aracer

I know this has mostly already been done, but I used to be paid to do radio stuff and have worked on professional committees involving OFCOM amongst others, so a bit more clarification: On the contrary, most of the radio world still refers to it as VHF - most of the radio world being uses other than broadcast, which is the only use case where the term "FM" is inaccurately used to refer to a frequency band. In the case of broadcast, VHF transmissions are the only ones in this country using FM and in that case it does provide a distinction in terms of the quality of the broadcast compared to AM transmissions which is I presume why they use that term. In the more general radio world frequency band is normally used to distinguish different applications - personally I did a lot of work in the HF band (used predominantly by amateur radio hams and military) but also on bands all the way from ELF to EHF.

It would be a tricky one and open to abuse given the relatively high internal resistance of alkaline cells and hence the wide variation in real capacity when used in typical modern high power devices. TBH the capacity figures quoted for NiMH cells are sometimes a bit of a fairy tale. I'm not at all surprised at that result for the Aldi batteries - ISTR many years ago when I was more interested in the capacity of Alkaline cells (before I moved to LiIon for most of my stuff) that Boots own brand cells were the highest capacity in a test, beating the most expensive Duracells. Though pretty much all alkaline cells nowadays are reasonable quality and there's no reason to pay more for "branded" cells - based on the test results for the Poundland alkaline cells the chances are they're just as good as the Aldi ones and at 17p each probably better VFM. Though back to the original point of this thread, for the vast majority of applications, something like https://www.vapextech.co.uk/4-x-aa-2500mah-low-self-discharge-rechargeable-batteries/ will work out better value - in most cases you'll get more capacity from them than any alkaline on the first use and then they can be reused.

Hmm - given their business model, I suspect if they were making more money on the better cells they wouldn't sell the "cheaper" ones. I'm not sure there is any suggestion that the cost to poundland is linear on power, but the cost of selling a pack is much the same whatever it contains and given a large number of other larger and heavier items for sale at the same price it seems unlikely the shipping cost is a significant part of the cost. It's just an reasonably educated guess, but I'd expect the zinc chloride cells to cost far less than half what the alkaline ones do at the point of packaging, hence Poundland will be making more profit on them. To some extent though it's not even about the profit they make on a pack - following a standard business practice of planned failure, the customers buying the "cheaper" cells will be back to buy another pack sooner. That's the point to me it starts feeling a con. Other outlets don't sell zinc-chloride cells - you won't find them in Tesco (or Aldi or Asda)! I suspect you're missing the point of the comparison with mains electricity - he's comparing the cost of using NiMH cells instead (just to come back on topic!) You don't need to go beyond Poundland to find an alternative - they're mentioned in the article. I certainly wouldn't tend to use Tesco as a basis to find good value - nowadays I tend to buy my groceries at either of these: https://groceries.asda.com/product/aa-batteries/asda-long-life-super-alkaline-aa-batteries/910001481431 https://www.aldi.co.uk/aa-activ-energy-batteries-8-pack/p/083731202124800 (I suspect the Poundland Alkaline batteries are the best value at 17p a cell for what looks like reasonable capacity - it would be interesting to do a comparison test of all of those, but I'm not sufficiently interested to spend £5.99!)

Maybe you should ask nick, as he was the one suggesting there are devices like that around - though in my experience some kids toys seem to have that problem (I can't think of a specific example, it's a while since I've had something like that).

I'm on shoreline most of the time, but haven't used my 240V soldering iron since I moved aboard and have a 12V supply available to plug the otherwise identical 12V version into (nothing flash, but a reliable standard 25W Antex). When I need to use something which needs 240V and I'm away from the shoreline I turn the inverter on, but most of the time I don't need it (don't have a cordless drill or vacuum cleaner, but do have wired 240V ones and a 240V dremel - I actually have a 12V vacuum but it's tiny and would be a pain for cleaning the boat). I guess if I was using such things a lot I might get 12V versions, but then it's a bit of a strawman question, because I'm not sure anybody here is 12V only, simply that some of us choose to use predominantly 12V devices when away from shoreline. A lot of things are readily available in 12V versions, the ones I guess I wouldn't survive without are phone and laptop chargers and I have 12V versions of those so I don't need to turn the inverter on most of the time (so far I've only used it very rarely when out cruising). The point isn't that you have to run everything from 12V - we all have inverters - but to run the obvious easy things which get used the most that way. It all depends what choices you make - as you say we're all different - I decided against a 12V TV because to get the same spec as the 240V one I picked up on ebay would have cost a lot more money and I'm happy enough to read a book instead if bothered about power consumption. However when putting in new "infrastructure" (such as the RPi which provides a Wifi hub amongst other things to come back to the OP) I'll make it 12V powered if I can.

...meanwhile the alkaline cell spends very little time at 1.5V If it's expecting 1.5V it's not going to work terribly well with alkaline batteries - and I stand by my assertion that any device designed for use with AA cells is very poorly designed if it stops working when the cell voltage reaches 1.2V

Sure - I started off writing my post using the word "batteries", but got to the point where it was a clearly inaccurate expression and so corrected myself. I'm sure people on here can cope with me calling them cells. Hmm, I wrote: I think that fairly accurately describes that graph. Describing NiMH as having a nominal voltage of 1.2V and alkaline as having a nominal voltage of 1.5V paints an overly pessimistic and far less accurate picture to the layman, leading to the misunderstanding MoC had. As I pointed out, any device specifying alkaline only typically requires more than 1.2V, hence relying on the first part of the alkaline discharge curve and resulting in cells with lots of remaining energy being sent to landfill - yes there is a difference which can mean alkalines will work in situations where NiMH won't, but only in really badly designed kit.

They aren't. Which is what bugs me about comments like: Because the nominal voltage of NiMH batteries cells (and rechargeable cells in general) means something different to the nominal voltage of alkaline cells (and single use cells in general). For NiMH and other rechargeable cells the nominal voltage is the mid discharge voltage. For alkaline and other single use cells the nominal voltage is the voltage when unused. The typical voltage of a fully charged NiMH cell is actually 1.4V - in reality alkaline are often 1.6V when completely unused, but that very quickly drops to 1.5V - so not hugely different. The mid discharge voltage of both is about 1.2V, the fully discharged voltage of both is about 1.0V. Unfortunately that doesn't tell the whole story - the discharge curve is somewhat different for the different chemistries, the most obvious difference being that for NiMH the main part of the discharge curve is very flat with a sudden drop off at the end, which can result in running out of power with little warning. As for devices which specify only alkaline cells - in general they are poorly designed even when used with alkaline cells, as they will stop working when there is still a lot of energy left in the alkaline cells. Generally such a specification is a sign of cheap voltage regulation circuitry - somewhat surprising in an expensive bit of kit! Finally, whilst most NiMH cells probably are still the type with fairly high self discharge, I think some people here are a bit behind the times - low self discharge NiMH cells are readily available nowadays for a similar price. Typically low self discharge cells have a slightly lower nominal capacity, but still as much as a NiMH cell from a few years ago. Personally I own a mix of both types, with the LSD cells being used in low power consumption devices where I expect them to last months - alkaline still seem poor value in any application where you expect to have to replace them at least twice, even if that is only once every year. I also feel the need to point out that self discharge certainly doesn't apply significantly to a lot of rechargeable cells in use in modern consumer devices - LiIon cells have very low self discharge rates.

2.1m wide. That can't be coincidental can it?

It's far more important, but that doesn't mean the limited resource of the waterways is the most appropriate way to provide that - it's an incredibly inefficient way to provide housing, it just happens that similar housing isn't sufficiently available elsewhere. Meanwhile the use of the waterways for leisure purposes is far more than just a hobby - ironically given the undoubted prevalence of mental health problems amongst those who prefer not to move, using them in the way "intended" is an excellent way of improving mental health and IMHO good mental health is just as important as people's need for shelter. I should point out that I'm a newbie to narrowboating and the principal reason I got a boat is that I needed somewhere to live, but that doesn't mean I have no interest in the waterways - for me there are huge additional benefits to living on a boat (from what I can work out I go out more often than anybody else moored around here).

Maybe - and that determines my maximum speed on canals, which is nowhere near 4mph, but on the Severn it would be easy to break the speed limit without producing a huge wash (depending on the boat - I break the speed limit all the time in a kayak*, but don't produce any significant wash - some big boats however are already producing lots of wash at those speeds, hence they're not necessarily nominal). * before anybody complains the speed limits only apply to powered boats

Interesting - so does the Severn have the highest speed limits (6mph upstream, 8mph downstream)?

Except GUI coders that is

To me a programmer is also a code producer (hence why I call myself an engineer ?) but then I've worked on teams developing software for multi million pound projects where you have a whole range of development roles.

Were where you?

I'm not sure if you both missed my reference to the iPlayer app up there? The latter is an interesting observation though - what I might have referred to as programming (I nearly called myself a programmer) seems to be called coding in schools nowadays - I probably use that term often enough myself. In the context of apps you'd probably call yourself an app developer and that usage has also slipped across, so if not calling myself an engineer I might describe myself as a developer.

How about the spelling? ??? (sorry, but posts discussing spelling and grammar are fair game IMHO whatever difficulties the poster might have ? )

Yeah, that's the only one I could see, and as I pointed out it's context rather than spelling - and certainly not one I'd ever personally pick on. Though it's interesting to note that the American spelling for both is "program" and that is also the original British spelling - like a lot of language it's something that's evolved over time. Being a software engineer and having a lot of interest in language (which might be a peculiar combination) it's an issue I'm interested in.

Other discussion of this comment seems to have ignored the fundamental inaccuracy. I'm fairly good at spelling and I've checked through what Athy quoted several times - the only "spelling" failure I could spot would more accurately be described as incorrect context. Though dmr could of course have simply meant he was listening to the radio using the iPlayer app ? Unless of course I'm missing something and Athy would like to point out the spelling mistakes?

Speak for yourself, as I've pointed out a few times I'm a pragmatist and there's a distinct difference, given that like many I have just as much dislike for some aspects of the EU as the Brexit ideologues, but I recognise the advantages of putting up with them. Many Brexiteers are fond of pointing out the negatives of being a member of the EU without actually comparing properly with the alternative.

??? - on the contrary it's pointless arguing with an ideologue - though it's quite amusing pointing out what they are and watching them try and deny it.

As I pointed out, we're pragmatists - explain to me which "more substantial matters" have a greater impact on people's quality of life? Though I note that there are plenty of disadvantages to leaving other than economics. From what I can see I'm doing just fine at unarmed combat - maybe you should try using your weapons to check definitions before posting them on here...

Thanks for the incorrect definition ???

ISTM that the big difference is that the outs (those on both sides of the political spectrum, hence Benn and Corbyn) are largely ideological, whilst the ins are largely pragmatic - recognising that where the decisions are made is far, far less important than the economic benefits of membership. I'm no fan of a lot of what goes on in the EU, but I recognise the advantages of being a member to the actual quality of life of people in the UK - those suggesting leaving is economically beneficial are delusional.

"I'm not a xenophobe, but..." ???