An idiots guide to touching up your paintwork

[deletedaccount]

When I get the boat back and I've moved aboard one of the first things I'm going to do is touch up the paint work. My boat is currently "deep brunswick green" but there are plenty of scrapes, one long scratch to the steel and a couple of big (5cm diameter) patches of steel/rust.

 

From what I've learned here, I need to:

 

1) sand each area down to the steel.

2) prime it

2a) undercoat it?

3) paint it

 

Each step could do with some clarification though.

 

For (1) what is the best approach? What type of sandpaper? or is a wire brush better? What type of brush. Others have mentioned angle grinders, of which I have zero experience. Which ones are good for the job and can I get em from homebase - what attachments will I need?

 

For (2) and (2a) are both step advisable? I'm quite happy to do both if needs be. What should I use (that I can aquire fairly easily) and what should I paint it on with (yeah, yeah, a brush). Do I need to sand it down between layers, if so, what with?

 

Sorry to be so dense, but any link to an idiots guide would be most welcome

[deletedaccount]

Just found this thread, which is very useful.

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=20889

[WotEver]

For rust removal PaddingtonBear suggested this product in a thread a while back: http://www.paint-stripper.co.uk/perago.htm

 

I bought one of their singles and it's as stunning as PB said it was. It leaves the steel a grey colour and looking as if it's been shot-blasted. It's clean to use, and leaves a great surface for keying new paint.

 

Clicky for online purchase.

 

I have nothing whatosever to do with the company.

 

Regards,

Tony

 

edited to turn it into English

Edited July 27, 2009 by WotEver

[PaddingtonBear]

I have got the one for wood as well and it is just as efficient - I often wonder why they are not more widely known, I guess that they appear dear against grinding discs etc. but my metal single has done sterling service for nearly 4 years which has got to be good value although I might well need a new one when I start 'Chertsey'

[deletedaccount]

cheers wotever, I think I'm going to invest in one.

 

Now all I've got to do is work out what I attach it to

Edited July 27, 2009 by deletedaccount

[Albion]

Others have mentioned angle grinders, of which I have zero experience. Which ones are good for the job and can I get em from homebase - what attachments will I need?

 

One quick bit of advice about angle grinders is that if you have never used one before you should be very careful and practice on some steel that doesn't matter. Even in experienced hands they can dig in and cause a gouge that is worse than what you were trying to fix. They are a brilliant tool but require care and experience if you are to avoid creating more problems than you are curing. You can get sanding backing pads and sanding discs to fit them though which are less risky in amateur hands but, even with these, err on the cautious side and use finer rather than coarse abrasive discs until you get the hang of it.

Roger

[nb.Stealaway]

That Perago looks very interesting having spent hours on friday & saturday with a bladed scraper trying to get bitumen off. Why couldn't we have had this post a week or two ago?

Thanks Tony,

 

regards,

Charles

[RobinJ]

For (1) what is the best approach? What type of sandpaper? or is a wire brush better? What type of brush. Others have mentioned angle grinders, of which I have zero experience. Which ones are good for the job and can I get em from homebase - what attachments will I need?

Wouldn't reccomend an angle grinder if you've not used one before, however I think with an axial wire brush they are better than a drill for getting into corners and especially under handrails! You can also get these plastic type sanding pads which remove the lumpy paint very easily and don't wear out your sandpaper!

As for when to do what, I never sand down the primer, may wipe it over, just lightly rub the undercoat and last top coat.

[WotEver]

Wouldn't reccomend an angle grinder if you've not used one before, however I think with an axial wire brush they are better than a drill for getting into corners and especially under handrails!

 

If using an angle grinder with a wire brush of any description don't wear a floppy woollen jumper at the same time.

 

Don't ask me how I know this

[deletedaccount]

cheers guys, some useful advice there.

 

Are electric sanders any use?

[WotEver]

Are electric sanders any use?

 

Random orbital are good for flatting large flat areas, but most of the sanding mediums you can get for them tend to clog really quickly on paint. Abranet is supposed to be good (if expensive) but I've never tried it.

 

T

[deletedaccount]

Random orbital are good for flatting large flat areas, but most of the sanding mediums you can get for them tend to clog really quickly on paint. Abranet is supposed to be good (if expensive) but I've never tried it.

 

T

 

Ok, I'm going to make a start at this this weekend with some good old wet and dry.

 

Does the type of primer and undercoat make mcuh difference? I was just going to pop down to the chandlers and buy whatever they had in stock along with a big and a small brush.

[WotEver]

Ok, I'm going to make a start at this this weekend with some good old wet and dry.

 

Does the type of primer and undercoat make mcuh difference? I was just going to pop down to the chandlers and buy whatever they had in stock along with a big and a small brush.

 

I've had good experiences on car prep using an orbital sander with wet and dry used wet - you just have to ensure the moisture doesn't splash into the electrics of the sander. I used a rag to wet the surface, started 'sanding' and kept wetting the surface with the rag while I worked.

 

I'll let some of the experts answer the question about paint, but I know Phil's Craftmaster is held in high regard, and Owatrol primer is supposed to be 'the dog's'

 

Tony

[deletedaccount]

I've had good experiences on car prep using an orbital sander with wet and dry used wet - you just have to ensure the moisture doesn't splash into the electrics of the sander. I used a rag to wet the surface, started 'sanding' and kept wetting the surface with the rag while I worked.

 

I'll let some of the experts answer the question about paint, but I know Phil's Craftmaster is held in high regard, and Owatrol primer is supposed to be 'the dog's'

 

Tony

 

Cheers.

 

I'm going to get either this: Einhell Random Orbital Sander 420 watt

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Einhell-Orbital-El...373&sr=8-22

 

or the Silverline Hi-Spec 289446 125 mm Random Orbit Sander

http://www.amazon.co.uk/orbital-sander/s/q...nder&page=3

 

Will they do the job? Can I fit any 125mm disc to them?

[AlanH]

When I get the boat back and I've moved aboard one of the first things I'm going to do is touch up the paint work. My boat is currently "deep brunswick green" but there are plenty of scrapes, one long scratch to the steel and a couple of big (5cm diameter) patches of steel/rust.

 

From what I've learned here, I need to:

 

1) sand each area down to the steel.

2) prime it

2a) undercoat it?

3) paint it

 

Each step could do with some clarification though.

 

For (1) what is the best approach? What type of sandpaper? or is a wire brush better? What type of brush. Others have mentioned angle grinders, of which I have zero experience. Which ones are good for the job and can I get em from homebase - what attachments will I need?

 

For (2) and (2a) are both step advisable? I'm quite happy to do both if needs be. What should I use (that I can aquire fairly easily) and what should I paint it on with (yeah, yeah, a brush). Do I need to sand it down between layers, if so, what with?

 

Sorry to be so dense, but any link to an idiots guide would be most welcome

 

I don't understand the need for primer/undercoat when touching up scratches etc. I never use them but just paint with topcoat. A decorator once told me that the only reason for using undercoat is that it builds up the thickness at a cheaper cost than topcoat. I've never had problems with rust coming through. Topcoat seals the surface from oxygen just as much as primer/undercoat.

Edited July 29, 2009 by AlanH

[WotEver]

Will they do the job? Can I fit any 125mm disc to them?

 

They're 'Velcro' (hook and loop) fastening, so any velcro-backed 125mm disc will fit. Throw away the dust bag - they never work and anyway are irrelevant if you're using wet 'n dry.

 

They'll work ok, if slowly. Be warned; it's a slow and tedious job if you're going to do it well. Pro's very often use air sanders which are much faster, but effectively do the same job.

 

As I said before, when you get ready to paint it you could do a lot worse than use one of these CIP primers: http://www.nwepaints.co.uk/acatalog/RustTreatments.html and for undercoat/topcoat this: http://www.craftmasterpaints.co.uk/products.htm. But there's a huge choice out there, so you can make your own choice (and others might recommend other products).

 

If you've not seen it before, you might also enjoy

.

 

Disclaimer - I've never painted a narrowboat myself although I've seen it done on many occasions. I HAVE prepped a couple of cars and it took ages but the results were good.

 

Cheers,

Tony

 

I don't understand the need for primer/undercoat when touching up scratches etc. I never use them but just paint with topcoat. A decorator once told me that the only reason for using undercoat is that it builds up the thickness at a cheaper cost than topcoat. I've never had problems with rust coming through. Topcoat seals the surface from oxygen just as much as primer/undercoat.

 

Yes, if the scratches are light and have only marked the top surface. However OP said that some scratches were deep with others through to the steel, allowing rust to form. Those need to go back to clean metal, be rust treated, primed, undercoated and glossed.

 

T

[deletedaccount]

Yes, if the scratches are light and have only marked the top surface. However OP said that some scratches were deep with others through to the steel, allowing rust to form. Those need to go back to clean metal, be rust treated, primed, undercoated and glossed.

 

T

 

Also, the paint job is only two years old, so I'd like to do it proper. In 5 years time I doubt I'll care so much

[RLWP]

Cheers.

 

I'm going to get either this: Einhell Random Orbital Sander 420 watt

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Einhell-Orbital-El...373&sr=8-22

 

or the Silverline Hi-Spec 289446 125 mm Random Orbit Sander

http://www.amazon.co.uk/orbital-sander/s/q...nder&page=3

 

Will they do the job? Can I fit any 125mm disc to them?

 

If you really are only doing scratches then I'd use a rubber block. Those sanders are going to damage quite a large area of paint. Be careful not to get grit on the sanding sheet as you work or you get some horrible deep spiral gouges that are hard to remove

 

 

screwfix

 

Richard

[deletedaccount]

Ok. Here's the plan.

 

I'm going to take up a bunch of different grit wet and dry, a sanding block, some zinc primer and some undercoat. I'll see how I get on smoothing things down by hand and then decide on if I need an orbital or not.

 

Cheers peeps.

[WotEver]

Ok. Here's the plan.

 

I'm going to take up a bunch of different grit wet and dry, a sanding block, some zinc primer and some undercoat. I'll see how I get on smoothing things down by hand and then decide on if I need an orbital or not.

 

Cheers peeps.

 

Sounds like a good plan to me

[deletedaccount]

I'm also going to take up some autoglean shampoo & polish to get that shine back up on the cabin. She's looking a bit 'matt' to say the least

[deletedaccount]

Well it was a great plan until I found out Bath Narrowboats are out of stock of both the undercoat I require and primer. Add to that the fact that it's going to piss down on saturday and I think it'll have to wait.

[WotEver]

Well it was a great plan until I found out Bath Narrowboats are out of stock of both the undercoat I require and primer. Add to that the fact that it's going to piss down on saturday...

 

.. and Sunday, and Monday, and...

[deletedaccount]

.. and Sunday, and Monday, and...

 

damn english summers

 

*shakes fist*

 

I've ordered the paint now so the bbc better be wrong.

 

All I need now is some brushes.

[WotEver]

All I need now is some brushes.