BW changes 2.1mtr beam to 2.3mtr

[Laurence Hogg]

Dear All,

 

 

 

Below is a statement received from BW today following comments made to them with evidence of boats being built to over 7ft in the past.:

 

 

We understand there have been some comments and discussion regarding the

definition of broad beam boats in the context BWAF's report to BW on

improvements to the licensing system.

The purpose of consulting on proposals is to tease out relevant issues,

big or small. We are happy to accept the amendment and set the width

boundary at 2.3m as suggested, and thank those responsible for drawing

it to our attention.

 

 

Grand Union boats were all 7ft 1/2", first post war narrowboats purpose built to 6ft 10" were the "Admiral class" built in 1957 to negoiate bulging lock walls in the North West.

 

Regards,

 

Laurence Hogg

[mayalld]

Dear All,

 

 

 

Below is a statement received from BW today following comments made to them with evidence of boats being built to over 7ft in the past.:

 

 

We understand there have been some comments and discussion regarding the

definition of broad beam boats in the context BWAF's report to BW on

improvements to the licensing system.

The purpose of consulting on proposals is to tease out relevant issues,

big or small. We are happy to accept the amendment and set the width

boundary at 2.3m as suggested, and thank those responsible for drawing

it to our attention.

 

 

Grand Union boats were all 7ft 1/2", first post war narrowboats purpose built to 6ft 10" were the "Admiral class" built in 1957 to negoiate bulging lock walls in the North West.

 

Regards,

 

Laurence Hogg

 

Well, doubtless the arguments over beam based licence fees will continue, but they are at least responsive to ironing out unintended consequences.

 

The beam limit is now 7' 6.5"

 

Given that any narrow boat so badly spread is unlikely to pass through a very high number of narrow locks, this does seem a more reasonable line to draw.

[Jason Wilson and Family]

Now what are the odds on getting them to maintain the locs properly so it never becomes an issue again? Or will be be hearing about how those 'oversized' 6'-6" boats need to be charged a wide fee in the next few years.

[Laurence Hogg]

Now what are the odds on getting them to maintain the locs properly so it never becomes an issue again? Or will be be hearing about how those 'oversized' 6'-6" boats need to be charged a wide fee in the next few years.

 

If you are going to comment on a very serious issue resolved which could have cost a lot of boaters more money then make it sensible. Exactly what is an "oversised 6ft 6"" boat?? Shropshire Union had "Trench" boats at 6ft 8" but I know of no 6ft 6" types.

[Jason Wilson and Family]

If you are going to comment on a very serious issue resolved which could have cost a lot of boaters more money then make it sensible. Exactly what is an "oversised 6ft 6"" boat?? Shropshire Union had "Trench" boats at 6ft 8" but I know of no 6ft 6" types.

 

6'-10" is the standard boat size now, yes? From what I understand both narrowboats and the narrow locks used to be a little bit wider than today which is where this debate came from in the first place, older narrowboats were being called 'wide' by the new definition when, in reality the boats hadn't changed, the locks had.

 

If they don't maintain the locks properly, then who is to say what size boat will be too wide to fit in the future. That is why oversized was in quotes, they're not oversized now, but they may be considered such in the future.

[magpie patrick]

6'-10" is the standard boat size now, yes? From what I understand both narrowboats and the narrow locks used to be a little bit wider than today which is where this debate came from in the first place, older narrowboats were being called 'wide' by the new definition when, in reality the boats hadn't changed, the locks had.

 

If they don't maintain the locks properly, then who is to say what size boat will be too wide to fit in the future. That is why oversized was in quotes, they're not oversized now, but they may be considered such in the future.

 

Errm, yes, sort of: the problem is partly that narrow locks are not a standard size and neither originally were narrow boats. Leaving aside the Shrewsbury Canal which was built for tub boats but could take very narrow narrow boats the size varied from 6-11 to about 7-4, with one (Montgomery Western) stated as being 6-9, while some BCN "narrow" locks are 8 feet wide!

 

Not all the problems stated are caused by "bulge" in the locks, some narrow locks were more narrow than others to start with.

 

I wonder how the Mon and Brec will be dealt with, as the ruling gauge is 8-6 there, so a narrow beam can't share the locks anyway, so will someone who has a whole foot extra be made to pay through the nose?

[Jason Wilson and Family]

Errm, yes, sort of: the problem is partly that narrow locks are not a standard size and neither originally were narrow boats. Leaving aside the Shrewsbury Canal which was built for tub boats but could take very narrow narrow boats the size varied from 6-11 to about 7-4, with one (Montgomery Western) stated as being 6-9, while some BCN "narrow" locks are 8 feet wide!

 

Not all the problems stated are caused by "bulge" in the locks, some narrow locks were more narrow than others to start with.

 

I wonder how the Mon and Brec will be dealt with, as the ruling gauge is 8-6 there, so a narrow beam can't share the locks anyway, so will someone who has a whole foot extra be made to pay through the nose?

 

I should have figured that but I'm on a somewhat limited understanding of things anyway.

 

So it sounds like there really isn't an easy fair standard to apply to the whole system (not that the idea was fair anyway).

[Laurence Hogg]

Errm, yes, sort of: the problem is partly that narrow locks are not a standard size and neither originally were narrow boats. Leaving aside the Shrewsbury Canal which was built for tub boats but could take very narrow narrow boats the size varied from 6-11 to about 7-4, with one (Montgomery Western) stated as being 6-9, while some BCN "narrow" locks are 8 feet wide!

 

Not all the problems stated are caused by "bulge" in the locks, some narrow locks were more narrow than others to start with.

 

I wonder how the Mon and Brec will be dealt with, as the ruling gauge is 8-6 there, so a narrow beam can't share the locks anyway, so will someone who has a whole foot extra be made to pay through the nose?

 

If you look back in the BW byelaws I do believe that anything over 7ft 6" was considered wide, 7ft 6" allowed for "Hampton" boats which were around 80ft long and 7ft 6" wide (although some were built wider), This is why the gauging stops on the BCN 473ft level are so wide.

Edited September 23, 2008 by LAURENCE HOGG

[Steilsteven]

I'm afraid this bit of 'back pedelling' just winds me up.

If the goalposts can be moved for one type of boat then they should be moved for others, such as Leeds and liverpool boats or Humber Keels for instance.

 

If this move was brought about because of what's considered to be original dimentions, then it should take into account all original dimensions.

Original dimensions for a Kennet and Avon Barge were, I believe, 66'x 12'6'' so given the logic demonstrated by this change that should be the starting point or maybe it should be 57'x14' as with L&L, you can take your pick from a vast assortment of ''original'' dimensions.

 

So why should G.U. boats get away with this where others can't?

 

I trust you'll be championing this one also Lauwrence?

[Tim Lewis]

I'm afraid this bit of 'back pedelling' just winds me up.

If the goalposts can be moved for one type of boat then they should be moved for others, such as Leeds and liverpool boats or Humber Keels for instance.

 

If this move was brought about because of what's considered to be original dimentions, then it should take into account all original dimensions.

Original dimensions for a Kennet and Avon Barge were, I believe, 66'x 12'6'' so given the logic demonstrated by this change that should be the starting point or maybe it should be 57'x14' as with L&L, you can take your pick from a vast assortment of ''original'' dimensions.

 

So why should G.U. boats get away with this where others can't?

 

I trust you'll be championing this one also Lauwrence?

 

GU boats are not getting away with anything, what we have done is educate BW as to how wide a narrow lock is.

 

Tim

Edited September 23, 2008 by Tim Lewis

[tony collins]

GU boats are not getting away with anything, what we have done is educate BW as to how wide a narrow lock is.

 

Tim

 

Having negotiated the Garrison flight this afternoon I can confirm that not all locks are 7ft wide! Neither, it seems is it necessary to equip them with paddles that work!

 

Tony.

[Tim Lewis]

Having negotiated the Garrison flight this afternoon I can confirm that not all locks are 7ft wide! Neither, it seems is it necessary to equip them with paddles that work!

 

Tony.

 

Strewth - I'm glad we decided to go via Aston locks a couple of weeks ago!

 

Tim