Calling all boatbuilders

[onionbargee]

Hello; i'm a retired welder/ fabricator, and i fancy building my own narrowboat, i don't want to finish up with a floating skip ( springer ! ) so if there's any one out there can give some tips, like how to get the counter side plate bent round evenly, and how to acheive the stern end of the backcabin roof, where it curves up and is also bowed. I'm also thinking about doing the sides with 8mm. Appreciate your help.

[John Orentas]

You can buy plans from Peter Hopley 0161 320 8023

 

Another has recently appeared in Waterways Word hdstufft@aol.com

[onionbargee]

Thanks, i will take a look, but i dont really need plans, as i'm drawing my own up.

[onionbargee]

Thanks, i will take a look, but i dont really need plans, as i'm drawing my own up.

[nigel carton]

Iv'e had two Springers, and I'll agree they might have been built in there day on a budget, I wouldn't regard them as floating skips! Its the homers that you wouldn't touch with a bargee pole. but good look with your project.

[foreigner]

 

What about this:

 

all steel under waterline 10 mm.

[tobytimothy]

How about speaking nicely to a steel narrowboat shell builder and offer them your services either free or cheaply in return for learning how to build one. You never know you may find one who will allow you to build yours on site at preferential terms!!

 

Anyway best of luck

[Gary Peacock]

Your more than welcome to visit us if you like!

No trade secrets and nothing to hide.

 

Gary

 

www.ledgardbridge-boatcompany.com

[gill]

I would get the plans as suggested and adapt to your plans, you will pick up the skills and ideas. You have to start somewhere

[Guest]

From what I saw of our shell being built, the difficult part might be getting plates folded/rolled etc. unless you know people still in the fabrication trade. The welding and cutting seemed to require very basic industrial mig welder and cutting gear. They seemed to have a fair few jigs to keep the shape constant during build, cutting window apertures etc. Another person we know who did build a lovely shell some time ago swore by one of those hydraulic "portapower?" ram things that you pump up maunually. He used this for many tasks. He did get the folding/rolling done at a local tanker buiders. Ironically his present boat was bought as a sailaway and he fitted it out himself.

p.s. don't be too hard on Springers-there are loads still about despite being somewhat thinner than new boats, and according to a couple of surveyors they still survey well if looked after. We are surrounded by them on our mooring so I have to be careful what I say.

Edited February 28, 2005 by stan hesketh

[Alan Saunders]

I would get the plans as suggested and adapt to your plans, you will pick up the skills and ideas. You have to start somewhere.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree.

 

I also recommend 'Steel Boat Building - From Plans to Launching' - Thomas E Colvin ISBN 1-888671-02-5. It covers building 'a 25 - 79 foot yacht or commercial vessel'. There's far more information than you need for a narrowboat.

 

I have never built a hull but I did once thoroughly investigate the possibility. To me, the main problem seems to be handling heavy steel sheets. Turning the baseplate over after you have welded the bottom side could be tricky; 1.5 - 3 tons in 10mm?

 

The smallest radius curves are on the sides at the bow and stern - 8mm plate will be more difficult to bend than 6mm.

 

Alan

[John Orentas]

You have not told us too much about yourself so it is a bit difficult to make a reply without sounding patronising or whatever.

 

You seem to be making light of the design element of the job in relation to the fabrication. In my experience the design is everything, I have seen so many expertly fabricated boats that look, in your words like floating skips. I have never known a builder working from his original design to get one 'right' until his 3rd or 4th attempt. The trick is to copy blatantly, you can bet that the most elegant boats being made today where originally cribbed from someone else and later refined.

 

There are as I am sure you are aware a lot of subtle curves and detail on a narrowboat shell, you omit or simplify these at your peril. The most difficult part to get right, which you did not mention is the transittion from the vertical section of the elliptical stern to the sloping hull side at gunnel level, to my mind this detail always marks the distinction between a quality boat and an average one. One more thing don't try to be innovative or original, you can be assured someone has already tried it, if it had worked all boats would have it.

 

I think you will struggle with 8mm hull sides unless you have access to some very heavy equipment, I would stick to 6mm and spend a bit more on steel quality. Go for a 12 or 15mm bottom-plate though.

Edited February 28, 2005 by John Orentas

[onionbargee]

your bit about sloping hull sides dont matter to me, my boat will have vertical sides, which are fine, Just ask Les Allen, and certainly not pre-folded gunwales, errgh !

I agree with you 100% about subtle curves and detail, i wont be overlooking these.I,m seeing alot of old boats needing doubling around the water line, which sais to me 6mm is not enoiugh on a 10mm bottom. I've got plans, and a boat to copy from.

[Alan Saunders]

. . . I,m seeing alot of old boats needing doubling around the water line, which sais to me 6mm is not enoiugh on a 10mm bottom.  . . .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I wonder why boat boat builders have not addressed the problem of corrosion on the water line? Perhaps they are unconcerned about the longevity of a boat? Perhaps people buying new are more than happy if it will last say 20 years? Or is John right; it has been tried?

 

Why not use 6mm sides and double at the water line from new? Either way if it corrodes you will still have an unsightly waterline. Why not design for a future doubling to avoid complications e.g increased beam or rubbing strakes crossing the water line?

 

Annual maintenance of the water line area is possible without docking and there have been good reports of epoxy tar finishes which were not used on those 'old boats'.

 

Alan

[John Orentas]

We can get carried away with this hull corrosion thing, as someone said it always looks far worse than it is. Steel is an excellent material for boats, it is strong, easy to work, resistant to penetration, it has one relatively minor fault, it rusts.

 

Just think of all those poor wretches out there who have wooden and plastic boats, they would give their ears to swap their problems for yours.

 

Just keep it painted and you will have no problems. Specifically addressing the waterline rusting, it is possible to repaint the area whilst it is still in the water, if you can get enough weight onto one side of the boat (45 gallon drums and an electric pump) to a get sufficient list you can grind off the rust and re-paint.

 

But really the problem 90% a cosmetic one, it is mostly in the mind.

 

PS. I have always wondered why no one has built a stainless steel boat, not as daft as it sounds, off the top of my head the material costs would be 3 or 4 times higher but then most of the cost of a shell is the labour content and remember you could reduce the steel thicknesses. Why don't we ask Gary for a ballpark price.

[awatsonbcp]

yes but dont forget jon to plug up any holes in the' lower 'side before doing this!!!!!

[David Schweizer]

Just keep it painted and you will have no problems.  Specifically addressing the waterline rusting, it is possible to repaint the area whilst it is still in the water, if you can get enough weight onto one side of the boat (45 gallon drums and an electric pump) to a get sufficient list you can grind off the rust and re-paint.

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Back in the (good old) days when there were hardly any public dry docks we used to black the hull waterline by tipping the boat sideways using long baulks of timber under the towpath side of the boat and ropes attached to the roof hand rails and pinned onto the oposite bank. this produced a 20 degree list which was sufficient for us to furiously black the water line before the next pair of working boats came along. In the seven years that I worked on the boat it never came out for a full hull blacking.

[Alan Saunders]

your bit about  sloping hull sides dont matter to me, my boat will have vertical sides, which are fine, Just ask Les Allen, and certainly not pre-folded gunwales, errgh ! . . .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Since you are a Les Allen fan why not build a replica of one of his? It has been done before see The Allen Register which also has a story, in words and pictures, of how they built a boat. It also says that the standard spec' in 1992 was 10/6/5 - a 12mm bottom was extra. I know of one built in 1984 that claims to be 10/8/5.

 

Alan

[onionbargee]

Now were talking !.... stainless hull, yes it would be very expensive, it would only need to be s/s up to the gunwales, you could then weld to steel cabin structure, one was made a few years ago by a water tank makers. But people don't tend to think that long term, you'll only get the benefit after 30 years, though the re-sale value will never change, hey this sounds good, i'm going to cost it up !

[onionbargee]

Oh ! now i know why no ones building in stainless, a 6mm x 2000 x 24m (70') baseplate costs £8400 ! and all 6mm s/s up to the waterline is a total of £16800 of metal !

 

I have filed that idea in the bin.

 

 

 

 

 

Now were talking !.... stainless hull, yes it would be very expensive, it would only need to be s/s up to the gunwales, you could then weld to steel cabin structure, one was made a few years ago by a water tank makers. But people don't tend to think that long term, you'll only get the benefit after 30 years, though the re-sale value will never change, hey this sounds good, i'm going to cost it up !

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[DHutch]

Aa total of £16800 of metal !

 

Yeah, lol.

[ChrisPy]

In theory stainless steel should not 'rust'. But in the wrong conditions it can suffer corrosion much more quickly and catastrophically than mild steel. Ask any salty about failure of deck fittings, crevice corrosion, etc.

 

the answer is, as always - KISS.