Looking for a seagoing boat

[RichM]

I think I posted something similar before though I have been boatless for more than a year now but still don't know what my next boat will be. Ideally I'd want a boat that is suitable for predominantly river cruising but also more than capable of going out to sea for circa £30k or less.

 

The closest I've found is a cabin cruiser like the one below but there's a few things that put me off:

- Do I really need a 4.0+ litre petrol engine? Powerboating isn't really what I'm after

- Not much in the way of practicality/interior space

- More suited to sea rather than rivers

 

Appreciate this is perhaps not the most suited forum but I'm sure there's people who may have some idea as to the type of boat that may suitable,

 

Cheers

[Guest]

Something like this?

 

https://motorboats.apolloduck.co.uk/boat/sealine-305-statesman-for-sale/663269

[RichM]

9 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

Something like this?

 

https://motorboats.apolloduck.co.uk/boat/sealine-305-statesman-for-sale/663269

 

Thanks for the suggestion.

 

At a glance that looked perfect but perhaps a little too big and not sure about the idea of having two engines to maintain/service/fuel etc. Perhaps something a little smaller and maybe a little newer.

[Guest]

29 minutes ago, RichM said:

 

Thanks for the suggestion.

 

At a glance that looked perfect but perhaps a little too big and not sure about the idea of having two engines to maintain/service/fuel etc. Perhaps something a little smaller and maybe a little newer.

 

 

I suspect your budget may be ambitious but good look with your search.

 

https://jeanneau.apolloduck.co.uk/boat/jeanneau-merry-fisher-805-for-sale/660328

[Momac]

A Sealine S23 might just fit your description - single diesel engine

Anything bigger will be older or above your budget

Finding anything half decent that is for sale at the moment is a challenge 

https://www.nya.co.uk/boats-for-sale/sealine-s23-10/

 

 

 

[Naughty Cal]

You are not going to get a lot for £30k at the minute. Prices have gone through the roof.

 

If you can wait you would be better off waiting until next year when some of these Covid purchases have come back onto the market again.

 

We had a Sealine S23 for a long time which was powered by a KAD32 diesel engine. That was very much at home on the river as well as the sea and it was capable of canal cruising on the wider canals but it was a bit of a handful on the canals at lower speeds. 

 

Definitely go diesel if you are going to get that sort of boat. They do cost more to buy but they are cheaper to run and they do retain their value.

 

Also worth bearing in mind that the V6 and V8 petrol engines in some of these boats are very unlikely to be suitable for the new E10 fuel which is being rolled out soon.

 

Whatever boat you buy of this sort you need to factor in the maintenance costs. They are not cheap to maintain.

[Momac]

8 hours ago, RichM said:

 

Thanks for the suggestion.

 

At a glance that looked perfect but perhaps a little too big and not sure about the idea of having two engines to maintain/service/fuel etc. Perhaps something a little smaller and maybe a little newer.

I changed from a single engined 23ft to a twin engined 33ft and our fuel cost more or less doubled . But the boat handling is very much easier .

Service cost doubled for  consumables but it has encouraged me to DIY which saves a tidy sum on labour.

Fuel is not the biggest cost . Marina berthing fees are the greatest  expense.

Fuel cost on the river is not a big deal - at 5 knots maybe  4  litres per hour per diesel engine.. As said diesel is very much preferred for availability at the waterside.

Some sea trips are  not viable in a petrol boat as no refuelling is generally available at many marinas/harbours - depending where you expect to use the boat. 

[Tony Brooks]

Some of those "streamlined" boat hulls seem to be very dirty at river speeds, so whatever you get make sure you try it at sub-planing speed.

 

I think that with a bit of looking you would get a nice, but elderly, Seamaster/Meaks Madera 27 or Elysian 27 that are ideal for river and a bit of estuary work. However, for a lot of estuary  work you may need twin engines unless you can and do work the tides. Many have BMC 1.5s or Perkins 4-10x engines.

 

[Naughty Cal]

Also worth bearing in mind if you plan to keep the boat inland is access to the bow from the cockpit. A lot of the american boats have a walk through windscreen which we did not like. It gave you a wider cockpit but the scramble from the windscreen to the bow never felt very safe to us.

 

We preferred our UK boat with walk around decks and high bow rails which made working on the bow much safer.

[Bacchus]

I would be happy to recommend something like the De Groot 36 (in my Avatar)

 

Big petrol engines are a nightmare on boats IMHO, especially inland boats - the one thing petrol engines hate, is damp; the one thing you can guarantee on a river boat, is damp

 

Dutch steel cruiser. Has a lovely presence for slow speed manoeuvring, wide side decks for locking etc., cuts the water very cleanly, has good accommodation, is tough, easy to handle with single engine and a thruster, and is very happy in tidal waters or at sea.

 

Sports cruisers like the one above are completely wrong on the inland waterways for all the above reasons, and generally won't go in a straight line at river speeds.

Edited July 2, 2021 by Bacchus

[Tony Brooks]

3 minutes ago, Bacchus said:

I would be happy to recommend something like the De Groot 36 (in my Avatar)

 

Big petrol engines are a nightmare on boats IMHO, especially inland boats - the one thing petrol engines hate, is damp; the one thing you can guarantee on a river boat, is damp

 

Dutch steel cruiser. Has a lovely presence for slow speed manoeuvring, wide side decks for locking etc., cuts the water very cleanly, has good accommodation, is tough, easy to handle with single engine and a thruster, and is very happy in tidal waters or at sea.

 

Sports cruisers like the one above are completely wrong on the inland waterways for all the above reasons, and generally won't go in a straight line at river speeds.

 

Agree about the Dutch steel boats but I suspect they may be too expensive for the OP.

[Naughty Cal]

1 minute ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Agree about the Dutch steel boats but I suspect they may be too expensive for the OP.

You can find some older ones that are cheaper.

[Bacchus]

4 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Agree about the Dutch steel boats but I suspect they may be too expensive for the OP.

 

2 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

You can find some older ones that are cheaper.

 

 

The fancy Linssens and Stevens can be expensive, but there are plenty of good boats available in the 30-something grand range. Prices are a bit high at the moment, as mentioned above, but it seems to be the "flashier" boats (and, in particular, canal boats) which are selling hard and fast. "Good old solid" boats are sitting on the pontoon for longer

 

 

[Tony Brooks]

6 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

You can find some older ones that are cheaper.

 

If so, I would be very wary hull wise, they are pretty thin from new.

[Naughty Cal]

3 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

If so, I would be very wary hull wise, they are pretty thin from new.

Some friends of ours have a 90's Pedro. It was 3mm steel from new. It was surveyed a couple of years ago and was still 3mm with no hull problems at all.

 

They are well build solid boats.

5 minutes ago, Bacchus said:

 

 

 

The fancy Linssens and Stevens can be expensive, but there are plenty of good boats available in the 30-something grand range. Prices are a bit high at the moment, as mentioned above, but it seems to be the "flashier" boats (and, in particular, canal boats) which are selling hard and fast. "Good old solid" boats are sitting on the pontoon for longer

 

 

A lot of our boaty friends now have dutch steel cruisers from a variety of makers. They have Pedro, Linssen, Stevens and Gruno.

 

All very different layouts but all very good boats.

[Naughty Cal]

Sold now but an example of a Pedro that would have been in budget.

 

https://www.newark-marina.co.uk/used-boats/pedro-33/

[Momac]

11 minutes ago, Bacchus said:

Sports cruisers like the one above are completely wrong on the inland waterways for all the above reasons, and generally won't go in a straight line at river speeds.

There are loads of sports cruisers / planing hulled boats  around here  - Newark/Lincoln area .

I agree a planing hulled boat  can wander at slow speed on the river   - especially single engined and much  less so with twins  , but the skill to correct it is acquired such that it is  hardly noticeable.

 

At sea a fast boat makes some journeys much easier in calm conditions.

A displacement hulled  boat at sea can  be very inefficient on fuel . 5 knots at sea feels like almost going backwards .

 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

If, by 'going to sea' you mean offshore, then I'd always recommend twin engines.

 

You can just run with one engine (if needed) on rivers, steering can be a bit awkward, but normally you can maintain 4-6mph on both engines.

 

Fuel costs may cause you concern when compared to a NB on the canal, on my boat - which is a displacement hull - my engines use ~5 litres (each) per hour at 6-7mph.

When we had the Fairline which is a planing hull (similar to the Sealines etc discussed above) we were using something like 100 litres per hour at 23-25mph.

For example - going the 60 miles from Holyhead to Dun-Loghaire we used 300 litres of fuel (but it was fun)

 

If you are looking at a displacement hull then you will need to have proper, thorough, understanding of tides and tidal streams as you are more limited. A 5 knot tide running in the opposite direction to where you want to go, or is running at 90 degrees to your direction of travel,  when your max speed is 6 knots means you have very little control of direction.

 

We went from Hull to Wells next Sea, it took us 13 hours and we used ~130 litres of fuel. After we arrived anothe boat from Hull joined us on the pontoon, he had done the same journey but it had taken him just over 3 hours, the difference being he had used almost 400 litres (£400) of fuel.

If you are "time rich" then does it matter how long it takes ?

 

If you are serious about going to sea, as opposed to just having a sea-capable boat on the rivers, I'd recommend that you do (as a minimum) the RYA Day Skipper qualification, and your VHF test.

Edited July 2, 2021 by Alan de Enfield

[Naughty Cal]

We never found the cost of fuel to be a problem with the Sealine S23. It was a very minor cost in the scheme of things. Moorings and maintenance were far higher expenditure.

 

We used to average about 7.5mpg on the rivers and 4mpg on the plane at sea although that did vary depending on sea conditions and how fast we could cruise.

 

Burton Waters, Lincoln to Wells next the Sea was a round trip of 180 miles with a mixture of river cruising and coastal and we would generally use 150 litres to complete that trip.

[Bacchus]

48 minutes ago, MartynG said:

 the skill to correct it is acquired such that it is  hardly noticeable.

True, but you can't nip below for your phone or even take a cheeky peek over the stern to check that everything looks as expected without stopping steadying the boat. I had a Princess 25 - lovely little boat actually, but required constant correction - the Fjord and the De Groot have much better straight line stability. The OP says "predominantly river cruising"; ALL boats are a compromise of sorts, but sports cruisers are simply not designed for that type of use. I see a lot of them on the Thames, cutting up the river horribly at slow speeds and bitching around in locks with great big handfuls of bow-thruster, and crew on the slopy bow in imminent danger of a bath even though it's not that time of year (c:

 

If the OP does go down the sports cruiser route, one of those kind of rudder things that bolts on to the outdrive (can't remember what they're called) makes a big difference to directional stability

[Naughty Cal]

22 minutes ago, Bacchus said:

True, but you can't nip below for your phone or even take a cheeky peek over the stern to check that everything looks as expected without stopping steadying the boat. I had a Princess 25 - lovely little boat actually, but required constant correction - the Fjord and the De Groot have much better straight line stability. The OP says "predominantly river cruising"; ALL boats are a compromise of sorts, but sports cruisers are simply not designed for that type of use. I see a lot of them on the Thames, cutting up the river horribly at slow speeds and bitching around in locks with great big handfuls of bow-thruster, and crew on the slopy bow in imminent danger of a bath even though it's not that time of year (c:

 

If the OP does go down the sports cruiser route, one of those kind of rudder things that bolts on to the outdrive (can't remember what they're called) makes a big difference to directional stability

Pretty sure they don't make one that fits to the VP or Mercruiser drives which is what the OP will end up with if he goes down the sports cruiser route.

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, Naughty Cal said:

.......... VP or Mercruiser drives which is what the OP will end up with if he goes down the sports cruiser route.

 

 

Or, get one 'on shafts'

 

 

The other thing to consider is that most Sports Cruisers use Turbo engines - more to go wrong and very expensive when it does.

[Naughty Cal]

6 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

Or, get one 'on shafts'

 

 

The other thing to consider is that most Sports Cruisers use Turbo engines - more to go wrong and very expensive when it does.

Not that many "modern" sports cruisers on shafts.

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

Not that many "modern" sports cruisers on shafts.

 

He's not going to find many modern sports cruisers for under £30k

 

Found a 1986 Sealine Statesman at £31k with twin Fords on BMW Drives

 

Sealine 305 Statesman, 1986 GBP 31,500 | United Kingdom | Motor boat for sale (scanboat.com)

Edited July 2, 2021 by Alan de Enfield

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

He's not going to find many modern sports cruisers for under £30k

 

Found a 1986 Sealine Statesman at £31k with twin Fords on BMW Drives

 

Sealine 305 Statesman, 1986 GBP 31,500 | United Kingdom | Motor boat for sale (scanboat.com)

 

Cough...........(2nd Post in thread) ?