THE CLAYTONS

[pudding]

I have just found out that my daughter is the great grandaughter x 3 of Samual Thorn( who was a Methodist/Salvation army). Sam Thorn was married I believe to a Lydia Clayton, and family hisory has implied that she was a member of the Clayton family..Fellows Morten and Clayton. They all appear to have been born/ lived and died within the Yeiwsely/Drayton and Hayes area. Would any of you boffs have information as too who Lydia was , how the business came about and any other information. Also there is a Clayton Road in Hayes Middx which runs along side the Grand Union....any snippets of info would be much appreciated. Just finding it interesting

[David Schweizer]

I have just found out that my daughter is the great grandaughter x 3 of Samual Thorn( who was a Methodist/Salvation army). Sam Thorn was married I believe to a Lydia Clayton, and family hisory has implied that she was a member of the Clayton family..Fellows Morten and Clayton. They all appear to have been born/ lived and died within the Yeiwsely/Drayton and Hayes area. Would any of you boffs have information as too who Lydia was , how the business came about and any other information. Also there is a Clayton Road in Hayes Middx which runs along side the Grand Union....any snippets of info would be much appreciated. Just finding it interesting

The 1881 census shows a Lydia Clayton (age ten)living in Yiewsley with her father Thomas (born 1843 in Yiewsley) and siblings Mary Ann (aged 17) William Peter (age15),Fanny (age13),Emma 9age 11), and Kate (age 8). Thomas was a Market Gardener.

 

The 1871 census shows her mother Emma aged 36 born in St Albans

Edited December 2, 2012 by David Schweizer

[pudding]

Thank you for that. I believe that Clayton were a boat builder in the uxbridge area..and I am interested to know more about the Claytons and Lydia, their connections in the area, and also the name Lucy Clayton is mentioned ( are they the same person?...the fact that Samual Thorn was a Methodist and a possible connection of a school within the Hayes area. Just trying to piece bits together, and you boffs on here are the best font of knowledge. ....and wisdom

[David Schweizer]

Thank you for that. I believe that Clayton were a boat builder in the uxbridge area..and I am interested to know more about the Claytons and Lydia, their connections in the area, and also the name Lucy Clayton is mentioned ( are they the same person?...the fact that Samual Thorn was a Methodist and a possible connection of a school within the Hayes area. Just trying to piece bits together, and you boffs on here are the best font of knowledge. ....and wisdom

There is a Lucy Clayton(age 22)recorded in the 1881 census, born in Yiewsley living with her mother Mary A Clayton (age 57) and sister Mary A Parker (nee Clayton - age 24) in Horton road Yiewsley (the census says Hillingdon, but it is actually in Yiewsley) given that Lydia also had a sister named Mary Anne, it could be a family name that was handed down.

 

The Clayton Canal Carrying Company was founded in 1842 by William Clayton, the son of William and Mary Anne Clayton, both the 1861 and 1881 censuses indicate he was born in Hillingdon. At the time of the 1881 census he was living at (wait for it!) Yiewsley Cottage, Aston (Birmingham). I have been unable to establish when he moved to Birmingham but clearly before 1842. None of this is conclusive proof, but there is sufficient coincidental evidence to warrant further research at the Middlesex and Birmingham Records Offices to establish whether the link with your ancestors is there. Good luck.

Edited December 2, 2012 by David Schweizer

[Heartland]

It would seem this research has stumbled on William Clayton canal carrier of Saltley, who built up an extensive fleet of narrow boats. William Clayton's will is quite lengthy and details his various properties. One son Thomas was noted for his tar boat trade and of course the partnership, Fellows, Morton & Clayton, from 1889.

 

How William Clayton came to Birmingham is intriguing, but I suppose part of his business even then was related to the gas industry and it is significant that the boat building yard was set up opposite Saltley Gasworks.

 

Ray Shill

[David Schweizer]

It would seem this research has stumbled on William Clayton canal carrier of Saltley, who built up an extensive fleet of narrow boats. William Clayton's will is quite lengthy and details his various properties. One son Thomas was noted for his tar boat trade and of course the partnership, Fellows, Morton & Clayton, from 1889.

 

How William Clayton came to Birmingham is intriguing, but I suppose part of his business even then was related to the gas industry and it is significant that the boat building yard was set up opposite Saltley Gasworks.

 

Ray Shill

I am not sure I would describe it as stumbled, there was a degree of careful research involved, admittedly based upon an assumption. How and why William clayton came to be in Birmingham is indeed intriguing, as he was only 24 when he set up his Canal Carrying Company, initially he was a general carrier, but gradually developed the tar carrying business. interestingly he was still describing himself as a "Contractor" in 1881.

 

Whether it is significant that his Yard was opposite the Saltley Gas Works is a matter of conjecture, but it was certainly beneficial, he set up his yard in 1862, and the Birmingham and Staffordshire Gas Company established their gas works in 1865, perhaps he had some inside information.

Edited December 2, 2012 by David Schweizer

[pudding]

thanks for the replys,all interesting stuff.what we would like to know is lydia (or could be lucy) clayton a decendent

of the famous canal claytons,we have a photo of what we believe is her husband from 1929 (sam/sammy thorn)in the yiewsley

salvation army,he was also a one time yiewsley councillor.it would be good to know if we have a clayton in our family.

[David Schweizer]

thanks for the replys,all interesting stuff.what we would like to know is lydia (or could be lucy) clayton a decendent

of the famous canal claytons,we have a photo of what we believe is her husband from 1929 (sam/sammy thorn)in the yiewsley

salvation army,he was also a one time yiewsley councillor.it would be good to know if we have a clayton in our family.

You seem to be misunderstanding the information I have posted, there were two women one named Lydia, one named Lucy of different ages in diffeerent households but both in Yiewsley and almost certtainoly related. Neither of them was a descendant of Thomas Clayton who was from two generations before them. However, the evidence does suggest that she and Thomas Clayton quite possibly shared an ancestor.

 

To find out anything else you do need to undertake some serious Records Office research as there is only limited information available on the intermnet or on genealogy software.

Edited December 3, 2012 by David Schweizer

[Heartland]

If I recall there are several letters from William Clayton to the Coventry Canal, some dated in the late 1850's, that quote the address as his Saltley Wharf.

 

Saltley Gas Works was on land belonging to C.B Adderley, and this land was purchased during 1857. Various minutes of the gas company indicate the first Saltley works were constructed 1857-1858. Regrettably such records are temporary unavailable whist Birmingham Archives move to the new Library site. There was a water mill here prior to the building of the gasworks.

 

The Claytons were also involved with a timber yard that was near the boatyard. Birmingham Sanitary registers for boats record some Clayton boats as carrying gas water, tar, drain pipes or timber.

 

Ray Dhill

[David Schweizer]

I have found a bit more information. According to an article by Alan Faulkner in the Spring 2006 issue of "Narrowboat" Magazine, William Clayton was born in Yiewsley, and married Catherine Johnson in 1839, at the time he was described as a "Boatman". He set up his Canal Carrying business in 1842 in West Drayton, but by the late 1840's he had moved it to Aston in Birmingham, moving again to Saltley in 1862.

 

As already suggested, there is sufficient evidence to indicate that your Lydia Morton was quite possiby related to William Clayton, not descended from him, but possibly sharing a common ancestor. This should be comparatively easy to research but is complicated by a number of factors Yiewsley Parish was not established until 1859 so earlier searches need to be made in the registers of St John's Hillingdon, but as your ancestors may have been non conformists any records after 1837 may not be in the Parish Registers and, unfortunately many non-Conformist records have been lost. Your only redress is to refer to the public records which were stated in 1837, this can be a very slow and tedious procedure, and does not always produce a clear result without paying for duplicate certificates. My suggestion is that you contact the London Metropolitan Archives and seek thier advice, they have a web site here :- http://www.cityoflondon.gov.uk/things-to-do/visiting-the-city/archives-and-city-history/london-metropolitan-archives/Pages/default.aspx

Edited December 4, 2012 by David Schweizer

[pudding]

Thanks for all you replies.....I have a member of the family who is sure that a family tree has been researched. He did mention that they were from Birmingham, so this is a start. Fingers crossed, I may be able to give more info.

[Heartland]

Just to add to what Alan Faulkner had researched about the Claytons wharf in Saltley. For family historians Saltley was part of Aston and so the reference to the early Aston yard may still mean that it was at Saltley. Only surviving rate books for Aston may tell, but those in Birmingham Library are presently not accessible.

 

Ray Shill

[grey wolf]

It is strange to think that Birmingham was once part of Aston not the other way round as it is today

[Max Sinclair]

It is strange to think that Birmingham was once part of Aston not the other way round as it is today

Birmingham was regarded as a village, the Worcester canal was going to run west at Bromsgrove to Stourbridge, it was only the sudden growth of small industries that made it a City of a Thousand Trades and increased its importance.

[Heartland]

Birmingham and Aston were once separate entities, although Aston was once greater in size. As Birmingham developed its industrial base, Aston also benefitted from the overspill, but eventually all Aston was incorporated into Birmingham.

 

Ray Shill

[sstephly]

I have just found out that my daughter is the great grandaughter x 3 of Samual Thorn( who was a Methodist/Salvation army). Sam Thorn was married I believe to a Lydia Clayton, and family hisory has implied that she was a member of the Clayton family..Fellows Morten and Clayton. They all appear to have been born/ lived and died within the Yeiwsely/Drayton and Hayes area. Would any of you boffs have information as too who Lydia was , how the business came about and any other information. Also there is a Clayton Road in Hayes Middx which runs along side the Grand Union....any snippets of info would be much appreciated. Just finding it interesting

 

 

I don't know if you would still be interested in the information that I have regarding Samuel Thorn and Lydia Clayton as there is quiet a bit of information already posted. This couple are my great grandparents and I have researched the family tree quite a bit in recent years. Lydia's father was Thomas Clayton born 1842. Thomas was the younger brother of William Clayton, founder of the Clayton Barge company, this makes Lydia William's niece. To my knowledge Williams grandson, Forrester Clayton (born 1878), eventually became the Managing director of the company and lived in Brentford, Middlesex. Lydia was Thomas' second daughter by his second wife, Emma Holland. Emma was born in St Albans in 1834. The Clayton family owned large areas of Yiewsley mainly along the canal, they also owned businesses not connected directly to the canal. Lydia's older half brother William Peter Clayton owned a Butchers in Yiewsley High Street. Lydia's younger sister Kate married Herbert Cox who owned a large farm in Cowley, Middlesex and was a cattle dealer. Lydia also had an older sister called Emma. Lydia married Samuel Thorn on 18/04/1892, her father considered her to have married beneath herself as Samuel was a labourer in the local Brickfields which were served by the barges on the Grand Union canal running through Yiewsley. Samuel was eventually a local councilor in the Yiewsley and West Drayton Urban District Council, and is locally remembered by way of his surname being used to name a road in a housing estate built in about the 1920's (Whitethorn Avenue, this was named after two coucilors, the other having the surname White). Samuel was also a Captain in the Salvation Army. Lydia and Samuel had 12 children, Grace, Harold, Samuel Hubert, Ernest, Wilfred Sidney, Victor Edward, Ivy Evelyn, Marjorie May, Winifred Nellie, Kathleen Maud, Thomas Leslie and Hilda Irene. Ernest and Winifred both died before reaching adulthood with Ernest drowning in the canal at the age of 6 and Winifred dying at the age of 12 (probably from what is now called meningitis). Thomas and Ivy never married, Grace married but did not have any children, all the others married and had children of their own. I hope this is of interest to you.

Edited March 31, 2013 by sstephly

[Derek R.]

Jeannette Harrison lives around your way, have a look for her posts on family on this site - usually in the historic section (this one).

[pudding]

I don't know if you would still be interested in the information that I have regarding Samuel Thorn and Lydia Clayton as there is quiet a bit of information already posted. This couple are my great grandparents and I have researched the family tree quite a bit in recent years. Lydia's father was Thomas Clayton born 1842. Thomas was the younger brother of William Clayton, founder of the Clayton Barge company, this makes Lydia William's niece. To my knowledge Williams grandson, Forrester Clayton (born 1878), eventually became the Managing director of the company and lived in Brentford, Middlesex. Lydia was Thomas' second daughter by his second wife, Emma Holland. Emma was born in St Albans in 1834. The Clayton family owned large areas of Yiewsley mainly along the canal, they also owned businesses not connected directly to the canal. Lydia's older half brother William Peter Clayton owned a Butchers in Yiewsley High Street. Lydia's younger sister Kate married Herbert Cox who owned a large farm in Cowley, Middlesex and was a cattle dealer. Lydia also had an older sister called Emma. Lydia married Samuel Thorn on 18/04/1892, her father considered her to have married beneath herself as Samuel was a labourer in the local Brickfields which were served by the barges on the Grand Union canal running through Yiewsley. Samuel was eventually a local councilor in the Yiewsley and West Drayton Urban District Council, and is locally remembered by way of his surname being used to name a road in a housing estate built in about the 1920's (Whitethorn Avenue, this was named after two coucilors, the other having the surname White). Samuel was also a Captain in the Salvation Army. Lydia and Samuel had 12 children, Grace, Harold, Samuel Hubert, Ernest, Wilfred Sidney, Victor Edward, Ivy Evelyn, Marjorie May, Winifred Nellie, Kathleen Maud, Thomas Leslie and Hilda Irene. Ernest and Winifred both died before reaching adulthood with Ernest drowning in the canal at the age of 6 and Winifred dying at the age of 12 (probably from what is now called meningitis). Thomas and Ivy never married, Grace married but did not have any children, all the others married and had children of their own. I hope this is of interest to you.

 

Hi, thank you for your reply. I believe that I have some newspaper cuttings regarding Sam Thorn and some birth/death certs also. I shall dig these out this evening, and see if we can tie the history up. Again thank you.

[Maggie Moojen]

Hi, I am related to William Clayton of Fellows Morton and Clayton. He was my Great Grandfather, my Grandfather was Alfred Clayton who managed Paddington Basin to begin with. He then married and moved to Hayes, Middlesex, later he moves to Ealing where he lived until his death in 1970, at the age of 95.

He was one of many children, about 13 I think. Many were boys who went into the family businesses. The ones who worked for FMC managed various arms of the canal system, down to London.

William Clayton married Elizabeth Banfield the daughter of a Devonshire farmer. Elizabeth had a brother James, he married William Clayton's sister Sophia. James and Sophia Banfield owned an Ironmongers in Tenbury Wells, it still exists in the Banfield family!

 

Edited July 6, 2017 by Maggie Moojen
My tablet had a life of it's own!

[Derek R.]

A direct descendant of 'FMC'! Welcome to the forum. There are a few boatpeople with family connections who frequent the forum, but none before that I know of from Management!