BW maintenance

[fender]

The news in Waterscape of the naming of BW boat, which is to maintain the waterways to a high standard, including clearing over 3,300 tonnes of rubbish each year (thats London I think)

 

OK so whats essential maintenance? A whole day dedicated to the painting of two square foot white panels? And then brewing cuppas for the rest of the day before returning to base at 4.00pm?

 

These things were described to me by a liveaboard the other week. I took a look at the two square foot panels and I'm sure I could have done that in 15 minutes! Is that maintaining the waterways to a high standard? Anyone have any other examples of BW staff 'not doing anything?'

 

Is that why the waterways are in a bad state? Yes I know waterways workers have always skived to an extent but is it getting worse?

Edited December 20, 2007 by fender

[carlt]

You're right about the wasted time and resources but if you give a gang a day's work and a week to do it then they'll drink a lot of tea. It happens in all industries and is avoided by good management of people, time and budget, something BW are completely inept at.

[Timleech]

You're right about the wasted time and resources but if you give a gang a day's work and a week to do it then they'll drink a lot of tea. It happens in all industries and is avoided by good management of people, time and budget, something BW are completely inept at.

 

A common complaint in recent times is that, although they are short of staff on the cut, they don't have the money to do some of the jobs which need doing and which would keep them properly employed.

Also there seems to be quite a lot of disillusion about the latest reorganisation, so soon after the previous one, and the feeling abroad that there may be something more 'in the wind'. I've been told by more than one BW crew that nowadays all they want to do is keep their heads down & their noses clean, do what they are told and collect their pay. Very little enthusiasm for the job now.

 

Yes of course there are those who swing the lead, working in small gangs miles from anywhere makes it much easier than some jobs, and there is sometimes (often?) weak, inefficient or misguided management, but there seems to be more to it than that at the moment.

 

Tim

[John Orentas]

Some time ago I was sat on an inter-city train on my way to London, across the isle two ladies of a certain age where gossipping away, they were on their way to visit a relative, one interrupted the intense conversation.. Look, look at that, they are always like that, every time you see them, bone idle all of them.. These two very stupid women were discussing a gang of workmen who were figuratively leaning on their shovels as a 100 mph train passes by.

 

I was reminded of that day a few minutes ago when reading Fender's comments, how easy it is to criticise others when you do not have the slightest idea of their job, anyone remember Prince Philip telling us all to 'pull our fingers out'.. There is something not very endearing about an ignorant parasite making derogatory remarks about the work-rate of others.

[carlt]

Fender's comments weren't necessarily a criticism of the workers John. When I worked for the council as a Highways engineer my job was to inspect the roads, order works required, manage my budget and supervise the gangs.

 

If I turned up to see a gang and they were sat in the wagons drinking tea it was because I hadn't managed their time effectively. They'd finished the job I'd given them.

 

This didn't happen very often (they were more often ringing me at the end of the day to negotiate overtime because I'd given them too much) but it does seem more apparent on the waterways.

 

This is down to poor management, and poor morale, as Tim says.

 

BW spend too much, doing not enough and that isn't the fault of the gangworkers.

[Guest]

Some time ago I was sat on an inter-city train on my way to London, across the isle two ladies of a certain age where gossipping away, they were on their way to visit a relative, one interrupted the intense conversation.. Look, look at that, they are always like that, every time you see them, bone idle all of them.. These two very stupid women were discussing a gang of workmen who were figuratively leaning on their shovels as a 100 mph train passes by.

 

I was reminded of that day a few minutes ago when reading Fender's comments, how easy it is to criticise others when you do not have the slightest idea of their job, anyone remember Prince Philip telling us all to 'pull our fingers out'.. There is something not very endearing about an ignorant parasite making derogatory remarks about the work-rate of others.

[WJM]

"but if you give a gang a day's work and a week to do it then they'll drink a lot of tea"

 

 

Piece Work - done by private sub-contractors employing Polish staff, that is the future of British industry, and the future of waterway maintenance!

 

(fuse lit, now standing well back)

 

 

---------------------------

 

That well known Greek man, Phillipos Gotha Saxe-Coburg?

Edited December 20, 2007 by WJM

[fender]

No I wasnt crititising the workers, but the apparent ease in which work doesnt get done. Its something that I think will get more crucial, or more scrutinsed, in light of the DEFRA cuts.

 

As for the track gangs, its a comment I've heard before, but people not familar with the railways do not know the safety aspects of working on the tracks and assume its just laziness.

Edited December 20, 2007 by fender

[Dave-Shrop]

Now with closure of local offices/dept Staff, supervisors, engineers and patrol staff have to travel many miles IE Northwich office to Autherley junction, will take 3 hrs+.

[Hobbler]

A lot of the guys on the bank are on barely above the minimum wage . In fact quite a few I know have had to take second jobs just to make ends meet . The annual staff surveys in recent years have shown that the ordinary staff have very little trust in or loyalty to the senior management and morale is at an all time low .

 

Its not really surprising that the bank staff are less than enthusiastic .

[blackrose]

My personal experience and opinion is that BW staff do a very good job and maintain things around here to a fairly high standard. Not all boaters share the views of the original poster. I don't recognise the negative characterisation of BW run waterways, nor do I accept the basic premise in the title of this thread.

Edited December 21, 2007 by blackrose

[fender]

I don't recognise the negative characterisation of BW run waterways

 

Not even the criticism from NABO, IWA, and other organisations on BW's moorings tenders? Not even the grumbles about BW at local user group meetings? That's just one small selection of possible examples on the negative characterisation of BW run waterways.

 

Maybe I've been dreaming and now turns out that everyone's actually been giving BW armfuls of bouquets!

[blackrose]

Not even the criticism from NABO, IWA, and other organisations on BW's moorings tenders? Not even the grumbles about BW at local user group meetings? That's just one small selection of possible examples on the negative characterisation of BW run waterways.

That's right, why should I go along with the views of other organisations when they run contrary to my own experience? These organisations obviously have their own axes to grind and mooring tenders are an entirely different subject, so why you raise it here I really don't understand. Confuse & conflate different issues if you must to support your own view, but I'm sorry I don't share your opinion.

 

Maybe I've been dreaming and now turns out that everyone's actually been giving BW armfuls of bouquets!

No, you haven't been dreaming Fender, you have your views and I have mine, so perhaps you should accept that some people have different but equally valid viewpoints and there's no need for sarcasm.

 

Edit: I haven't given my nearby BW mooring office or lockkeepers any bouquets but I will be popping a couple of Christmas cards through doors.

Edited December 21, 2007 by blackrose

[Guest]

An open invitation to anybody:

Come and wiew the lovely new BW offices at Wigan, then try and operate the locks outside of the windows of same. Bloody disgrace

[blackrose]

An open invitation to anybody:

Come and wiew the lovely new BW offices at Wigan, then try and operate the locks outside of the windows of same. Bloody disgrace

What's wrong with them exactly and have you been into the office to tell them?

[denboy]

What's wrong with them exactly and have you been into the office to tell them?

What whould be the point they havent got any money left to fix them after paying out 10k for the dog loos and the 80k for the "come to the canals drive"and im sure there is more wasted expenditure we will never hear about

Edited December 21, 2007 by denis boyle

[sueb]

What whould be the point they havent got any money left to fix them after paying out 10k for the dog loos and the 80k for the "come to the canals drive"and im sure there is more wasted expenditure we will never hear about

 

Talking to one BW worker, he told me that he was unable to do a lot of maintenance because he hadn't got up to date certificates. These are needed to work everything including power drills. BW can't afford to send him on courses and suggested he paid for his own. Guess his reply.

Sue

[denboy]

Thats probably true you need a certificate to go to the loo nowadays

health and safety gone mad ive got that many certs now i need a briefcase to carry them all

[carlt]

ive got that many certs now i need a briefcase to carry them all

I hope you've got the "materials handling" certificate, before lifting that briefcase!

[blackrose]

What whould be the point they havent got any money left to fix them after paying out 10k for the dog loos and the 80k for the "come to the canals drive"and im sure there is more wasted expenditure we will never hear about

 

Dear me, what incredibly negative & defeatist attitudes some of you have - it's no wonder nothing gets done!

 

BW fix everything around here as soon as we tell them about it, so I don't know why they wouldn't do the same in your areas?

 

Customer feedback is part of the maintenance process - if users can't be bothered to tell BW that something they're paying for isn't working, then why would they bother to fix it?

Edited December 21, 2007 by blackrose

[Guest]

What's wrong with them exactly and have you been into the office to tell them?

How long have you got..........

[blackrose]

How long have you got..........

 

I daresay I'll be on this forum for the forseeable future...

[denboy]

Dear me, what incredibly negative & defeatist attitudes some of you have - it's no wonder nothing gets done!

 

BW fix everything around here as soon as we tell them about it, so I don't know why they wouldn't do the same in your areas?

 

Customer feedback is part of the maintenance process - if users can't be bothered to tell BW that something they're paying for isn't working, then why would they bother to fix it?

How true maybe because they are always fixing things round your way they havent got time to deal with the rest of the system

i could send you the 20 odd emails ive sent over the last 4 years about meadow lane lock which has taken 5 years to fix, you must be located in a high visitor area were they need to keep up an appearance that every thing is running fine and dandy

[fender]

Blackrose, what about Clitheroe's Lock, I mean those damned ground paddles havent worked since when? Easter 2007? Its up your street. Its not the only lock in the London area that has waited months, or even years, to get a decent repair job done.

 

You say "BW fix everything around here as soon as we tell them about it..."

 

Does that for some reason not include Clitheroe's Lock??

[blackrose]

Blackrose, what about Clitheroe's Lock, I mean those damned ground paddles havent worked since when? Easter 2007? Its up your street. Its not the only lock in the London area that has waited months, or even years, to get a decent repair job done.

 

You say "BW fix everything around here as soon as we tell them about it..."

 

Does that for some reason not include Clitheroe's Lock??

 

Well, I haven't told them about it - have you?

 

Lock stoppages obviously take time to schedule and then boaters complain about that - they can't win.

 

Anyway, I get through clitheroes ok with the gate paddles - you have to be careful and it takes a bit longer but you talk as if it's some great hardship.

 

Come on people, we're talking industrial revolution technology here - if you want everything to work perfectly & smoothly I can't help thinking you've bought into the wrong hobby/lifestyle.

Edited December 22, 2007 by blackrose