Flushing Toilets?

[stuart]

Probably get laughed at for suggesting this but...

 

Is it possible to fit a "normal" toilet onto a narrow boat? And just flush the waste into a tank?

 

I know the water usage would be high - but would it work?

 

Toilets very simple systems and as long as the cystern is full then it should flush - if the boat is level.

[nbtafelberg]

This is called a "Pump out toilet"

 

But you don't want to fit a "normal" toiilet unless you have a HUUUGGGEE water tank.

[timboharticus]

 

I was thinking about this. A 25 gallon plastic tank from Wickes is £25.

 

A macerator loo is £250

 

A submersible pump tolerant to solids is £80

 

If you really wanted to install this with vent pipes , baffles etc.

 

Total cost c. £400 ish.

 

Seems a lot to me.

 

I am pretty basic.

[ChrisPy]

 

I was thinking about this. A 25 gallon plastic tank from Wickes is £25.

 

A macerator loo is £250

 

A submersible pump tolerant to solids is £80

 

If you really wanted to install this with vent pipes , baffles etc.

 

Total cost c. £400 ish.

 

Seems a lot to me.

 

I am pretty basic.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

plus the cost of very frequent pump-outs. Oww!

Edited October 16, 2004 by chris polley

[Bernie]

A 25 gallon tank is not really very big for PO loo with the amount of water needed for a flush each time you use it and a domestic type toilet would inevitably use more water. If you really want to be basic why not a porta potti or cassette toilet. Even though they would need emptying frequently the cost is minimal, you would only pay the initial cost for the loo and then elsan blue if you use it. PO can cost anywhere from £8-£15 each time. We have a 75 gallon holding tank and this needs emptying every 10 to 14 days.

[stuart]

Do 'normal' boat toilets have a built in macerator before 'hitting' the tank??

 

With a pump out toilet, does the boat have the pump or is it at the canal side?

 

Where do you normally site the pump/pipe connection - outside the boat or inside?

[Bernie]

Do 'normal' boat toilets have a built in macerator before 'hitting' the tank??

 

Yes if you do have one with a macerator, but many don't have them.  

 

With a pump out toilet, does the boat have the pump or is it at the canal side?

 

At various places canal side, or boatyards.

 

Where do you normally site the pump/pipe connection - outside the boat or inside?

 

Outside the boat either on the gunwhale or I have seen one sited on the roof so it is easier to PO from both sides.

 

Bernie.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Also have a look here http://www.leesan.co.uk/ this will give all the information that you possibly could need.

There is also a self PO kit that you can purchase which costs around £200 and can be used at most Elsan stations, but this is bl***y hard work although it can pay for itself in about a year.

[Paul Evans]

It looks as though we need a "Toilet Talk" article in the New To Boating section. Who is going to 'fess up and plunge right in?

 

But whilst I'm here, why not mount a small diesel pump in the engine room which could be used for self-pump outs and save all the hard work involved with those manual kits? When I've seen folk using them I'm just grateful that I've got a Thetford Cassette.

Edited October 16, 2004 by Paul Evans

[John Orentas]

Paul.

 

There is a lot to be said for pump out toilets, with the sort of useage my boat gets, and it is not un-typical, I only need 2 or 3 pump outs per year and at £8 to £13 pounds a time I can live with that. When I built my boat I had a tank constructed of more than double the average size on the grounds that no one is going to notice, and they havn't.

 

I take the oposite view from you, when I see people humping casettes around, I am glad I have a pump out.

 

I have often thought about building a DIY system, but with a 12v motor driving it, but for 3 times a year I can't be bothered.

 

John Squeers

[timboharticus]

My thinking above was to have a 240V submersible pump (Machine Mart catalogue)

Which could be used to pump out.This is why I suggested a macerator loo, although this may not be necessary.

 

I would be quite happy with a cassette etc.

But if one is entertaining the mother in law, a "proper" loo would be essential.

[ChrisPy]

My thinking above was to have a 240V submersible pump (Machine Mart catalogue)

Which could be used to pump out.This is why I suggested a macerator loo, although this may not be necessary.

 

I would be quite happy with a cassette etc.

But if one is entertaining the mother in law, a "proper" loo would be essential.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

good reason not to have a flushing loo, I would have thought!

[John Orentas]

You already have a perfectly good pump on your boat. With a bit of temporary swapping around of pipes your water pump may do the job quite addequately.

 

 

John Squeers

[ChrisPy]

You already have a perfectly good pump on your boat.  With a bit of temporary swapping around of pipes your water pump may do the job quite addequately.

John Squeers

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mister Squeers, now you're making it complicated.

why swap the pipes?

with an interlinked set of electrically actuated isolating valves it's as easy as flicking a switch.

just need a few safeguards to prevent backflows, cross contamination, sterilisation, water sampling and testing on-line, etc.

Nothing that a competent instrument technician and a process engineer couldn't fix up in a long weekend.

[timboharticus]

Perhaps we should get back to the days of the boatman's cabin.

 

A minimal living space, the rest of the boat dedicated to acting as a holding tank.

[John Orentas]

Chris.

 

You are quite right, I don't know what I was thinking of, your scheme is much better. May I suggest though, as the system reverts to fresh water mode an automatic injection into the flow of a Typhoid serum may be of benefit.

 

John Squeers

Edited October 18, 2004 by John Orentas

[Richard Bustens]

John I dont believe im'e reading this right, are you advocating the use of the fresh water pump for pumping out the waste??

[ChrisPy]

John I dont believe im'e reading this right, are you advocating the use of the fresh water pump for pumping out the waste??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

why not?

[John Orentas]

Well why not, in the early years of the canals there were no canalside water taps, they used a dipper to get canal water for washing and drinking. A few micro-organisms, never did them any harm.

 

John Squeers

[Bob.Doubles]

I've studied this in depth, so a few observations.

 

I find it odd that people will spend best part of 100 grand on a boat but seem happy to have a cassette toilet - and thus be seen walking around the towpath carrying a suitcase full of s**t! Odd.

 

And you can always tell people doing a manual pump-out because of the dreadfully embarassed looks on their faces - and you know why when as you walk towards them the stink hits you at 30 yards! I'm sticking to the boatyard job, although I'm pretty keen on the self-service pump-outs that are around - the cheapest we've found is 6 pounds.

 

Another thing, I have a remote tank and don't use blue stuff, but I never get a reduced rate! Justice for non-blue users, I say.

[Paul Evans]

"I've studied this in depth" - Was that at arm's length?

 

Cassettes have the advantage of cheapness - you can empty them more frequently than pump-outs and do it for nothing. You can carry a spare empty casstte - try carrying a spare pump-out tank - and if push really comes to shove you can find a dark corner in a field, dig a hole and provide fertiliser (I deny saying that and certainly do not admit to having done it).

 

Having said that, when (if) I change boats, I will be looking for one with a pump out 'cos it's always me that gets to stagger around with a tank full of s**t!

[Richard Bustens]

Well John and Chris

I will spend another £100 and get a seporate pump.

I dont belive you said that, and i defenatly dont belive you do it !!!.

[John Orentas]

Richard.

 

Well I didn't start it !

 

John Squeers

[Cussy]

Another thing, I have a remote tank and don't use blue stuff, but I never get a reduced rate! Justice for non-blue users, I say.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I presume "remote" means not directly under the cistern. Why does that make a difference to the "Blue Stuff". I thought the blue stuff was put into every pump out tank to get the chemical reaction going and keep it sweet?

[Oliver]

I'm with Bob.doubles on this one. Spent quite a lot of time making the loo decision for our boat. Cassette toilets were a no no from the start.

 

It came down to a choice between a macerator and a vacuum extractor. One builder pushed the vacuum extractors really strongly - his view was that they they used far less water than any other loo so you would need a lot less pump outs.

 

We are having 2 loos on board and vacuum extractors would have added between £1,000 and £1,500 to the price - that's an awful lot of extra pumpouts and it's not as if we were going to be living on board.

 

Regarding the 'blue'. If you speak with Lee Sanitation they will tell you not to use 'blue' but to leave everything natural. With a microvent on the remote holding tank you shouldn't get any smells. They also recommend that you don't put any bleach or anything down the loo, just use white vinegar for cleansing.

[John Orentas]

Cussy.

 

There are other products that can be used instead of Blue, from little tablets to liquids in fancy bottles, obviously you have to tell the pump-out chap not to put his stuff in the tank. I think I must have tried them all.

 

It is a strange thing, they all work far better than the Blue stuff when you first try them, but as time passes they seem to lose effectiveness.

 

I'm back on Blue.

 

John Squeers