Petrol storage

[stort_mark]

What are the legal requirements and practical issues for transporting and storing petrol for use in an outboard engine?

 

I understand that the maximum capacity of non-metal containers is 10l per container (correct?), but are garages happy to allow you to waltz in and fill small (non-metal) containers?

 

I must admit I am a little paranoid about the use and storage of petrol on a boat, but a diesel outboard is somewhat impractical realistically.

 

How do cruiser owners manage their fuel? Fill up every day? How much fuel is consumed cruising for a day on the Cut? D people use multiple small containers? Does everyone fit a bilge blower?

 

Sorry....really want to understand the issues here!

[blackrose]

What are the legal requirements and practical issues for transporting and storing petrol for use in an outboard engine?

 

I understand that the maximum capacity of non-metal containers is 10l per container (correct?), but are garages happy to allow you to waltz in and fill small (non-metal) containers?

 

I must admit I am a little paranoid about the use and storage of petrol on a boat, but a diesel outboard is somewhat impractical realistically.

 

How do cruiser owners manage their fuel? Fill up every day? How much fuel is consumed cruising for a day on the Cut? D people use multiple small containers? Does everyone fit a bilge blower?

 

Sorry....really want to understand the issues here!

 

In terms of storage, treat petrol like gas - i.e. in a locker vented overboard. There have been discussions about storage of petrol in the gas locker on the forum before, but I can't remember the arguments against it.

 

You can fill up small plastic petrol containers at garages as long as they're proper fuel containers designed for the job.

 

The rest of the safety info you require can be found at: http://www.boatsafetyscheme.com/downloads/...Guide_chap5.pdf

 

The entire BSS Essential Guide is downloadable http://www.boatsafetyscheme.com/site/2nded...alGuide_212.asp

Edited June 1, 2008 by blackrose

[Ex- Member]

Plastic containers are ok if proper petrol containres, ie the ones the garages sell, and not any old container. There's proper steel ones for outboards and plastic up to 6 gallons for outboards.

 

3 gallon

 

http://www.safety-marine.co.uk/Outboard-En....htm?P5239-S28-

 

6 Gallon

 

http://www.safety-marine.co.uk/Outboard-En....htm?P5240-S28-

[AlanJ]

We used to have a cruiser with a petrol outboard. We had two tanks for the outboard so that allowed us to carry more fuel, plus a gerry can. The tanks were stored in a separate locker beside the outboard which was vented overboard.

This was in the days before BSS, so I don't know how that would affect what we used to do.

 

In terms of consumption, IIRC it was not much over a litre an hour - but it was only a 10HP engine (and it was nearly 20 years ago)

 

Hope this is of some help

[blackrose]

As an entrant for the Darwin awards, I saw a woman running a small open frame type generator half in/half out of the stern doors, and from what I could tell it was unearthed. But in terms of danger this was nothing compared to how the generator was being fueled: Because she said she had a problem with the generator's fuel tank she had taken a standard 6 litre plastic Halfords petrol container and had somehow connected this to the generator, using it as the fuel tank. It was resting upside down on the hot generator!

 

I did try to warn her but she said the generator seemed to run ok that way...

[Ex- Member]

In terms of storage, treat petrol like gas - i.e. in a locker vented overboard. There have been discussions about storage of petrol in the gas locker on the forum before, but I can't remember the arguments against it.

 

That's interesting, I'll look that one up later. We have stored petrol cans in the gas locker, it's a wide beam and plenty of space. We had steel seat lockers built into the cratch for storing stuff and for storing petrol in mind. The lockers each side vent and drain overboard so we thought they were ideal. However we left some petro in them over the summer as we weren't using the genny anymore, and when removed after a couple of months, the plastic petrol containers ballooned up from a square shape to an oval shape Non of them burst though even though they were under immence pressure which was evident when opening. That's when we started using the gas locker as they stayed much cooler in there, so in our opinion safer than the lockers.

[stort_mark]

The rest of the safety info you require can be found at: http://www.boatsafetyscheme.com/downloads/...Guide_chap5.pdf

 

The entire BSS Essential Guide is downloadable http://www.boatsafetyscheme.com/site/2nded...alGuide_212.asp

 

Thanks for the responses so far....and for the links to the downloadable information. I had already got some other documents.

 

It is useful to know the practical stuff as well as what is written in the guidelines and regulations.

 

One concern I have is that outboard storage lockers are not feasible on some designs of cruisers (e.g. the aft cabin Vikings)..or maybe I am wrong. In these kinds of boats, I would not be keen to carry petrol (even in a jerry can) in the central cockpit.

[blackrose]

Thanks for the responses so far....and for the links to the downloadable information. I had already got some other documents.

 

It is useful to know the practical stuff as well as what is written in the guidelines and regulations.

 

One concern I have is that outboard storage lockers are not feasible on some designs of cruisers (e.g. the aft cabin Vikings)..or maybe I am wrong. In these kinds of boats, I would not be keen to carry petrol (even in a jerry can) in the central cockpit.

 

I think you can buy plastic lockers but I'm not sure how they vent overboard?

[tony collins]

How things have changed. I remember when I was an engineering apprentice, one of my collegues used a petrol driven Lister truck to get to the other end of the works (without permission). He ran out of petrol and was seen walking back to the truck having illicitly obtained some more fuel(!) The container was a transparent plastic bag! He probably had a fag on whilst he topped up the tank too.

 

Tony

[Nickhlx]

On a similar note, I wanted to transport some diesel and wasn't sure about the position, so I contacted the Traffic division of the Police... they didn't even know, so said they would check and get back to me... which they did.

 

Apparently there is no limit, other than it should be in sensible amounts in sensible containers with appropriate number/type/quantity of fire extinguishers... Petrol though was different - max 10 litres I think, in appropriate containers.

 

I have just been enquiring about transporting Waste Vegetable Oil (WVO) and for that it seems that you need a licence to carry that !! a PPC or something ?

 

Nick

[Ex- Member]

On a similar note, I wanted to transport some diesel and wasn't sure about the position, so I contacted the Traffic division of the Police... they didn't even know, so said they would check and get back to me... which they did.

 

Apparently there is no limit, other than it should be in sensible amounts in sensible containers with appropriate number/type/quantity of fire extinguishers... Petrol though was different - max 10 litres I think, in appropriate containers.

 

I have just been enquiring about transporting Waste Vegetable Oil (WVO) and for that it seems that you need a licence to carry that !! a PPC or something ?

 

Nick

 

Blimy, I've had a dozen 25ltr containers full of derv in the back of our van

 

I think the ppc comes under waste for landfill, basically it's a licence to dump and carry waste, it's very easy to get, as a removal company we have to have one as we carry goods that are rejected from salerooms so technically we carry waste. It does allow us to dispose of rubbish into landfill though which is cheaper than hiring skips.

[Ex- Member]

As a general guide, in England, Northern Ireland and Wales, if you produce more than 5000 litres of biodiesel from waste catering oils, your business is likely to require a PPC permit.

 

Found this on here if it's any help.

 

http://www.netregs.gov.uk/netregs/sectors/...n=1〈=_e

 

As I recall you pay a one off fee, and the licence/permit lasts for several years possibly 10 can't remember about £90

[Nickhlx]

As a general guide, in England, Northern Ireland and Wales, if you produce more than 5000 litres of biodiesel from waste catering oils, your business is likely to require a PPC permit.

 

Found this on here if it's any help.

 

http://www.netregs.gov.uk/netregs/sectors/...n=1〈=_e

 

As I recall you pay a one off fee, and the licence/permit lasts for several years possibly 10 can't remember about £90

 

 

when I was reading up about it the other night ( biodiesel research) it suggested that the chip shop needed to have a record of where it went and the taker of it had to have a "licence" to carry it - I think mainly to ensure he knows about it not getting into the water table in the event of a crash - i.e. proper containers, properly secured, although its pretty viscous stuff compared to e.g. diesel / kerosene... may apply to a business only but maybe also privateers...

 

Still looking into it..

 

Nick

[Ex- Member]

when I was reading up about it the other night ( biodiesel research) it suggested that the chip shop needed to have a record of where it went and the taker of it had to have a "licence" to carry it - I think mainly to ensure he knows about it not getting into the water table in the event of a crash - i.e. proper containers, properly secured, although its pretty viscous stuff compared to e.g. diesel / kerosene... may apply to a business only but maybe also privateers...

 

Still looking into it..

 

Nick

 

Yeah basically the owner of any waste wanting it carried away or disposed of, has to use someone with the correct licence to carry and dispose of waste. If they don't then if that waste ends up in the wrong place then the original owner of that waste could be liable for any clean up or offence comitted. It does seem that up to 5000 litres can be carried without a licence though, so depending on what you intend to handle, you might not need one.

 

To cover yourself with any donors of oil, give anyone you get oil from a simple receipt of product & quantity.