Who should install stoves

[Jean]

Hi everyone

 

Our boat is now 8 yrs old and we are continuous cruisers 365 days a year. As the winters are now getting a bit colder, we are exploring the possibility of having a stove installed. We currently have diesel central heating, but on really cold days we find we need to put an electric fan heater on in the mornings until the boat warms up.

 

We have a lot of knowledge of boating, but believe a stove should be installed professionally, because of the safety aspect. Can you tell me who (which profession) we should approach to have this done.

 

Any help and advice would be most appreciated.

Many thanks.

Jean

Edited November 1, 2011 by Jean

[Guest]

Hi everyone

 

Our boat is now 8 yrs old and we are continuous cruisers 365 days a year. As the winters are now getting a bit colder, we are exploring the possibility of having a stove installed. We currently have diesel central heating, but on really cold days we find we need to put an electric fan heater on in the mornings until the boat warms up.

 

We have a lot of knowledge of boating, but believe a stove should be installed professionally, because of the safety aspect. Can you tell me who (which profession) we should approach to have this done.

 

Any help and advice would be most appreciated.

Many thanks.

Jean

 

No particular profession is needed to install a stove on a boat

 

What you are looking for is a competent person not a particular profession.

 

ed to add - unless it's gas powered - a rare thing on a boat AFAIK...

Edited November 1, 2011 by MJG

[Jean]

No particular profession is needed to install a stove on a boat

 

What you are looking for is a competent person not a particular profession.

 

ed to add - unless it's gas powered - a rare thing on a boat AFAIK...

 

Thanks MJG.

 

How do you determine competence. You hear such horror stories. I saw a burnt out boat last year due to a poor installation of a stove.

 

J

[Ray T]

This site may help:

 

http://www.soliftec.com/

 

in the search box type "stoves in boats" and you should come up with this:

 

www.soliftec.com/Boat%20Stoves%201-page.pdf

 

[DustyDave]

In a house you'd be looking at getting a HETAS registered installer. I met somebody the other week who'd just got his registration. Unfortunately his ballpark figure made him far too expensive (and I really don't want a stove on the boat). I also met somebody who'd fitted a refleks diesel heater and thought it was fantastic compared to his stove.

 

Dave

[Guest]

Thanks MJG.

 

How do you determine competence. You hear such horror stories. I saw a burnt out boat last year due to a poor installation of a stove.

 

J

 

I would suggest speaking to a good boat fitter...where are you and how far are you willing/prepared to travel to to have your stove fitted?

[Becky Boat Girl]

I would suggest speaking to a good boat fitter...where are you and how far are you willing/prepared to travel to to have your stove fitted?

 

We're in the process of replacing a stove ourselves, and aside from the weight of the thing, it hasn't been too difficult a job. We've gone for a back-boiler option, and this is where the real complications arise, but my other half is pretty good with plumbing, so we should have a warm, cosy boat by the end of the week!

 

The most important thing is to ensure everything is fire-resistant. I believe the best way to approach it is to back the area around the stove and flue with fireboard (available from good builders merchants), and then tile over, and obviously make sure the stove and flue are well away from combustable materials, such as curtains, etc. Its frightening to see how many boats have curtains flapping close to the flue! Make sure flue collars and joints are correctly sealed and invest in a carbon manoxide alarm as a precaution.

 

Good luck!

[OldGoldy]

snip

 

The most important thing is to ensure everything is fire-resistant. I believe the best way to approach it is to back the area around the stove and flue with fireboard (available from good builders merchants), and then tile over, and

 

snip

 

.....or heat resistant! It is still possible for plywood to heat up, char and combust, even behind fire-resistant tiles (or ordinary ceramic tiles, if you like) by heat transfer. I know someone who had what looked like a perfect installation, but smelled wood burning and subsequently found the panel behind his tiles was smoking.

 

IMHO the best advice is in Ray T's pdf link.

 

 

 

ET change 'and heat resistant' to 'or heat resistant' - fire-resistant not same thing!

Edited November 2, 2011 by dave69700

[Rob@BSSOffice]

The most important thing is to ensure everything is fire-resistant. I believe the best way to approach it is to back the area around the stove and flue with fireboard (available from good builders merchants), and then tile over, and obviously make sure the stove and flue are well away from combustable materials, such as curtains, etc. Its frightening to see how many boats have curtains flapping close to the flue! Make sure flue collars and joints are correctly sealed and invest in a carbon manoxide alarm as a precaution.

 

And if it's any help http://staysafe.boatsafetyscheme.com/solid-fuel-stoves-on-boats

Regards

Rob

 

 

 

edited for fat finger syndrome

Edited November 4, 2011 by Rob@BSSOffice

[Neil2]

Am I right in thinking there is an exemption to the new regulations for "small" solid fuel heaters?

 

I was thinking of installing a small one in addition to our Kuranda & i'm sure I read somewhere that there was an allowance made so that small "boatmans cabin" type stoves didn't have to comply fully.

[rjasmith]

Am I right in thinking there is an exemption to the new regulations for "small" solid fuel heaters?

 

I was thinking of installing a small one in addition to our Kuranda & i'm sure I read somewhere that there was an allowance made so that small "boatmans cabin" type stoves didn't have to comply fully.

 

Yes there is.

 

In BS 8511, Para 1 "Scope" contains the following words:-

 

"This code of practice does not apply to the installation of appliances with a firebox volume of less than 0.01m³ and a grate size smaller than 0.05m², and where the dimensional recommendations of the installation cannot be met (eg in traditional narrowboat boatman's back cabins)."

 

It goes on to give a note saying "The basic principles in this code of practice can be used in installation of appliances outwith its scope."

 

So, you need to get a ruler, measure the firebox space of your small stove and calculate its vol and grate area and see if they are both smaller than the two figures.

 

Then, if the space you want to install it in complies with the last bit about it being not possible to meet the "dimensional recommendations" in there, you're OK!

 

But of course as the note implies, you should still try to comply with as much of the CoP as you can.

 

Finally, don't forget that BS 8511 is not a regulation (yet!) it's just a recommendation of good practice (and one which insurance companies may be very interested in!).

 

Richard

[Becky Boat Girl]

.....or heat resistant! It is still possible for plywood to heat up, char and combust, even behind fire-resistant tiles (or ordinary ceramic tiles, if you like) by heat transfer. I know someone who had what looked like a perfect installation, but smelled wood burning and subsequently found the panel behind his tiles was smoking.

 

IMHO the best advice is in Ray T's pdf link.

 

 

 

ET change 'and heat resistant' to 'or heat resistant' - fire-resistant not same thing!

 

Absolutely! Thanks for the correction Dave; that's what happens when I post late at night!!

[Neil2]

Yes there is.

 

In BS 8511, Para 1 "Scope" contains the following words:-

 

"This code of practice does not apply to the installation of appliances with a firebox volume of less than 0.01m³ and a grate size smaller than 0.05m², and where the dimensional recommendations of the installation cannot be met (eg in traditional narrowboat boatman's back cabins)."

 

It goes on to give a note saying "The basic principles in this code of practice can be used in installation of appliances outwith its scope."

 

So, you need to get a ruler, measure the firebox space of your small stove and calculate its vol and grate area and see if they are both smaller than the two figures.

 

Then, if the space you want to install it in complies with the last bit about it being not possible to meet the "dimensional recommendations" in there, you're OK!

 

But of course as the note implies, you should still try to comply with as much of the CoP as you can.

 

Finally, don't forget that BS 8511 is not a regulation (yet!) it's just a recommendation of good practice (and one which insurance companies may be very interested in!).

 

Richard

 

Thanks for the info Richard, though that sounds like a very small firebox it's bigger than what I had in mind which is a sort of gypsy caravan type thing, The rest of it is a bit of a fudge though, it sounds as though they were trying to be sympathetic to the traditional boatmans cabin but in doing so have created the potential for an argument with the BSC examiner.

[Chris Pink]

Hi everyone

 

Our boat is now 8 yrs old and we are continuous cruisers 365 days a year. As the winters are now getting a bit colder, we are exploring the possibility of having a stove installed. We currently have diesel central heating, but on really cold days we find we need to put an electric fan heater on in the mornings until the boat warms up.

 

We have a lot of knowledge of boating, but believe a stove should be installed professionally, because of the safety aspect. Can you tell me who (which profession) we should approach to have this done.

 

Any help and advice would be most appreciated.

Many thanks.

Jean

 

The "where are you?" was the most relevant post on this thread

[rjasmith]

Thanks for the info Richard, though that sounds like a very small firebox it's bigger than what I had in mind which is a sort of gypsy caravan type thing, The rest of it is a bit of a fudge though, it sounds as though they were trying to be sympathetic to the traditional boatmans cabin but in doing so have created the potential for an argument with the BSC examiner.

 

Yes I agree but don't forget that BS 8511 is a British Standard Code of Practice and does not (yet) form any part of the Boat Safety Scheme Guide. The CoP was not issued by BSS nor called for by them (it was MAIB that did that, following the "Lindy Lou" fire).

 

BSS have issued some guidance on their website which Rob McLean provided a link to above (and within his link there's another which takes you to their further advice re new installations).

 

I think your small stove would be fine if you tried to follow the main principles given in BS 8511 (Or at least those given on the Soliftec website page - again see Rob's link).

 

The difficult bit may be knowing technical stuff about your little stove if the manual for it is inadequate or it hasn't met the EN 13240 standard and got a CE plate on it.

 

Richard