Barge Style Narrowboats

[avendagold]

Hi all,

 

I've been looking around for a narrowboat and have been pointed in the direction of barge style narrowboats. Not having seen one in the flesh, only in pictures, it would appear that there are no practical issues with these barge style narrowboats and they can cruise on any canal, fir into any lock and cost the same as any other narrowboat to moor.

 

Is this right? Surely if you get more room inside there must be some kind of restrictions that I'm missing.

 

Thanks in advance

[tony collins]

Hi all,

 

I've been looking around for a narrowboat and have been pointed in the direction of barge style narrowboats. Not having seen one in the flesh, only in pictures, it would appear that there are no practical issues with these barge style narrowboats and they can cruise on any canal, fir into any lock and cost the same as any other narrowboat to moor.

 

Is this right? Surely if you get more room inside there must be some kind of restrictions that I'm missing.

 

Thanks in advance

 

The "square" superstructure can be an impedance in tunnels and the smaller bridges on narrow canals. If you were to look for a wide beam boat you will find that a widebeam "narrowboat" is much cheaper that the "Dutch Barge" equivalent, but does lack the style of the latter.

 

Tony

[John Orentas]

Hi Avendagold.

 

I wasn't quite sure what you meant by 'barge style' but if Tony is correct in assuming it to be the more utilitarian design, I would certainly agree with him that there is little or nothing to be gained, the 'tumblehome' of the cabin sides is a positive advantage allowing clearance through bridges and other obstructions and the extra space never feels apparent inside the boat.

 

But most of all, with boats of all kinds the aesthetics should never be ignored, if I was to be very rude I would say that a builder who produces such boats does so because he lacks the expertise to do anything better and the people who are tempted to buy one possibly for reasons of cost saving will very soon regret their decision.

Edited June 23, 2007 by John Orentas

[fender]

Hi Avendagold.

 

I wasn't quite sure what you meant by 'barge style' but if Tony is correct in assuming it to be the more utilitarian design

 

 

Perhaps these barge style boats should be known as 'Jeremy Benthams'?

[drunkensailor]

Do you mean one of those narrowboats that's designed to look a bit like a dutch barge, with a wheelhouse?

 

I saw one yesterday when walking my dog along the K&A. Cheap and poorly constructed weren't words I'd use to describe it.

 

If that's what you mean, I suppose it'd be quite a nice boat to live on, and having the wheelhouse is a bit of extra room to play with, but I don't think I'd have one. It was a nice boat, but the bottom line was to me it looked funny, and I shudder to think what such an unusual boat cost to make.

 

Drifter has a pram hood which would have cost far less to make, and gives you all the advantages, as well as being quicker to take down on the way to a tunnel.

 

Incidentally, if you just mean a boat with a square superstructure, I agree with the others. The space you lose isn't useable space, and it would make one ugly looking boat.

Edited June 23, 2007 by drunkensailor

[tony collins]

sorry incorrect post - thus edit.

Edited June 24, 2007 by tony collins

[John Orentas]

Do you mean one of those narrowboats that's designed to look a bit like a dutch barge, with a wheelhouse?

I saw one yesterday when walking my dog along the K&A. Cheap and poorly constructed weren't words I'd use to describe it.

 

 

I think we all know the kind of boat that Avendagold is referring to and it is not the Dutch barge style. Vertical cabin sided, the minimum of shape in all elevations. Looks as though someone has had a crack at building a boat in his back garden with no more than a verbal description from his mate in the pub.

[cheshire~rose]

I know Ledgard Boats make a barge style narrowboat. Whilst I know its all a matter of taste I find their boats look quite attractive and would find it hard to attribute any of the derogatory comments being used to describe what people are suggesting to be barge style narrow boats with the boats that Legard produce.

 

There is a photo on their website and you might like to view the slideshow which shows several different barge style narrowboats from different angles;

 

http://www.ledgardbridge.com/html/barge_style_video.htm

 

Of course I cannot comment on how they perform through bridge holes etc. I was just quite confused by people referring to things that sound a bit 'Heath Robinson' when in my personal opinion these boats look anything but.

 

I suspect like any other boats, there will always be some that get people scratching their heads and asking why bother!

 

Edited because I can never get the links to work! sorry guys just cut and paste it into your browser please

Edited June 24, 2007 by cheshire~rose

[Gary Peacock]

The problem with the ditch crawler building game is that whatever you build it tends to be in the builders opinion the greatest thing going but that's a lot to do with selling the things.

 

When recreational ditch crawling was booming we built lot's of "traditional types" of narrowboats then when residential began to take over from recreational we built a lot of "Barge style" narrowboats.

Now the full order book is broad and all bound for France.

Times change and trends change.

 

The strange thing about barge style boats and bridges I never got is that if they have the same or less air draft than a traditional ditch crawler along with the same width at deck/coach roof height why do they have problems with bridges?

 

Or maybe someone is building them who didn't think about how to achieve that?

 

You do get some extra space plus and for some reason they do feel roomier but if you're of the Rosie & Jim inclination they probably aren't the boat for you.

 

 

 

The Barge Styles we built mostly didn't have wheelhouses I always liked this red one-

 

 

 

But if you had plenty of money you could have a wheelhouse like this (£14K for the top bit alone!)

 

 

 

This wasn't really a barge style but was one of the more strange variations on a theme we did-

 

 

Does anybody know where it is because I haven't herd anything about it since it left?

 

At the end of the day you pay your money you make your choices! If you go to a boat builder who tells you that you should have a particular style because they aren't capable of building anything else then they probably aren't the best choice.

[John Orentas]

Hi Gary.

 

"The strange thing about barge style boats and bridges I never got is that if they have the same or less air draft than a traditional ditch crawler along with the same width at deck/coach roof height why do they have problems with bridges?"

 

As most canals tend to have arch construction bridges, seems sensible to have arch construction roof-lines to fit.

[Gary Peacock]

Hi Gary.

 

"The strange thing about barge style boats and bridges I never got is that if they have the same or less air draft than a traditional ditch crawler along with the same width at deck/coach roof height why do they have problems with bridges?"

 

As most canals tend to have arch construction bridges, seems sensible to have arch construction roof-lines to fit.

 

Surely if it's the same height and width at its highest point but actually narrower at the base of the side sheet it should fit easier then?

[Gary Peacock]

Whoops wrong thread!

Edited June 25, 2007 by Gary Peacock

[drunkensailor]

This wasn't really a barge style but was one of the more strange variations on a theme we did-

 

 

Does anybody know where it is because I haven't herd anything about it since it left?

 

At the end of the day you pay your money you make your choices! If you go to a boat builder who tells you that you should have a particular style because they aren't capable of building anything else then they probably aren't the best choice.

That was exactly like the boat I saw on the K&A the other night. This was white though.

 

Like I say, seemed extremely well finished.

[David Schweizer]

Dave Thomas at Braunston builds a very attractive Dutch Barge style Narrowboat, which is based upon an original design from Balliol Fowden. There is a picture of one on his website here:- http://www.davidthomas-boatbuilder.co.uk/ click on the picture and it will enlarge.

Edited June 25, 2007 by David Schweizer

[carlt]

 

Does anybody know where it is because I haven't herd anything about it since it left?

 

At the end of the day you pay your money you make your choices! If you go to a boat builder who tells you that you should have a particular style because they aren't capable of building anything else then they probably aren't the best choice.

 

Seems strange having the steam plant at the front. Never mind the cabin sides, I bet that funnel is a nightmare at bridges.

Edited June 25, 2007 by carlt

[Gary Peacock]

Seems strange having the steam plant at the front. Never mind the cabin sides, I bet that funnel is a nightmare at bridges.

 

Twin stacks complete with spark arrestors!

[DHutch]

Twin stacks complete with spark arrestors!

Haha, indeed!

[DHutch]

On a more back-to-topic slant, EmilyAnne is what i describe as a 'dutch-barge-style-narrowboat'.

- Personally i think she is one of the nicer examples of such a craft i have yet to see. And i think its a very nice shape as well, and if nothing else its nice to have something a little diffrent about it too.

- In terms of practicality the shape doesnt really cause too many problems, we often joke that 'theres a reason why narrowboats are the shape they are' but in all honesty its not a big deal.

 

The cabin shape is certianly not a issue for us. The vertical sides make it feel bigger inside, and means that curtains work. The walkway down the gunnels are wider and safer to walk on, as well as being higher so that there is space above kitchen worktops. Also as she is slightly deeper draughted, the overall hight of the cabin roof can be bought down a little lower while still maintaining good headroom, so shes actaully a less tight fit though many tunnels that a more 'tranditional' shaped cabin. Certainly the harecastle is a breeze, and we plan to do standedge this year.

 

It terms of the rest of the hull shape, although largly visual affect, the high fordeck allows the forward bed stick under it a little, as well as adding valuable storage space as well. And the vertical stem (front end) also mildly increases the space in the bow, making room for a pair of batterys in the space infront of the bowthruster tube and watertank.

- The stern shape we have also works well for us being a nice space to sit out like a cruser stern deck, with then also the wheelhouse ontop of that, which is quite simualar to a semi-trad setup, only with an optional hard-top for when it raining and the bridges allow.

 

We do have to have the wheelhouse down for most narrowcanals to fit under the bridges, but assuming its sunny, that actaully the best place for it. And if you on a wide canal and its pouring it down, you get a terrably smug feeling when you pull into a lock with a shivering kagool covered mess at the helm of the other boat!

- And with two of you you can take our wheelhouse down inside of a minute, and get it pack up in the same time again.

 

The only other thing to mention is the curved shear-line noticeable along the lenght of the boat, both at gunnel level, and to a less extent along the cabin top. While only slight, for me it is one of the really lovely parts of a dutch-style boat, sadly missing from many.

 

 

Here are a few photos:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And one of another d-b-s-nb near trentlock

- Roger fullers done a nice one as well, but i cant seem to find a photo of it just yet.

 

 

But yeah, hopfully some part of thats usefull, feel free to ask an other questions anyway.

 

 

Daniel

[avendagold]

Thanks, all the feedback has been great, and the pics have helped a lot too. It's been great to see the different opinions coming to the fore from boat builders which has helped me understand what these boats are. I have come to the following conclusions:

 

-barge style narrow boats are uncool in the boating world! Somewhere between a normal narrowboat and widebeams (the 4x4s of the canals)

-barge style narrow boats have a bit more space - which is good for me because I need more head space

-they fit under bridges

-barge style narrow boats can be badly or well built so choose wisely

 

I'm going to view boats this Friday to Sunday. I live just north of London and everything seems to be "up North". I'm going to find these barge style boats and see for myself what kind of space gain there actually is. When you are 6'6" it's amazing how loads of room can turn into a low ceiling and cramped space.

 

thanks for the feedback and I might start new thread on my return.

 

Avendagold

[Chris J W]

You could have a look at Carpathia currently at High Line on The Iver.

 

[DHutch]

Yeah, i have seen another boat which is very simuar to Carpathia moored at travelreign near anderton.

- Having posted a photo of it on here a while back i now beleave that they have wet-ballest tanks in the stern to get the wheelhouse under low bridges. Rather than have it fold. Not the most attractive narrowboat tho.

 

 

Daniel

[Callunna]

I live just north of London and everything seems to be "up North".

 

We're after a widebeam - but all the secondhand ones seem to be down South! (We live on Yorks/Lancs border).

 

Saw one advertised on here by a Canal World member (that's how I've happened to join this utterly insane community) which would suit us down to the, er, ground (should that read 'water level'?) except that it was 14ft 2in wide. Grr! Just a tad too wide to squeeze through the L&L locks - unless anybody knows different?

 

I didn't realise dutch style barges were uncool - but I've been uncool all my life so I suppose it doesn't matter. We're going to liveaboard so I'm afraid comfort comes above image in this case.

[DHutch]

We're not blood uncool. Trend setters i'd say.

- I give it 10 years tops, and everyone will be as unique as us!

 

 

 

Daniel

[Gary Peacock]

For those who like Barge Style narrowboats there are plenty of pictures of "Basingstoke" on the owners picture diary HERE.

 

[interleaf2]

Gary's company has built a number of attractive barge style narrowboats and he provides an extensive range of pictures at the Ledgard Bridge web site www.ledgardbridge.com.

 

I think these are going to become more popular over the coming years as the residential demand grows.

 

Here are a few examples from other builders:

 

David Thomas

 

Jonathan Wilson / Gary Gorton:

 

Sagar Marine:

 

Roger Fuller:

 

And of course there is Emily Anne with many pictures on this forum.

 

I think these are all very cool, albeit untraditional. Just my 2 cents.