Boat Lengths and Locks

[Nige]

Hi Folks,

I am new to the canals and was wondering about the measurements BW gives for the sizes of boats allowed on the waterways.

The reason im asking is that I will be buying a NB as a liveaboard in the next few weeks, and am currently looking seriously at a 62 foot NB. If I go ahead and purchase, I will have her moved by road up to the Leeds and Liverpool, where I intend to moor her at Barrowford, near Burnley/Colne/Nelson.

 

The thing that has got me thinking is that the measurements that BW gives for the lock dimensions are "Max of 72ft between Liverpool & Wigan and max of 62 ft between Wigan and Leeds".

 

So just how much room does this leave to manouver in the lock ? Would it be incredibly tight - or is it relatively free and easy ??

 

Any pointers would be most welcome !

Cheers,

Nige

[Richard Bustens]

I thought the leeds and liverpool had a max length of 57 or 60 foot

[John Orentas]

Hi Nige.

 

To start with you don't need to manouvre in a lock but that is not your problem. With a 62ft boat you will certainly have problems, from Wigan to Leeds boat lengths are limited to 60ft according to my book, and in a similar way the Calder & Hebble and the Huddersfield Broad canals are limited to 57' 6". The Rochdale and of course the Bridgewater are 72' but at the Yorkshire end the only access is by the C & H.

 

In other words if you want to cruise the Yorkshire waterways if you have a boat greater than 57' 6" you will be severely limited.

 

But double check with BW the books have been known to be wrong.

Edited August 14, 2005 by John Orentas

[fender]

This was discussed on another thread:

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=829&hl=

 

Basically its that a Leeds & Liverpool (62') short boat will fit the locks but two 62' narrow boats side by side in a lock wont fit. Dont forget the Calder & Hebble which is 57'. Some argue that longer boats can be got in on the C & H or L & L locks diagonally, but its like the Stort which has only 13' 6in locks and some try to squeeze two boats in which sometimes works but there's a risk, as i have seen boats in trouble on the Stort whilst sharing locks, so its not advisable to try pushing the lock dimensions limits anywhere.

[bottle]

Nige go to this link

 

http://www.britishwaterways.co.uk/accounta...sultations.html

 

 

 

and you can then link to a pdf file with a consultation document with all the dimension of the canals. BW are asking for feedback to confirm the true sizes.

Edited August 14, 2005 by bottle

[Guest]

I believe that on LandL Wigan flight that 62 foot will only fit diagonally in the locks, and the lock keepers don't like the idea.

[John Orentas]

I believe that on LandL Wigan flight that 62 foot will only fit diagonally in the locks, and the lock keepers don't like the idea.

27883[/snapback]

 

 

 

Stan.

 

I think that applied to 60ft boats, and I have been told that is very arguable.

Edited August 14, 2005 by John Orentas

[MartinClark]

I have heard that it is just possible to get a 62' narrowboat through the L & L locks but that it is particularly tight at Bingley. Basically, a 62' narrowboat on the L & L isn't such a good idea, Nige.

 

Hey, John - is that your boat at Furness Vale with the rather cool cat on the back?

[John Orentas]

Hi Martin.

 

My Nicholson's books says that the L&L Wigan to Leeds has a rated length of 60ft, it is just possible that he may get through but the main problem will be that the Calder & Hebble and the Huddersfield broad canals are much more limited, these allow access to the Rochdale and Huddersfield Narrow.

 

Yes that's my boat, with cat. He is one of a million cats in my life I am not allowed anything if it hasn't got a cat on it. Oh yes there are two real ones but they don't like boats.

[dor]

There are an awful lot of "I think", "I believe", "I have heard" etc.

 

I think our OP needs a more definitive answer.

Would BW be able to give that?

[Richard Bustens]

Bw say for C/H 55' (57'5'') i suppose that the brackets are for diagonal

[bottle]

As previously posted http://www.britishwaterways.co.uk/accounta...sultations.html

 

This give all lengths that BW are working with at the moment if anybody knows for sure any discrpepancies they should contact BW.

 

I think/ i've heard is not good enough true facts are what is required.

[Guest]

Sixty feet it is according to above link.

[Nige]

Sixty feet it is according to above link.

27907[/snapback]

 

 

 

I AM ABSOLUTELY LIVID !!!

 

All during the summer months since mid May, I have been liasing with BW over availability of moorings at Barrowford on the Leeds - Liverpool. On average I have spoken to them twice a month. I have contacted them this morning to get things moving and take over a mooring only to be told when I am 10 days away from selling the house and purchasing the liveaboard, that Barrowford and "The whole length of the Leeds and Liverpool canal are now operating on a waiting list principle, and that Barrowford has a waiting time of approximately 18 months" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I have been extremely lucky in that from this mess, and with the marvelous help of Wayne at Lower Park marina, Barnoldswick putting me in touch with a local landowner, I now have a mooring in a much nicer location, and approx £500 a year cheaper !!!

 

I am absolutely flabbergasted at how BW can spin me a line for over 3 months, and then almost sink me before I even buy the boat !!!

 

Anyway - a really big thank you to Wayne at Lower Park Marina

[Richard Bustens]

That Nige is the way it is.

 

And dont forget you will still have to pay BW as well as the farmer unless he has paid but i suspect not.

[Nige]

That Nige is the way it is.

 

And dont forget you will still have to pay BW as well as the farmer unless he has paid but i suspect not.

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Hi Richard,

 

So how does that work then ? If I rent a mooring from a landowner, I expect to pay for BW license etc - but is there another charge that BW makes for mooring as well ? Even if the mooring is not on their property ?

Cheers,

Nige

[Cris P]

You may be tied to someone else's land, but you're still on their water I'm afraid.

[Richard Bustens]

Yep that is how it workes, it confused me to start with, but i think BW are looking for about 15p per foot per week the same as end of garden moorings.

 

You should have worked out by now it's heads you loose , tails you loose.

 

I was looking at a farmers field and he wanted 25p per foot per week and BW 15p per foot per week, but that is still a lot cheaper than any other moorings you will find ,and so long as the farmer is ok with it you can live on board, but you should then be paying rates to the local council as well.

[dor]

BW will want about 50% of the local charge for thier online moorings if you are on a fram mooring. Some mooring fees will include it and pay it to BW, others leave you to sort it out yourself.

[Derek]

I remember someone saying that whilst the land owner owns the flat ground, it is the vetical bit that you moor against, and that belongs to BW!

Makes sense, sort of...

 

Derek

[dor]

Some people will state that BW own the first metre, or yard, or six foot etc of the offside, but I am not convinced. There are too many variations on the story, suggesting too much guesswork! However they do tend to own the offside on embankments and the like. What they do own without doubt is the bed of the canal and any space above it. So irrespective of how much land they own on the offside, they will own the space you moor on if it is in the canal. If it is an offline marina that is a different matter, but then they will make a charge to the marina owner for access.

[John Orentas]

There are no fixed rules in all this, remember that all the canals were built by individual companies and most were only nationalised in 1949 but the original contracts, covenants etc. were transfered to the publicly owned organisation at that time in the original form.

 

The Rochdale Canal Company were the canal owners until just a few years ago. It has recently come to light that they have in many places sold every inch of their land right up to the waters edge to the adjoining landowners and they made no arrangements for maintenance or repair access.

 

They have even sold the canal embankments, a fact which may in future give everyone some legal fun and games, there are mutterings to the effect that if they own the embankments and other components of the canal they should be responsible for the repairs when they fail.

[Nige]

Hi Folks,

Well I bought my first NB.....and had it transported up to the Leeds Liverpool last week by road.

 

I can now confirm that the locks (at least the stretch of canal I have travelled - the section between Barnoldswick and Skipton) WILL quite comfortably accomodate a boat of 62 feet length.

 

She went through three locks on this section with approx four to five feet of space from rudder to the edge of the sill.

I am now on my permanent mooring,looking forward to enjoying life on the water !

 

Cheers,

Nige

[gaggle]

nice one nige i hope i will pass you soon on the good old l&l.gaggle

[DHutch]

nice one nige i hope i will pass you soon on the good old l&l.gaggle

Yeah, well done.

- Whats name of the boat? I'll look out for you if and when we go that way.

 

 

Daniel (SNB EmilyAnne)