£1.37 a litre!!!!!!!

[DobieJade]

Friends of ours just spent 2 days up at Barton Marina on the T&M and the price of diesel was £1.37 a litre and still over £1 a litre after the 60/40 split. They didn't ask the price first but they had 26 litres and were shocked when asked for £30.61. I think in future they will ask the price first. Can anyone beat this???? One place not to get diesel!!!! Starline Boats (bridge 20 Coventry Canal) 70p and excellent service.

Edited August 26, 2010 by DobieJade

[casper ghost]

It's got to a rediculous state where it's cheaper to buy white diesel from a garage.

Casp'

[Guest]

Friends of ours just spent 2 days up at Barton Marina on the T&M and the price of diesel was £1.37 a litre and still over £1 a litre after the 60/40 split. They didn't ask the price first but they had 26 litres and were shocked when asked for £30.61. I think in future they will ask the price first. Can anyone beat this???? One place not to get diesel!!!! Starline Boats (bridge 20 Coventry Canal) 70p and excellent service.

 

I take it this was not a self deceleration purchase but rather a split imposed by the seller...

 

I understand that contravenes HMRC's rules....I understood the buyer declares the split not the seller.

[journeyperson]

I take it this was not a self deceleration purchase but rather a split imposed by the seller...

 

I understand that contravenes HMRC's rules....I understood the buyer declares the split not the seller.

 

 

Is that when you stop yourself from swearing?

[romarni123]

Have there been fewer boats out and about this year?. I noticed last year that there were a lot fewer boats out and about. When we go to stratford in August there were always lots of boats waiting for the locks, same on the llan and Atherstone was always busy, is it because of the price of diesel is making it to expensive to travel around.Its due to go up again soon at the suppliers.

[enviropc]

Wasnt it like 60p per litre in the winter?

Is this big rise due to the fact its summer and these are tourist prices?

Im gonna check tomorow how much we pay for the diesel in my forklift, its probaly going to be loads cheaper.

[romarni123]

If it is can you come and fill my tank

[enviropc]

ill keep you posted.

[Liam]

57p at Norbury Junction!

[enviropc]

Hi Liam.

Thats where i was buying mine from last year.. could not believe it when i saw the prices at Ellesmere

Dont tell Simon what ever you do or it'll be £2 at the Junction before we know it (only joking)

 

Ive just been doing some checks and it appears that Red has not trebled overnight and is infact still around the 50p mark for agricultural so it’s the marinas that are making all the profit on this price hyke.

Does this happen every year?

[alan_fincher]

Friends of ours just spent 2 days up at Barton Marina on the T&M and the price of diesel was £1.37 a litre and still over £1 a litre after the 60/40 split.

 

So what are you saying, exactly ?

 

If it was "over 60/40 after the 60/40 split", are you saying the £1.37 was the fully built up price for the propulsion part ?

 

If propulsion is £1.37 then that means "non propulsion" should have been around 48.5 pence less, so 88.5 pence per litre.

 

That would work out at an average of around £1.18 per litre on a 60/40 split. I'm confused as I'd describe £1.18 rather more than "still over £1 per litre".

 

If that's what you mean, these are high prices, but not massively more than being charged at some other canal outlets, to be honest, and probably still cheaper than some.

 

Out local marina, for example is currently at 87 pence for "non-propulsion, so the one you are complaining about here is only a penny or two more expensive than that. I've seen worse!

 

Also £1.18 is the kind of price I'm paying locally for ULS DERV, (road diesel), so the claim it would be cheaper to fill up entirely with "white" is stretching it a bit, even at these prices!

[Mick and Maggie]

they had 26 litres and were shocked when asked for £30.61

 

I purchased 50 litres of red in Sheffield and paid £38.95 that's 77.9p per litre. I thought that was a bit steep...

[Night Hawk]

Wasnt it like 60p per litre in the winter?

Is this big rise due to the fact its summer and these are tourist prices?

Im gonna check tomorow how much we pay for the diesel in my forklift, its probaly going to be loads cheaper.

 

Can't we just fill our Jerry cans and claim we're buying a few hundred litres for our..erm...tractors? There's no split to declare at all then is there?

[enviropc]

Can't we just fill our Jerry cans and claim we're buying a few hundred litres for our..erm...tractors? There's no split to declare at all then is there?

 

Yes and i dont think its against the rules.

Or you could goto Norbury Junction and buy it

[alan_fincher]

Can't we just fill our Jerry cans and claim we're buying a few hundred litres for our..erm...tractors? There's no split to declare at all then is there?

 

Can't we just fill our Jerry cans and claim we're buying a few hundred litres for our..erm...tractors? There's no split to declare at all then is there?

 

Yes and i dont think its against the rules.

 

Actually, I think there is very little doubt at all that it is now illegal.

 

Certainly is if you use any of it to move the boat with.

 

But then I'm sure you all know that, actually, don't you ?

[enviropc]

I wasnt aware of that.

I thought that as long as you didnt use it on the roads then then it didnt matter if you where using it to move a forklift, boat or tractor?

[Night Hawk]

Can't we just fill our Jerry cans and claim we're buying a few hundred litres for our..erm...tractors? There's no split to declare at all then is there?

 

Yes and i dont think its against the rules.

Or you could goto Norbury Junction and buy it

 

Well...when I was filling up at Norbury t'uther week at 57.9p, the lady said they'd just had another delivery and the price had gone down yet again...she told me that she tries to undercut the guy at Wheeton Aston...but it's such a long way to go from Swanley to save a few quid....I think I'll buy me Jerry cans!

[alan_fincher]

I wasnt aware of that.

I thought that as long as you didnt use it on the roads then then it didnt matter if you where using it to move a forklift, boat or tractor?

The fuel you use for propulsion must have the additional excise duty paid on it.

 

The excise duty on propulsion is 57.19 ppl, whereas on the "other" it is 10.99 ppl, a difference of 46.2 ppl. However that amount, (like all the excise duty) attracts VAT at a low rate of 5%, (a tax on a tax !), so the difference becomes 48.5 ppl (as near as damn it!).

 

If you buy you "red" from a non-marine supplier, and use if for propulsion, they have no mechanism to collect that extra duty and VAT and pay it to the revenue, so the law is being broken.

 

So far as I know, it would be OK to buy your "non propulsion" in jerry cans at agricultural prices, but you would have to be able to demonstrate that you had bought propulsion diesel from a marine source, and paid the full duty on it.

 

That's the law, so far as I'm aware. Many people clearly think they have no chance of being rumbled if they break it, but they should not delude themselves they are acting legally, IMO.

[enviropc]

Interesting stuff Alan especially the tax on tax!

I would never have thought that propelling a forklift attracted a different tax than propelling a boat.

Does the Government provide a list anywhere of different tax brackets for each vehicle? i.e. 5% for a tractor, 10% for a boat, 7% for a forklift?

It all seems a little unfair that boats have been singled out from other non road forms of transportation to be targeted for increased taxes.

[casper ghost]

You can, legally buy red non duty diesel for the non propulsion part and then buy white road diesel for the propulsion part. Works out alot cheaper, though I doubt anyone who says that is what they do actually does it. But it would be very difficult to dissprove.

Casp'

[Doorman]

Have there been fewer boats out and about this year?. I noticed last year that there were a lot fewer boats out and about. When we go to stratford in August there were always lots of boats waiting for the locks, same on the llan and Atherstone was always busy, is it because of the price of diesel is making it to expensive to travel around.Its due to go up again soon at the suppliers.

 

 

Plenty of boats on the Shroppie, although travelling on the Bridgewater yesterday was fairly quiet. Diesel is only expensive when you fail to enquire about the price before filling up

 

Mike

[Naughty Cal]

You can, legally buy red non duty diesel for the non propulsion part and then buy white road diesel for the propulsion part. Works out alot cheaper, though I doubt anyone who says that is what they do actually does it. But it would be very difficult to dissprove.

Casp'

 

Why would you doubt that is what people do?

 

That is what we do. We buy our 40% red diesel from a local supplier at 45ppl then our 60% white diesel from petrol stations currently around £1.15pl. We have all the reciepts to prove it should it ever be questioned. All of our cars are petrol so why else would we buy diesel?

 

So our current cost per litre if you broke it down to a 60/40 split is 87ppl. The boat doesnt seem to care what it runs on.

 

We do of course fill up at waterside outlets where necessary and usually claim a 60/40 split on the red served. The most expensive place we have filled up was Wells. The price was 97ppl on a 60/40 split. The cheapest so far has been (suprisingly) Burton Waters where we paid 72ppl on a 60/40 split, however this was on an almost full tank of ours and a friends full tank so was based on large quantities being bought. Smaller quantities bring a higher premium.

[alan_fincher]

You can, legally buy red non duty diesel for the non propulsion part and then buy white road diesel for the propulsion part. Works out alot cheaper, though I doubt anyone who says that is what they do actually does it. But it would be very difficult to dissprove.

Casp'

 

Actually I'm not sure it would......

 

I've not heard of any cases of the Revenue dipping boat tanks yet, and of course it's quite possible they would never bother.

 

But as the dye is injected into "red" in reasonably controlled proportions, I'd be fairly surprised if the revenue man couldn't know fairly accurately the "white"/"red" mix in any tank they did start to investigate.

 

This must arise fairly regularly in road vehicles, something they do on a regular basis.

 

The consensus seems to be that they are unlikely to start showing an interest in canal and river boats, but if they did, I think some people could get a nasty surprise!

[Naughty Cal]

Actually I'm not sure it would......

 

I've not heard of any cases of the Revenue dipping boat tanks yet, and of course it's quite possible they would never bother.

 

But as the dye is injected into "red" in reasonably controlled proportions, I'd be fairly surprised if the revenue man couldn't know fairly accurately the "white"/"red" mix in any tank they did start to investigate.

 

This must arise fairly regularly in road vehicles, something they do on a regular basis.

 

The consensus seems to be that they are unlikely to start showing an interest in canal and river boats, but if they did, I think some people could get a nasty surprise!

 

Thats all well and good but for us for example, if we are out and about, we buy red from riverside outlets so whilst on the whole we should have a fairly constant 60/40 split of white/red diesel on occasion we will have a full tank of red which we have, of course, bought quite legally from the waterside.

[Athy]

Have there been fewer boats out and about this year?. I noticed last year that there were a lot fewer boats out and about. When we go to stratford in August there were always lots of boats waiting for the locks, same on the llan and Atherstone was always busy, is it because of the price of diesel is making it to expensive to travel around.

No, it's because last weekend they were all on the Napton Flight.

Mark Boardman, of the diesel-selling boat 'Dusty', reckons that you need make no declaration of split if you're buying less than two jerrycans' worth of diesel, i.e. about eight gallons. Is this true?