inverter help

[paulstoke1975]

Paul the charger is absolutely no use to you if you have no shore or generator supply to power it. Please turn it off whilst off grid with just the engine alternator to charge batteries.

 

If the readings you supplied are indeed from the charger it suggests you have left it on (powered by the inverter), despite the advice you have been given. A charge voltage of just 12.4 volts is extreemly low and indicative of flat batteries. If its indicating 60 amps its probably working flat out and taking a lot of power from the battery supplied inverter which subsequently shuts down due to low battery volts. Hopefully you can appreciate this is not a sustainable loop and can only end in a rapid downward spiral. You can download a manual for your charger here BTW if you don't have one already.

 

As suggested you need to establish if the engine alternator is charging the batteries which should comfortably have been completed after five hours of cruising. Another possibility is that your batteries are knackered (not helped by charger running off inverter) and need replacing. Its even possible that your charger demands more power than the inverter can supply which could give rise to your issue even with fully charged batteries. Tests need to be made to establish which. The max power output of the inverter would be useful to know as well.

 

An overnight stop at a marina with shore power available will allow you to run charger as intended, which may possibly revive them.

 

The inverter is 3k I've just figured how to turn the charger off

[by'eck]

The inverter is 3k I've just figured how to turn the charger off

 

A nice big one. It would have been enough to power charger but this is hypothetical since it should never be powered in this way.

 

Hopefully you are now in a position to use inverter to power your TV once batteries are fully charged - good luck and let us know how things progress.

[paulstoke1975]

Why does the 240v sockets only work with the charger on ?

[Phil Ambrose]

Why does the 240v sockets only work with the charger on ?

Wired up wrong

Phil

[by'eck]

Why does the 240v sockets only work with the charger on ?

 

No idea. Its not a Combi (combined inverter and charger) you have but a stand alone charger with only a single AC input and no AC output, presumably the inverter is stand alone as well. Obviously the inverter needs to be on to power the AC sockets but not the charger.

 

Is there an AC control panel similar to consumer unit in a household? If so have you turned any breakers off inadevertantly? Also what is make/model of inverter?

[Heffalump]

Wired up wrong

Phil

 

Sounds like it.

[by'eck]

Wired up wrong

Phil

 

 

 

Sounds like it.

 

Well its certainly a poorly thought out installation but intrigued how if the charger is switched off on its own control panel it could stop the inverter working. This assumes Paul didn't inadevertantly turn this off as well. Could also be the first or second law of thermodynamics is wrong

[paulstoke1975]

Sterling pure sine 3k the breakers are on

[by'eck]

Sterling pure sine 3k the breakers are on

 

Since we seem to have reached a stalemate in solution to your problem, can you advise specifically which model of Sterling inverter you have. Maybe also a photo to show the fault indications you mentioned earlier. Typically Sterling products have well marked LED indicators so their meaning should be self explanatory.

 

May well be wrong but don't recall Sterling offering a 3000 watt PSW stand alone inverter. The do offer a 3200/3500 watt Combi though with 100 amp charger (I have one).

 

Grabbing at straws now but wonder if the need for the Pro Ultra charger being on to produce 240 volts was a red herring, and issue is simply that batteries are near flat and won't support inverter being on.

[Phil Ambrose]

 

Since we seem to have reached a stalemate in solution to your problem, can you advise specifically which model of Sterling inverter you have. Maybe also a photo to show the fault indications you mentioned earlier. Typically Sterling products have well marked LED indicators so their meaning should be self explanatory.

 

May well be wrong but don't recall Sterling offering a 3000 watt PSW stand alone inverter. The do offer a 3200/3500 watt Combi though with 100 amp charger (I have one).

 

Grabbing at straws now but wonder if the need for the Pro Ultra charger being on to produce 240 volts was a red herring, and issue is simply that batteries are near flat and won't support inverter being on.

The quoted battery voltage by the OP was 12.4 so the inverter may well have been cutting out at start up due to low voltage.

Phil

[by'eck]

The quoted battery voltage by the OP was 12.4 so the inverter may well have been cutting out at start up due to low voltage.

Phil

 

Very likely, but if I understood the OP correctly the voltage was displayed on his Sterling Pro Ultra charger which was also displaying 60 amps! (before he switched it off) so not an open circuit voltage - probably about right though given the charger/inverter loop with the charger drawing around 1kW.

[Phil Ambrose]

Which brings as back to "Wired up wrong" or something very similar.

Phil

[Guest]

I think I might regret this, but will stab a guess from what has been said. I have a 3kw psw Sterling stand alone inverter from 2004 (and bloody good it is.)

If it is like mine (yellow with a blue label) then it has a UPS system, wherbey if you switch it off, and a land line is connected, it will simply "power through" the inverter. I used to have my charger on a dis board fed from the inverter, and if I forgot after disconnecting the genny/landline, the charger would then get into a "loop" fed by the inverter. I got around this by disconnecting the charger from the dis board, and paralleling a 13 Amp RCD socket from the incoming side of the inverter, where the shorepower lead connects to. The charger simply plugs into this.

Edited August 31, 2015 by Guest

[by'eck]

I think I might regret this, but will stab a guess from what has been said. I have a 3kw psw Sterling stand alone inverter from 2004 (and bloody good it is.)

If it is like mine (yellow with a blue label) then it has a UPS system, wherbey if you switch it off, and a land line is connected, it will simply "power through" the inverter. I used to have my charger on a dis board fed from the inverter, and if I forgot after disconnecting the genny/landline, the charger would then get into a "loop" fed by the inverter. I got around this by disconnecting the charger from the dis board, and paralleling a 13 Amp RCD socket from the incoming side of the inverter, where the shorepower lead connects to. The charger simply plugs into this.

 

That may explain the type of inverter the OP has. Do the indications he described in posts 15 & 16 concur with your inverter since there are no online manuals now available to check?

 

The fact that the stand alone charger was being powered by the inverter seems well established and the reason for this may well be as your own experience.

 

Unfortunately Sterling's own installation instructions do not help in this matter. In the literature for my Combi they correctly advise there should be no possibility of incoming shore AC coming into contact with inverter derived AC. The mistake they then make though in an attempt to avoid this, is to suggest all incoming AC passes through the Combi before it can feed any other device. I suspect the instructions that came with your pass through UPS inverter carried similar advice.

 

Still doesn't explain the OP's claim there is no inverter derived AC when the stand-alone charger is switched off though.

[Guest]

Hadn't noticed 15 and 16 diificult reading all thread with phone and poor signal!

sounds a little different to mine which has two banks of green lights, IIRC 10 in each.

One indicates load in watts, the other battery voltage.

When mine is getting low in battery the previously green lights turn amber then evenytually red.

I will try and add some photos.

I agree the no mains no charger issue is odd. I wonder if OP is swtiching inverter on and off for charger?

Edited August 31, 2015 by Guest

[by'eck]

I thought I'd sorted it out but soon as I turned the engine off after 5 hr Cruise I turned my 240v TV on the green light on the right hand side on top of the inverter turned from green to amber and the Inverter started beeping?

 

 

On the the left hand bank on lights

There are 6 blocks of green light the right hand one had gone to red

 

 

Hadn't noticed 15 and 16 diificult reading all thread with phone and poor signal!

sounds a little different to mine which has two banks of green lights, IIRC 10 in each.

One indicates load in watts, the other battery voltage.

When mine is getting low in battery the previously green lights turn amber then evenytually red.

I will try and add some photos.

I agree the no mains no charger issue is odd. I wonder if OP is swtiching inverter on and off for charger?

 

Indications sound very similar to yours nevertheless, so reasonable to assume its a pass through inverter Paul has. Probably explains why the installer wired all AC loads including charger after it as well.

[paulstoke1975]

Just a slight update I keep Losing intrnet plus only just got phone charged , I've had the inverter and charger off all day , I turned on the inverter after travelling from a few miles before red bull through to festival park around 5 hrs again and I managed half hr charging laptop with everything other than 12v fridge off then the inverter started beeping again and the light dropped back to red , it is identical to the pictures put up, I've got the marinas boat mechanic auto electrision taking a look in the morning

 

I only turn inverter on when I need to power the 240v sockets us this wrong ?

 

 

 

Indications sound very similar to yours nevertheless, so reasonable to assume its a pass through inverter Paul has. Probably explains why the installer wired all AC loads including charger after it as well.

Please excuse my sometimes broken texs I'm struggling with my phone and the network

[Guest]

Just a slight update I keep Losing intrnet plus only just got phone charged , I've had the inverter and charger off all day , I turned on the inverter after travelling from a few miles before red bull through to festival park around 5 hrs again and I managed half hr charging laptop with everything other than 12v fridge off then the inverter started beeping again and the light dropped back to red , it is identical to the pictures put up, I've got the marinas boat mechanic auto electrision taking a look in the morning

If the charger is/was definitely switched off when you powered up the inverter, and you only had a laptop on chrarge, it sounds like your batteries are suspect. Mine are tired, and won't keep the inverter going very long, unless the engine is running.

[paulstoke1975]

If the charger is/was definitely switched off when you powered up the inverter, and you only had a laptop on chrarge, it sounds like your batteries are suspect. Mine are tired, and won't keep the inverter going very long, unless the engine is running.

Yes it was off , I pressed the setup button plus the down arrow until the readings turned to 00 and just the laptop was on , I hope it is the batteries as that would be a relatively cheap fix

[by'eck]

Yes it was off , I pressed the setup button plus the down arrow until the readings turned to 00 and just the laptop was on , I hope it is the batteries as that would be a relatively cheap fix

 

Yes agree the batteries may have lost most of their capacity. Would suggest the following:

 

Get boat to marina for a couple of nights and fully recharge the batteries from shore power, discharge a little then re-charge fully again. This may restore some of their capacity, but be prepared to fork out for new set. If and only if you have open lead acid batteries, your charger has provision to provide an equailise charge at 15.5 volts. This is a brute force deliberate overcharge in an attempt to areduce the sulphation that has likely reduced their capacity - follow instructions in manual and do not leave unattended during this phase.

 

Arrange for 13 amp socket to be installed taking its feed directly from shore power inlet after any main breaker that may be installed, but most importantly before the AC feed to the pass through inverter. Find the AC input lead to the charger and disconnect from present location, fit a 13 amp plug to lead if there isn't one on it already and power from the new socket. Get a professional to do this work if you are not qualified. Once installed thus you will only be able to power the charger when AC is available at shore power inlet, as it should be.

[ditchcrawler]

Do you have any idea of the battery voltage, a friend of mine just got caught out by the cheapo isolator switch going high. Made his fridge bleep, could be the same on the feed to the inverter.

[paulstoke1975]

I'm at festival marina now and have had the mechanic look at it and he hooked me up to a shoreline and im going have it checked again in a few days ,

Edited September 2, 2015 by paulstoke1975

[Heffalump]

Good plan Paul, glad you made it in once piece, let us know how you get on

[paulstoke1975]

it looks like my batteries are shot , its all running fine off the shoreline im going to replace the batteries in a few weeks and have the alternator bushes checked too,

[jenevers]

Sorry to intrude but I've always been puzzled as to why my Mastervolt Mass12/80 charger always fires up as soon as my genny starts even though 240volts doesn't get switched on from the genny via the Mastervolt Masterswitch for the first 5 seconds from genny startup. Any ideas? Sounds like inverter and charger are somehow connected.