Any CC'ers on the Brecon-Monmouth canal?

[Alan de Enfield]

11 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

That's the bit that gets misunderstood the most.

 

CRT actually said "a range of less than 20 miles will not satisfy us" and all the usual chancers immediately decided that 20 miles and an inch was enough. 

 

Still quite difficult to achieve by staying on a 16 mile canal though!

 

 

 

Not if you read the guidance in the way that suits your self rather than the way it is written

 

A "RANGE" of 20 miles does not mean travelling 20 miles per annum, and it certainly cannot be achieved on the G&S so everyboat without a home mooring is at risk of enforcement irrespective of what they, or the "Baton Twirlers", think.

 

From an email by the Enforcement manager :

 

 

“When we are looking at boat movements we are looking for characteristics of bona fide navigation, these fall roughly into four categories:

· Range: by range we mean the furthest points a boat has travelled on the network, not merely the total distance travelled. While the BW act does not stipulate what that distance is the Trust has previously said that anyone travelling a range of less than say 20 miles (32km) would struggle to satisfy the Trust that they are engaged in bona fide navigation and that normally we would expect a greater range.

. For the avoidance of doubt, a small number of long journeys over a short period of time, followed or preceded by cruising in a small are of the network would not generally satisfy the Trust that you are engaged in bona fide navigation.

· Overstaying: we look to see how often boats overstay, either the 14 day limit on the main length of the canal, or shorter periods where local signage dictates, for example short stay visitor moorings.

While we are flexible with the occasional overstay from most boaters due to breakdown, illness or other emergencies, we will look at the overall pattern balanced with range and movement pattern in order to form a view.

Overstay reminders are issued when a boat is seen in the same area for more than 14 days. While we are unable to say how far you need to travel each time you move, we would advise that you normally travel further than a few km each time.

This will prevent you from getting reminders and depending on the length of other trips you make and how many times you turn back on yourself, should increase your overall range over the course of your licence.

· Movement: Continuous Cruiser Licences are intended for bona fide (genuine) navigation around the network, rather than for a boat to remain in one mooring spot, place neighbourhood or area.

We would expect boats on these licences to move around the network such that they don’t gravitate back to favoured areas too often i.e. in a way that it’s clear to us that they’re living in a small area of the waterway.

The basic principle of this is that these licences are not intended for living in an area and if it looks like a boat is habitually returning to a particular part of the waterway then this would not generally satisfy the Trust.

Within an acceptable range we’d expect a genuine movement, so for example it would not satisfy the Trust if a boat went on a 60 mile trip during the course of say two weeks, then returned to cruise in an area of say 5 miles the remainder of the time (figures are examples only).

Generally speaking, the smaller the range the less we’d expect to see boats back at the same locations. Of course people need to turn around and they’re perfectly free to re-visit places they have been to before, it’s living in a small area on this kind of licence that would cause a problem.

[LB1982]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Not if you read the guidance in the way that suits your self rather than the way it is written

 

A "RANGE" of 20 miles does not mean travelling 20 miles per annum, and it certainly cannot be achieved on the G&S so everyboat without a home mooring is at risk of enforcement irrespective of what they, or the "Baton Twirlers", think.

 

From an email by the Enforcement manager :

 

 

“When we are looking at boat movements we are looking for characteristics of bona fide navigation, these fall roughly into four categories:

· Range: by range we mean the furthest points a boat has travelled on the network, not merely the total distance travelled. While the BW act does not stipulate what that distance is the Trust has previously said that anyone travelling a range of less than say 20 miles (32km) would struggle to satisfy the Trust that they are engaged in bona fide navigation and that normally we would expect a greater range.

. For the avoidance of doubt, a small number of long journeys over a short period of time, followed or preceded by cruising in a small are of the network would not generally satisfy the Trust that you are engaged in bona fide navigation.

· Overstaying: we look to see how often boats overstay, either the 14 day limit on the main length of the canal, or shorter periods where local signage dictates, for example short stay visitor moorings.

While we are flexible with the occasional overstay from most boaters due to breakdown, illness or other emergencies, we will look at the overall pattern balanced with range and movement pattern in order to form a view.

Overstay reminders are issued when a boat is seen in the same area for more than 14 days. While we are unable to say how far you need to travel each time you move, we would advise that you normally travel further than a few km each time.

This will prevent you from getting reminders and depending on the length of other trips you make and how many times you turn back on yourself, should increase your overall range over the course of your licence.

· Movement: Continuous Cruiser Licences are intended for bona fide (genuine) navigation around the network, rather than for a boat to remain in one mooring spot, place neighbourhood or area.

We would expect boats on these licences to move around the network such that they don’t gravitate back to favoured areas too often i.e. in a way that it’s clear to us that they’re living in a small area of the waterway.

The basic principle of this is that these licences are not intended for living in an area and if it looks like a boat is habitually returning to a particular part of the waterway then this would not generally satisfy the Trust.

Within an acceptable range we’d expect a genuine movement, so for example it would not satisfy the Trust if a boat went on a 60 mile trip during the course of say two weeks, then returned to cruise in an area of say 5 miles the remainder of the time (figures are examples only).

Generally speaking, the smaller the range the less we’d expect to see boats back at the same locations. Of course people need to turn around and they’re perfectly free to re-visit places they have been to before, it’s living in a small area on this kind of licence that would cause a problem.

This is interesting because I emailed crt and they replied that I could easily satisfying their requirements on the mon-brec canal. 

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, LB1982 said:

This is interesting because I emailed crt and they replied that I could easily satisfying their requirements on the mon-brec canal. 

 

Good job you got it in writing - save it for the court case. 😥

 

You should be 'OK' as the Mon & Brec is ~30 miles so as long as you are seen at both ends of the canal, daft as it seems and against all reasonable peoples idea of  CCing you should not come under enforcement. 

 

As has been said, C&RT may not be happy even at above 20 miles range per annum if your history is one of litttle or no movement.

[David Mack]

The Mon and Brec is 34 miles long, so comfortably over the 20 mile guideline figure. It is also an isolated waterway, so going beyond that 34 miles is not straightforward. By contrast the G& S is 16 miles long, so less than the 20 mile figure, and it is connected to other waterways* so it is straightforward to range beyond the extents of the G&S.

 

* Narrow boats have over 1000 miles of connected waterway available, and even wide boats can go up to Stourport - or Stratford if the buy an Avon licence. And that is all without using the tidal Severn below Sharpness.