the day, a ticket should be a breeze to issue.

 

There is no obligation to have anything on the boat like water heating, mooring lines, Cooking facilities, mooring stakes, navigation lights or anything like that. 

\

[Atom Dan]

Thanks. 👍

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Not sure anyone has actually answered this question. 

 

 

 I think you will find the actual question was answered by @Loddon in post 2.

[Atom Dan]

16 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

 I think you will find the actual question was answered by @Loddon in post 2.

 

That answer was about the BSS and its application to existing appliances. My question was asking if any installations/facilities/appliances are legally required, regardless of the BSS.

 

Anyway, meanwhile, I've finally found the reference I'd read previously. It's buried in the CRT mooring terms and conditions:

 

"6.9 The Boat must have a minimum level of on board facilities to allow the ability to be self-sufficient (including the provision of potable water storage with toilets connected and wash cubicles). We reserve the right to request confirmation from you upon renewing your use of the Mooring that your Boat has the required basic facilities prior to occupancy at the Mooring Site."

 

https://www.watersidemooring.com/media/terms/2021L1STANDARDTCS.pdf

 

OK, that is not a requirement for cruising the canals, but it is a CRT requirement for leasing one of their moorings. 🤕

 

I'll have to fork out to lease the mooring before the boat is ready. Not sure I can afford that at the moment. Working on it though. 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Atom Dan said:

 

That answer was about the BSS and its application to existing appliances. My question was asking if any installations/facilities/appliances are legally required, regardless of the BSS.

 

Anyway, meanwhile, I've finally found the reference I'd read previously. It's buried in the CRT mooring terms and conditions:

 

"6.9 The Boat must have a minimum level of on board facilities to allow the ability to be self-sufficient (including the provision of potable water storage with toilets connected and wash cubicles). We reserve the right to request confirmation from you upon renewing your use of the Mooring that your Boat has the required basic facilities prior to occupancy at the Mooring Site."

 

https://www.watersidemooring.com/media/terms/2021L1STANDARDTCS.pdf

 

OK, that is not a requirement for cruising the canals, but it is a CRT requirement for leasing one of their moorings. 🤕

 

I'll have to fork out to lease the mooring before the boat is ready. Not sure I can afford that at the moment. Working on it though. 

 

If you say so.

 

The answer is there though.

 

Good luck with getting it all sorted.

[David Mack]

13 minutes ago, Atom Dan said:

 

"6.9 The Boat must have a minimum level of on board facilities to allow the ability to be self-sufficient (including the provision of potable water storage with toilets connected and wash cubicles). We reserve the right to request confirmation from you upon renewing your use of the Mooring that your Boat has the required basic facilities prior to occupancy at the Mooring Site."

Potable water storage - that's a plastic bottle you fill up at home and take to the boat.

Toilet - get a basic porta potty. It can sit in the corner of the cabin, doesn't need a bathroom around it.

Wash cubicles (cubicles??). The whole cabin can be a 'cubicle' and a washing up bowl will suffice as a wash basin.

 

The stated requirements are for a completed cruising boat. As long as you can show you are making some progress with fitting out, nobody is going to take issue with the basic level of facilities you have in the interim.

[Atom Dan]

1 minute ago, David Mack said:

The stated requirements are for a completed cruising boat. As long as you can show you are making some progress with fitting out, nobody is going to take issue with the basic level of facilities you have in the interim.

 

Hopefully, yeah. As you say, I'm sure all this can be worked around one way or another. 👍

[MtB]

23 minutes ago, Atom Dan said:

Anyway, meanwhile, I've finally found the reference I'd read previously. It's buried in the CRT mooring terms and conditions:

 

"6.9 The Boat must have a minimum level of on board facilities to allow the ability to be self-sufficient (including the provision of potable water storage with toilets connected and wash cubicles). We reserve the right to request confirmation from you upon renewing your use of the Mooring that your Boat has the required basic facilities prior to occupancy at the Mooring Site."

 

I think you can pretty well ignore that. CRT have neither the staff nor the interest to go around checking up.

 

The point of terms like this is so they can point to them and throw you off the mooring if you make a pain in arse of yourself, e.g. by defecating in the cut, living like a tramp and generally upsetting the neighbouring boaters.  As long as you keep your head down and just conduct your mooring tenancy in a civilised manner, no-one will care. 

[Graham Davis]

7 hours ago, Atom Dan said:

 

That answer was about the BSS and its application to existing appliances. My question was asking if any installations/facilities/appliances are legally required, regardless of the BSS.

 

Anyway, meanwhile, I've finally found the reference I'd read previously. It's buried in the CRT mooring terms and conditions:

 

"6.9 The Boat must have a minimum level of on board facilities to allow the ability to be self-sufficient (including the provision of potable water storage with toilets connected and wash cubicles). We reserve the right to request confirmation from you upon renewing your use of the Mooring that your Boat has the required basic facilities prior to occupancy at the Mooring Site."

 

https://www.watersidemooring.com/media/terms/2021L1STANDARDTCS.pdf

 

OK, that is not a requirement for cruising the canals, but it is a CRT requirement for leasing one of their moorings. 🤕

 

I'll have to fork out to lease the mooring before the boat is ready. Not sure I can afford that at the moment. Working on it though. 

 

That only applies if the mooring you are taking is a CaRT mooring. If the one you are intending to go to isn't one of their's it doesn't matter, but you need to check what their T & C's are

Edited September 9, 2021 by Graham Davis
Spelling

[Atom Dan]

Just now, Graham Davis said:

 

That only applies if the mooring you are taking is a CaRT mooring. If the one you are intending to go to isn't one of their's it doesn't matter.

 

True. Sadly, it is a CaRT mooring. ☹

[GUMPY]

7 hours ago, Atom Dan said:

 

"6.9 The Boat must have a minimum level of on board facilities to allow the ability to be self-sufficient (including the provision of potable water storage with toilets connected and wash cubicles). We reserve the right to request confirmation from you upon renewing your use of the Mooring that your Boat has the required basic facilities prior to occupancy at the Mooring Site."

Rubbish!

What if you have an open day boat with an outboard and no facilities at all, you can still use/moor it on the canal.

That is aimed at residential boats which yours is not.

All you need is a hull and if moving under its own power  a working engine.

When we had our Norman 20 there was nothing inside it but it was still usable on the canals. As a bonus the BSS man cut his fee in half as there was so little to inspect..

 

 

[GUMPY]

I would be more concerned about this one

 

8.1 You will not undertake any work to the Boat whilst moored at the Mooring Site without our prior 
written consent and you will comply with any applicable Site Rules. Whether or not we give consent 
shall be at our absolute discretion and any consent we do give may be subject to conditions taking 
into account any matters we consider appropriate, including but not limited to health and safety 
considerations and having regard to the potential impact of the work on other third parties. 

[Atom Dan]

14 minutes ago, Loddon said:

I would be more concerned about this one

 

In the spirit of previous responses... I imagine that's aimed at people who make a real nuisance of themselves doing noisy work on their boats. Doubt it would apply to someone putting a couple of shelves up, or touching up some paintwork.