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Hello. I'm in the process of buying a 57' trad through a reputable marina in Cheshire. I had my survey done this week and am waiting to get the report within the next week or so. I called by at the end to meet the surveyor and get a run down of the main issues, so I already know that the hull will need shot blasting back to the steel to get rid of corrosion that's taken hold under the blacking paint shoddily applied in the past. The marina are quoting £3,173.76 to shot blast and repaint with a 2-pack epoxy. This seems excessive. They break it down as: £1,767 shot blasting (£31/ft) £1,406.76 painting (£24.68/ft) Do people think this is a fair price? I'd really appreciate it if anyone has experience of these sorts of costings. I've already lost a fair amount of faith in the marina after my experience of arranging a survey. They offered to arrange a full survey for me at £856.60, but I chose to arrange something myself. It turns out I commissioned the same surveyor they were going to use, but the survey cost me £595. So they were going to add £261.60 on top, which is a 44% mark up! So I'm wondering if they're applying the same mark up to the shot blast and repaint. This would make the original prices something like: £1,227.37 shot blasting £977.15 painting £2204.52 (total) Does that seem more like what people would expect? Many thanks.

Hi All, If you use 2-pack epoxy primer (post sandbalsting), do you have to put 2-pack epoxy over the top of this when you come to re-do the hull? (I know the lifetime is meant to be alot longer therefore the need to re-do should be less). And, am I right in thinking you have to put 2-pack expoxy onto bare steel, therefore to re-do the hull you would need to sandblast again and re-apply? thanks!

I can't find any record of my having posted these notes on using Jotamastic 2-part epoxy blacking on my boat and they might be useful to some so here they are: Jotamastic 87 Method & Notes 01. None of the following is guaranteed. Check everything with the official documentation. This information is provided in good faith and is as accurate as I can make it. It is my notes to myself, which might be of interest to others doing this for the first time. 02. I obtained the paint, Jotamastic 87 (J87) from SML Paints & Coatings - fast delivery, excellent telephone service, fairly good website - strongly recommended. Tel 01258 862132 W: www.smlpaintsandcoatings.co.uk Materials needed (per 4.6L paint where applicable) 01. Hard hat, Eye mask, Fumes mask - this paint is evil stuff and is particularly harmful to eyes. 02. 100 rubber gloves nitrile from SML - very good 03. Pot opener from SML - very good! 04. Pot A & Pot B Jotamastic 87(standard grade). SML provide both automatically. 05. Tissues 06. Waste sack 07. Knife to open pot A plastic bag 08. Stirrers - 1 big & 6 small (available from SML but I used bits of dowelling) 09. Scales from SML (very good) - mixing is done by weight 10. Mixing pots from SML - 1L x 6 11. Writing pad & 2 pencils- for doing the 11% calculation 12. Hammer 13. Brushes - 3” - x 6 - use-once-and-throw-away brushes from Toolstation at 63p each 14. Clock - or any other easy to see timepiece Method Used 01. Remove pot A from plastic bag & save the bag for later storage. 02. Open lid with opener - easy 03. Stir pot A - takes about 15 mins, do about twice a day (stirring small pot B not attempted). This is crucial as the contents separate markedly. 04. Do not use tare (including mixpot weight in zero) as the scales reset themselves after 120 secs and you could get results that lose the weight of the pot. 05. Switch scales on & wait for zero with nothing on it 06. Weigh empty mixpot usually 94g 07. Remove mixpot from scales 08. Pour A into mixpot until about 2/3 full max or less as required 09. Switch scales on & wait for zero with nothing on it 10. Weigh mixpot 11. Write down mixpot weight - this is the TOTAL POT WEIGHT 12. Remove mixpot from scales 13. Replace lid on pot A - protect hammer with tissue and wipe pot A clean as best possible 14. Deduct mixpot weight to obtain paint A weight 15. Calculate 11% of paint A weight 16. ADD the 11% of paint A weight to the TOTAL POT WEIGHT to give the FINAL POT WEIGHT 17. Open pot B 18. Switch scales on & wait for zero with nothing on it 19. Put the mixpot on scales 20. Pour pot B into the mixpot slowly as the adding amount is small until the FINAL POT WEIGHT is shown on the scales. 21. Steady is best as it is hard to get small globules out. It is possible to get it exact, it is not too difficult. 22. Put pot B down on 2 layers of tissue as B is sticky & messy and much harder to manipulate without mess than A. 23. Remove mixpot from scales 24. Note the time - your pot live time starts now. 25. Replace the lid on pot B 26. Wipe pot B roughly as it is not possible to get it fully clean. Don’t get tissue stuck in it. Don’t hit the lid too hard, the tin crushes. 27. Use a small stirrer to mix the contents of the mixpot for at least 5 mins 28. Leave until about 10 (about 5 more) mins from the noted mix time for the mixture to acquire its working consistency. Before this it may be too thin and hard to apply at the correct thickness. This 10 mins is known as the “induction time”. 29. Use a 3” brush to apply the paint to the surface. 30. Start low down and work up to avoid getting it on your head. 31. Brush both up & down & right & left as it visibly improves the thoroughness of the application. 32. You have an absolute maximum of 2 hours (and sometimes less) to apply the paint before it goes off from the start-of-mixing time. 33. It gets markedly thicker after about 1 hour and then is slower to apply. 34. Hot weather seems to make it go off slightly faster. 35. It is touch dry in about 7 hours. 36. It is overcoatable in about 10 hours minimum. It can be overcoated later for some time, but (I think, I have not checked) it is best done within 48 hours. (if you leave it too long you may have to sand it again, I don't know as I didn't take any holidays.) 37. It is fully cured and ready for service after 7days. General notes 01. The paint can be applied over very light or flash rust without detriment. 02. The paint can be applied to damp surfaces. See the technical documentation for references to what they mean by damp. They distinguish between moist, damp, and wet surfaces. 03. You need to buy the Standard Jotamastic 87 paint for use in ambient temperatures above 10degrees C and the Winter grade for temperatures below this. NOTE The above instructions refer to the standard grade, setting & mixing times for the Winter grade are different! 04. I derived the figure of 11% by weight of pot B to pot A from the sample weight charts supplied with the paint and also available on the website. Check this yourself!! Note that no instructions of any sort are on the paint cans themselves. 05. I used 1L mixpots about 2/3 full and I was able to apply it in about 45 to 75 mins depending on the awkwardness of the surface. This gives about 6 mixes per 4.5L pot A tin. Other people may be faster than me. 06. It is said that it is possible to mix the whole of pot B into the whole of pot B (there is room in the pot A tin) and apply the lot in the 2 hours. I suspect this needs a team of people applying it. 07. One 4.5 L tin of Jotamastic 87 is just about enough to provide 1 coat on my 60ft narrowboat (excluding baseplate & uxter plate). I used three tins to provide 3 coats. 08. Other Jotamastic variants exist, as primers, with aluminium, and as top coats etc, but I stuck with plain 87 for all three coats as it claims it can do this. 09. A CWDF member suggested getting different colours to make it easier to see when putting subsequent layers on. I did not do this and it was at times very hard to distinguish so that may be the best thing to do. 10. I used a new brush for each mix, using cheap use-once-and-throw-away brushes from Toolstation at 63p each. These did shed the occasional hair as you would expect but I ignored these as there is little time for such finesse. 11. I did this blacking over an unknown previous two-pack blacking, applied by my boat-builder 5 years ago. This blacking was still good over much over the boat but peeled off easily in some small areas particularly near the anodes leaving perfect metal visible. 12. The edges of the good blacking were sanded down but not brilliantly and when painted with J87, the edges in some cases curled up which is not good. There is a limit to what I can do so I mostly broke these off and applied more paint. 13. Most of the surface preparation was done with a Ryobi Orbital Sander using 120grit discs. I think 80 would have been better but I did not have any available. Rusty bits were attacked with a 4.5” angle grinder using a bevel wire brush. This got rid of loose rust but did not get into pits very well. I did not use it more extensively as the vibration of the grinder (a brand new Erbauer) was more than my hands can cope with for very long. I believe the Jotamastic instructions warn against wire brushing producing a too highly polished surface that reduces adhesion but I have not checked this. 14. Initial cleaning was done with a jet wash by a third party. 15. All the retained blacking was sanded. The dust was taken off one part with a vacuum cleaner with brush, another by washing, and the rest by brushing with a dry sponge. The dry sponge appeared to do the best job and the wet wash the worst. None of them were impressive. 16. Of the corrosion found, 90% was caused by damage to the paint surface. The principle causes seem to be rubbing against tyres used as mooring fenders, and hitting stuff, particularly a stop gate on the BCN (Thame Valley?) that was half open and not seen. 17. I don’t know how much damage was caused by moving through ice as I avoid doing it. I do not know if any was due to passing traffic through ice as I moor online with either side facing the traffic. The damage was markedly more on one side of the bow than the other.

Possibly a daft question but realised I must be getting old, as for the life of me I can't remember how I did this in the past! When sealing marine ply edges, with Epoxy do you use the resin direct or do you still need to mix with a hardner, OR, have times progress and is there now an epoxy type clear paint you can brush on direct from the tin? Marine ply is for outdoor use (Not for boat!). Any getting old and forgetful jokes fully accepted. Many thanks in advance.

hello, i am selling a boat and the survey is back and the buyers are saying that it will need to be sand/ grit blasted and epoxy painted as she is pitted and more than expected for a boat of 2.5 years old. What causes pitting? What is the best option to remedy it, ensure the boat doesn't deteriorate rapidly? And is epoxy the same thing as 2pack? It has just recently been cleaned, scraped and blacked with 2 coats of bitumen. she's a 45 ft widebeam. Can you tell me also i) a rough cost for sand/ grit blasting? ii) a rough cost for epoxy 2 pack? i am trying to get a sense of what work is needed and what I can allow for when we re-negotiate the price. Thank you!

End of this month I'm going to DIY paint my hull; I decided to go for epoxy. I've found already some valuable info here and elsewhere (I know I have to strip off the blacking to bare metal). As I've a few (related) questions, I've organised it a bit, so you can refer to the numbering if you want!: 1. So, first of all, I was wondering what is known about the quality (&price) between different types and brands of epoxy. Some brands I found so far are Sigmacover 300, Jotamastic 87, Hempadur (45143/45141), Interzone 954. (Are there any other important ones to take into account?) 2. I'm further curious if anyone has advice about these particular treatments I found in the forum: a) coal tar epoxies ("for off shore splashzone use") b) epoxy over zinga (http://www.zinga-uk.com) c) vinyl blacking (Leighs Resistex M535) 3. I also have a few other related questions: a) Are all epoxy-paints self-priming? b) How many coats should (better) be applied? There seems to be consensus on 4..? c) What about the base plate, I suppose it should be simply included in the job, right? It seems some people don't... d) What's the best way to deal with rust? Scaling down to bare steel and painting over, or applying rust converter fist? e) Are metal putties advised or to be avoided? Thanks! ~ K

hi all and thanks already for the wealth of knowledge that I've taken away fro this forum. Ive just got my bill of sale on my 40ft narrow boat and am going through the list of things the survey brought up. Currently she is epoxy coated and surveyor stated could do with being redone soon, not urgent. my question is this, ive had variying quotes for work to be done From £1000 TO £2.5K for 2pk epoxy to be done. does epoxy need to be blasted back to be recoated? some of the quotes say that winter no good to do as temperature means wont go off, is it worth waiting till spring/summer? ive been told about COFLEX as an alternative, its comparable on price so what is the difference, pros cons? basically have epoxy and want to know if I would be shooting myself by using something else, epoxy seems to be highly thought off? any tips advice opinions welcome, Duncan

Having now had a chance to look closer at the oak fins/keels, it is clear that in the past the gaps have been filled with something, which looked like some type of flexible filler (sikaflex etc.). Some of it is in good order but some has perished, I have been removing it. Pics below. Generally it looks like the wood is close where bolted but have gained spaces elsewhere. Current thinking is to epoxy rather than filler. Seems a few types though. Seen Watertite which looks like it might be easier to apply. Then West system, which has a hardener. All opinions welcomed