Removing flooring

[towpathrider]

We have 20mm marine ply flooring in our boat, and would like to replace it with a solid wood or engineered wood floor at around the same thickness. Reasons for not laying on top of the ply are that it is not 100% level (some needs replacing) and it has patches of vinyl covering it which are incredibly hard to remove. (in turn not making it 100% level)

 

I'm also curious to see what's down there . . ..

 

Can i remove it without gutting the whole boat? reason being that the ply extends underneath the wall panels (10-15mm ply) and is screwed on to the floor bearers behind the wall panels. So, in order to unscrew the floor for removal we would need to also remove all the wall panels. With things like back boiler attached to these and tiling for the stove, that's not ideal.

 

What about using a circular saw set to 20mm depth and removing the floor by getting as close to the sides as possible, then trimming the sides by hand or with some other tool, to get a flush cut?

 

Thought i'd ask here as there may be others that have done this a little more elegantly than i'm planning!

[Bobbybass]

These days...I use a 'multi cutter' for everything.

I often get called in to work on mobile homes replacing rotted exterior panels...

Very precise...and easy to cut 'under' things.

You can slide that blade under an overhang and cut.

Great for cutting out tongue and groove floorboards as well. You can cut right down the board half way across a joist and then cut along the 'tongues'.

 

A brilliant...brilliant tool..

 

IDEAL !!!!

 

Quite a few manufacturers...Mains ones are available...

I use this one...

 

http://www.screwfix.com/p/erbauer-erp506htl-10-8v-1-3ah-li-ion-cordless-multi-cutter/75417

 

Watch this !!

Edited April 3, 2015 by Bobbybass

[towpathrider]

I actually have one of these but so far only used for sanding. For some reason I assumed that for a job like this it would just take ages to flush cut everything, but maybe it's the best choice.

 

Another worry is cutting too deep and damaging the blade on the floor bearers.

[Murflynn]

you will spend an awful lot on multi-tool blades if you try to cut out your plywood floor with one.

they are great for odd jobs like cutting the bottom of a door architrave when fitting new flooring, but not for long cuts.

I agree with the previous post - they are wonderful for precision sanding - better than a palm sander because they don't shake themselves to bits.

[towpathrider]

I also have a reciprocating saw but this doesn't provide an accurate cut and struggles a bit the the 20mm ply.

[Murflynn]

as it seems no-one is giving you much advice:

 

I think trying to cut out the base flooring while leaving the wall panels in place will always be a bodge job. I would only replace the floor plywood if I was prepared to rip out all the wall panels and do the job properly, i.e. remodelling the interior.

 

in your situation I would make more efforts to remove the vinyl (with the multi-tool - that is the type of job they are good at), and then do my best to level the plywood sufficiently to accept strip flooring laid on top.

[blackrose]

Personally I'd level the sub-floor with something like thin ply and lay the engineered wood floor on top. I thought a wooden floor needed a sub-floor anyway, or is that wrong?

 

I have the same issue with my 18mm ply sub-floor so at the moment I've got carpet tiles. I'm thinking about levelling the floor with thin ply (rather than absorbent hardboard). I also thought about using 12mm cellotex to level the floor and provide some insulation under a wood floor, but I'm not sure if it would compress over time?

 

http://www.insulationgiant.co.uk/Celotex-PIR-Insulation-Board-12mm-TB4012-2400mm-X-1200mm-%282-88m2-Sheet%29/p/778033?gclid=Cj0KEQjwl_6oBRDHxNGz6ueJufMBEiQAvm_k_hXMJimULoY-IB9FfevxeiixvcKzOmiR7pOI_eJQ9RoaAp238P8HAQ

Edited April 4, 2015 by blackrose

[Murflynn]

Personally I'd level the sub-floor with something like thin ply and lay the engineered wood floor on top. I thought a wooden floor needed a sub-floor anyway, or is that wrong?

 

I think you're right

[Texasboater]

If you have to remove the existing floor, I would use an undercut jamb saw to chop out 10/12 mm of the walls so you can get to the ply. You will need to replace it with a new (thinner) sub floor though, Unless you need the headroom I would clean and level what you already have.

[Detling]

You will need a subfloor anyway under the wood floor, as this has to be able to move slightly with moisture content and can get small gaps when dry. So I also suspect clean and level what is there is easiest, although the new floor would hide the bottom of the lining when laid on the new subfloor.

[Alan Saunders]

You could cut out the ply in accessible areas and install old-fashioned, solid pine, oak or other 12mm+ floor boards. Even Wickes stock them.

 

Seems to be a lot of work for little return to me. Heating the vynil flooring, e.g. with a hot-air-gun,will make it easier to remove.

 

Thin, epanded polystyrene will conform to small irregularities but not be compressed, otherwise, under normal loads (footfall).

 

Cheap, 1/8" hardboard is not suitable for any area that may become damp but 'oil-tempered hardboard', usually 1/4", is damp-resistant. I used it, successfully, for a workshop floor - laid on thin expanded polystyrene over a rough concrete screed.

 

HTH, Alan

[blackrose]

 

 

I'm also curious to see what's down there . . ..

 

 

 

In that case cut yourself a few inspection hatches - in unobtrusive places. Good to have one at the back of the cabin and perhaps near the shower or sinks where you might get leaks for easy drying out of bilges.

 

I cut mine by drilling 4 x 1" holes (4 corners of a square) - about a foot apart between the floor bearers with a hole cutter. You can see where the bearers are by looking at the screws in the subfloor. They're usually about 18" apart laying across the beam of the boat. Then you just join up the holes you cut with a jigsaw. I had to snap a wood cutting jigsaw blade in half with a couple of pairs of pliers to make a short blade because it kept hitting the ballast underneath. Use eye protection if you do this.

 

You can replace the piece of floor that you've cut out afterwards. Just support it with something underneath so it's the right height. If you find broken concrete ballast down there and you want to get some out but it's too big for the hole then use a cold chisel, a club hammer and eye protection, but of course don't do this if you suspect your hull is thin.

Edited April 4, 2015 by blackrose

[davey b]

If you end up cutting out the floor completely (and you circular saw at depth will work well, I've used that method - but set it 19mm not 20mm), you may be foiled by the wall panels being attached to the floor at the edges by battening. I can see where you're going (I've done similar) but you may be as well following the suggestions to reuse the floor you have as you have a lot of work ahead

[smileypete]

Door trimmer saw will get within 5mm or so, if you can be ultra careful and responsible about using it the other way up:

 

http://www.brandontoolhire.co.uk/en/woodworking-tools/548-door-trimming-saw.html

 

Might be better to pay a flooring bod to do it for you - and you get to keep all your fingers.. Finish the corners with a multi tool.

 

cheers, Pete.

~smpt~

Edited April 5, 2015 by smileypete

[towpathrider]

I have managed to remove the vinyl covering the floor using the scraper attachment of the multitool, don't know how I would have managed without that as it was really stuck hard and very flaky. Unfortunately bits of the ply did flake up with it, and it has also left a lot of sticky residue that i'm not sure how to remove. As the plan is to replace the ply i'm not too concerned about cleaning this off straight away, but I'd like to to reuse it at some point so any advice of removing the sticky adhesive would be great.

 

I would like to lay the floor with solid pine, wickes are doing Bordeaux Pine http://www.wickes.co.uk/Wickes-Bordeaux-Pine-Wood-Unlacquered-Flooring-22x20x2000mm/p/124000for a pretty decent price and there seem to be good reviews. . .

 

It's 22mm thick so should be OK to lay accross the bearers, and screw through the tongues with these: http://www.screwfix.com/p/tongue-tite-screws-3-5-x-45mm-pack-of-200/85991I know this is a slightly contentious issue though, but some on here have done this successfully. You can buy the boards one by one so I hope to pick the best ones, and this will allow avoiding wastage too.

 

Will update when I begin to remove the flooring.

[towpathrider]

I was able to remove a section of flooring this weekend in order to do a quick inspection. Fortunately the flooring is not fastened underneath the wall panels so I was able to remove it from underneath quite easily. The ply is very dry and in good condition.

 

The floor bearers are about 24" apart, with 1" timber on top. There are paving slabs as ballast, but for some reason these are not present everywhere under the floor. There don't appear to be any under the middle of the boat. Strangely, there do appear to be some slabs behind some of the wall panels. . . what's that all about?

 

Under the slabs there is tar paper, and this seems to have trapped moisture beneath it causing rust on the baseplate. There's around 1-2mm of rusty residue on the surface which can be easily scraped away. I'm guessing some of this is also the red paint which originally covered the steelwork.

 

I'm not too concerned about the state of the baseplate as there doesn't appear to be serious pitting on the small patch I scraped away, and results of a recent survey (may 2015) show no thicknesses below 9mm. Still, I plan to vac tan the floor and paint it either with Bitumen (I have a load of paint already) or Danboline.

 

Here are some photos: http://imgur.com/a/XnFpj(Note the pink tinge isn't because I put on some funky filter, it's a problem with my camera!)