Neil2

So doesn't that suggest that at canal speeds - and when passing through locks, moored boats etc, the power consumption of the electric powered boat will be noticeably lower than a diesel equivalent? (I thought you were arguing that there's not much in it.) The question is how much lower the power requirements are - Keith M was suggesting electric is maybe a third of diesel. I presume he is something to do with "Motherships" as the figures/examples he quoted are the same as they publish on their website.

If you could bear with those of us who don't have a technical background Keith - could you explain how the torque characteristics of an electric motor make such a difference? Is it simply because you can fit a much bigger prop than you could for the equivalent power diesel engine?

@Keith M I wonder if you give us a few more details about your boat, ie how long, displacement, draught. The figures you quote are way below what most of us assume a typical narrowboat might need, so I wonder if you have a particularly light boat, or if there is something else about it that makes it much more efficient through the water. You are making some pretty groundbreaking claims which would completely change my views of electric power on narrowboats, and probably most folk on this forum. It isn't surprising if we are a little sceptical.

I had to draw a diagram of that before I could understand it! But yes, the horse on the left passes under the tow rope of the approaching horse. So, we have a potential chicken and egg situation here. What if the custom of "driving" on the left was already well established by the time of the canals, so that dictated that canal boats must pass port to port? Alternatively, could it be that the maritime custom of passing on the right was transferred to canals, and this dictated that horses pass on the left, and this is the reason we drive on the left today? Or, do I have too much spare time these days..?

From what I can remember Debdale is awful if you have dogs as it's metal pontoons and you could be a long way from the main jetty. I seem to recall there is a paucity of water points too. Plus it's a pain to get to (by road). The positive side is state of the art hull maintenance on site. And a well respected shell builder operates from there too (Andycraft).

No that's a fair point, I could have chosen a better title I suppose.

Yes I knew Paul when he was working there and living on his ancient boat. Sadly his wife died shortly after they returned to the UK. He bought a Hudson and does helmsman training now, so I understand.

That sounds acutely familiar... Many decades ago we bought our first house, an early 19th century mill cottage. Four years late when we sold it I said I would never, ever, buy an old house again. Now we live in what was a late 18th century former coaching inn, usually surrounded by scaffolding and is one of the reasons we don't have a boat anymore...

I haven't been active on CWDF for quite a while, one reason being that we sold our boat a while ago. But when I did start looking at the forum again I notice that quite a few members are now boat-less, and others who seemed committed to the liveaboard lifestyle have now returned to dry land. I know why why decided to leave the cut, but I'm interested in the reason(s) why others have done so.

We spent several years at Calcutt, with dogs, and never had a problem but we were on the "old" part of the marina where the pontoons are wood or at least they used to be. I don't like the new part at all and less so if they have metal pontoons. The other advantage of the old section is in many cases you can get your car right up to the boat, so useful in many ways. Being a "working" marina my feeling is Calcutt are more tolerant of DIY-ing, subject to common sense considerations. I would probably go back there, but the last time we visited the atmosphere among the staff had changed significantly and not for the better. Most of the old faces I remember had left, my view is that they have let a lot of good people go elsewhere. I think I'm right in saying Roger's son pretty much runs things these days. I notice Ian's boat is up for sale - does anyone know why? Is he leaving/has he left too?

Oh believe me, I understand "Government speak". I used to be a policy officer in a large local government department. I was responsible for writing stuff like this and I know the difference between specific targets and meaningless waffle, which this government is becoming depressingly good at.

Back of a beer mat calculation I reckon you might get 2 coats out of 10litres esp. if you thin the first coat. You need it to be at least 5 degrees c air temp, possible in November but not guaranteed. Biggest problem might be getting the hull to dry after pressure washing. You could save a bit of money by using something like Black Jack rather than a "marine" product, that way if you do have to do it again next year it won't have cost too much. I'm not convinced there's much of a difference anyway.

Another great suggestion. The only reservation I have is that Bosley seems to have become a bit "stressful" these days. With all the extra moving boats there seems to be at the moment the flight has become a bit of a bottleneck, and this year we found tempers were getting a bit frayed. On the plus side there is more often than not a vlockie or two.

I seem to remember in Nigel Calder's "Mechanical & Electrical Manual" he says something along the lines of you could do much worse than buy batteries on weight ie just get the heaviest... Our village golf club has a few electric carts, and the batteries they use are incredibly heavy - I reckon they would be a good choice.

1975 I believe. I can't remember what year it was but not too long ago we had occasion to moor outside Tesco's when the festival was on, and to my dismay I learned that the headline act was Mumford & Sons. How did we get from Hawkwind, Wishbone Ash, Rory Gallagher, The Ramones, etc. to bleedin' Mumford & Sons..?

The best way to buy batteries is probably the same as most things - by personal recommendation. If someone you know/trust thinks these are a bargain then buy them. There has been a lot of discussion on this subject over the years. FWIW my personal conclusion is buy cheap batteries which may wear out quicker than more expensive types but it's more economic in the long run. There is also the consideration that to derive the benefit of expensive batteries you have to be certain of keeping the boat for many years. As for "maintenance free" well you really need to be looking at AGM or gel batteries which are much more expensive. As others have said these sealed batteries are just that, wet batteries with no facility for checking/topping up. But, the problem with so many boats is the batteries ore often squirrelled away somewhere where it's damn near impossible to check them, so these sealed batteries are often the only practical choice.

This is why I reckon they need to go somewhere quiet - the worst thing for a novice would be trying to squeeze through Braunston on a busy day ie anytime. The Shropshire Union is usually pretty quiet and if you hired from Chas Hardern or Anglo Welsh you could get to experience wide and narrow locks - and a staircase - within a few days.

I think people make this assumption because domestic systems use microbore pipe which does need a powerful circulating pump. But there's no reason why, on a boat, the pipework shouldn't be sized to keep the power requirements low. I do wonder though if you actually have enough floor space in the typical narrowboat, with a high proportion of floor taken up with storage, furniture etc. It would definitely work in a widebeam I think.

Jacksons Leisure might be worth a try.

I think you could do it with one of those systems where the pipes sit in the floor rather than underneath it, you would lose a certain amount of headroom but not much. I think it could work but you would have to carefully examine the power requirements. My personal objection would be that having more plumbing than absolutely necessary on a boat is a bad idea.

If you wanted to be charitable to this government, and I personally don't... But you could argue that what they are doing is a sort of "friendly persuasion", flagging up the issues which yes we should all be rightly concerned about, and then maybe enough of us will decide to do the right thing and look at alternatives to fossil fuels. But the problem is - as highlighted in another current thread - whether it's new build or retro fitting, converting to electric propulsion or some form of hybrid system is horrifically expensive and the industry is a long way from developing a truly financially viable system. Electric power really is a rich man's game at the moment, unless you have enough skill and knowledge to DIY but that's probably less a than 1% of canal boaters.