fitting out a 57ft narrowboat any suggestions

[Adam]

hi i am fitting out a 57ft sailaway have you got any suggestions about what to do and what not to do in terms of central heating inverters fridge or just anything

[John Orentas]

hi i am fitting out a 57ft sailaway have you got any suggestions about what to do and what not to do in terms of central heating inverters fridge or just anything

 

 

Hi Adam.

 

You should spend as much time as you can afford travelling around looking at boats and chatting to the owners, eventually you will begin to get a feel for what type of boat you want, the lifestyle you want to live, how you want the interior, what you can afford, how much of the work you can do yourself and a few hundred other things that you haven't even thought of yet, you might even decide you can't stand the sight of the things and you don't want one at all.

Edited March 11, 2007 by John Orentas

[Blue_skies]

I've been looking at sailaways over the past few weeks and I'm thinking of doing exactly the same. I'll be watching this thread with interest A friend who has a farm with plenty of land has said I could do the fit-out at his place. Giving it some serious thought now!

[PaulW]

I've been looking at sailaways over the past few weeks and I'm thinking of doing exactly the same. I'll be watching this thread with interest A friend who has a farm with plenty of land has said I could do the fit-out at his place. Giving it some serious thought now!

 

Best of luck with this project, we are currently building as a new commercial venture (yes a new builder!). John has given some sound advice about looking at what is around as you can learn alot from what other people have done, or not done. It's a great deal of work and I would suggest you research what you are able to do and what you would need to outsource. Also work out how much time you can spend on the project, the boat we are building at present (57ft) has taken approximately 15 man weeks to get from bare shell to fully lined (and sprayfoamed), part painted, heating in, and cables in. The bathroom is half in and the galley goes in this week. There's probably another 8 man weeks to completion.

 

In respect of sailaways again I would take a good look at what's around. In essence you will get what you pay for.

 

Very best of luck

 

Paul

[carlt]

the boat we are building at present (57ft) has taken approximately 15 man weeks to get from bare shell to fully lined (and sprayfoamed), part painted, heating in, and cables in. The bathroom is half in and the galley goes in this week. There's probably another 8 man weeks to completion.

 

In essence you will get what you pay for.

 

Very best of luck

 

Paul

23 man weeks from shell to delivery?

[John Orentas]

In terms of time-scale my two boats took about the same time, starting with a bare shell and making everything myself. Four years, working long days every weekend and a couple of hours working at home every night.

 

Think twice before you tackle the job, you need to be a bit of a weired person to see it through to completion, I suppose even more weired to do it twice, there is no way back, too much money to abandon it mid way through and part completed projects are worth about £200.

[carlt]

In terms of time-scale my two boats took about the same time, starting with a bare shell and making everything myself. Four years, working long days every weekend and a couple of hours working at home every night.

 

Think twice before you tackle the job, you need to be a bit of a weired person to see it through to completion, I suppose even more weired to do it twice, there is no way back, too much money to abandon it mid way through and part completed projects are worth about £200.

John

if you did work every weekend for four years, without including the long evenings (how many times did you intend doing a couple of hours, only to end up going home after 10 to a dessicated tea?) then that's nearly 60 man weeks (assuming an 8 hour day but, you acknowledge working long days). When we're doing a project for ourselves we always tend to underestimate the man hours taken, and I find it hard to believe a man with your obvious attention to detail would have skimped on any part of his task.

[NB Phoenix]

Sound advice from John Orentas. One the subject of time, my self build took just under two years but I was working shift work so had time during the week to work on the boat.

 

One point I would raise is where are you going to build?

 

My shell was fabricated near Peterborough and the builder had hard standings for self builds, but this would have meant a 60 mile round trip each time I wanted to work on the boat. So I bit the bullet and had it transported into the village where I live. At the cost of around £1200. A good friend lent me a bit of land behind his workshops which meant I could get the shell level so you can use things like sprit levels when building. I also had power, lighting, heating in winter and the area was secure. I saved far more than the transport costs in time and fuel it would have cost me going back and forth to Peterborough, and you feel more incline to go and do the smaller jobs if your shell is only five minutes down the road.

 

Good Luck

 

Regards

 

John

 

 

[John Orentas]

John

if you did work every weekend for four years, without including the long evenings (how many times did you intend doing a couple of hours, only to end up going home after 10 to a dessicated tea?) then that's nearly 60 man weeks (assuming an 8 hour day but, you acknowledge working long days). When we're doing a project for ourselves we always tend to underestimate the man hours taken, and I find it hard to believe a man with your obvious attention to detail would have skimped on any part of his task.

 

 

Hi Carl.

 

To the best of my recollection I very rarely missed an evening or a weekend, I do however have an unusual way of working in that most of the fittings and furnishings I made at home, I have a reasonable workshop /garage. I would spend the week at home working 2,3 or 4 hours then at weekend I would be working on the boat, fitting what I had built and doing other jobs.

 

One or two exceptions to the rules, although I rarely did so myself I always advise people that when they are totally fed-up and sick of the sight of the boat, take a couple of weeks off, the enthusiasm will return on it's own. Also KEEP TIDY do one thing at a time take all junk and off-cuts home and always tidy up before you go home. As luck would have it when fitting out a narrowboat the natural course of events works on your side, those horrible depressing jobs, Waxoyling the inside, battening the sides, humping paving flags around, fitting the polystyrene etc., they are all early in the project when you are still keen with enthusiasm at it's height. Later when you have been at it for a year or two and flagging a bit the nicer jobs come along with a sense of achievement and job satisfaction.

 

There are a number of natural points along the way that keep you going. Being able to walk around on a nice flat floor is one, if you are fitting the engine, being able to take a short cruise up the cut is another, an upholstered seat to relax on for five minutes (yes did all that too) then going out for a weekend and sleeping on a proper bed rather than an air-bed on the floor.

 

A few tips. Keep up with all those tedious little jobs which you could easily leave until later, bits of trim, tidying up pipes and wiring in the engine room, (I would recommend a traditional boat simply on the grounds that you are working indoors). When you make something at home, finish it at home including painting and decoration. Make templates of the inside of your boat profile, everything will then fit, spot on first time, paint everything before fitting it, and yes don't be afraid of using lots of colour, I cant stand all those bland 'woody' coloured boats.

 

That will do for now, can't remember the question.

Edited March 12, 2007 by John Orentas

[carlt]

The question was: Are you sure you only spent 23 man weeks from shell to finish?

[John Orentas]

The question was: Are you sure you only spent 23 man weeks from shell to finish?

 

 

23 weeks, you have hardly started, I would estimate 3 long days per week (30 hrs), 52 weeks per year, 4 years = 6240 hours or 624 days.

 

125 man weeks. Your deimal point is in the wrong place.

[carlt]

23 weeks, you have hardly started, I would estimate 3 long days per week (30 hrs), 52 weeks per year, 4 years = 6240 hours or 624 days.

 

125 man weeks. Your deimal point is in the wrong place.

That's what I would have thought. Your answer to paulw (when he was saying his was going to be 23 weeks) was that yours took about the same and I couldn't believe a boat can be fitted out in that time, to any sort of standard. Give me a shell, a nailgun, and a big pile of components and I'll chuck you out a boat in 6 months which would be fit for a downmarket hire boat outfit. But it wouldn't be anywhere near the standards I (and I confidently suspect, you) would be happy with.

 

I can only assume paulw has got man hours mixed up with actual hours and it is more than one person taking 23 weeks.

[Gary Peacock]

I hate to say it but I would say about 33% of DIY builds fail mainly down to unrealistic time schedules or underestimating the skills involved to get a worthwhile result.

 

I have seen some very good DIY boats but have also seen some that in time and materials have cost fortunes that the owners would struggle to give away when they got fed up and said they were finished or deemed to be a part complete project.

 

I know one that went on for 8 years before been finished and a friend of mine as been "working on" while living on one for 15 years and it's never been on the water yet!

[Jon]

I'm going to move this to boat building & maintenance as you may get more replies.

 

Jon

[PaulW]

The question was: Are you sure you only spent 23 man weeks from shell to finish?

 

Just to clarify the position, the shell was delivered in mid october 2006 complete with windows, mushrooms and engine. Since that time the shell has been painted in 4 outercoats (2 under and 2 top) with another 2 coats to go, the interior has been sprayfoamed, lined out in oak faced ply, the bathroom has been constructed using stud partition construction, (not 18mm ply), the 12v and ac runs are in and the central heating is installed. This week the galley will be fitted followed by construction of the various items of fitted furniture. There was no work done during January as another job came up.

 

The essence of the project is good project control, i.e. the job is being planned so that all the items required are available. This means that when on-board the work actually progresses.

 

I wasn't advocating that 23 weeks should be the norm, just what I expected. I may be out by a few weeks. All I can say is that to date its taken 15 weeks for me working alone, and again to clarify its full time 6 days a week (probably 50 hrs per week).

 

good ere init!

[carlt]

Just to clarify the position, the shell was delivered in mid october 2006 complete with windows, mushrooms and engine. Since that time the shell has been painted in 4 outercoats (2 under and 2 top) with another 2 coats to go, the interior has been sprayfoamed, lined out in oak faced ply, the bathroom has been constructed using stud partition construction, (not 18mm ply), the 12v and ac runs are in and the central heating is installed. This week the galley will be fitted followed by construction of the various items of fitted furniture. There was no work done during January as another job came up.

 

The essence of the project is good project control, i.e. the job is being planned so that all the items required are available. This means that when on-board the work actually progresses.

 

I wasn't advocating that 23 weeks should be the norm, just what I expected. I may be out by a few weeks. All I can say is that to date its taken 15 weeks for me working alone, and again to clarify its full time 6 days a week (probably 50 hrs per week).

 

good ere init!

Sorry Paul It wasn't meant as a criticism of your work (yet ) but an observation that 23 man weeks is not long enough to fit out a boat to an acceptable standard.

Sure enough, on clarification, you're doing 6 day/50 hour weeks, which becomes over 31 man weeks, already 8 weeks over what you said (plus a month or so on top, in my experience).

[Blue_skies]

I bit the bullet and had it transported into the village where I live. At the cost of around £1200.

 

That's interesting. I'm looking into transport costs myself in case I do go ahead. I guess you spent £1200 for delivery to the land you used. Did it cost you this much for delivery to the water afterwards?

 

Cheers.

[NB Phoenix]

That's interesting. I'm looking into transport costs myself in case I do go ahead. I guess you spent £1200 for delivery to the land you used. Did it cost you this much for delivery to the water afterwards?

 

Cheers.

 

Hi

 

Second time was a bit less as we only used a crane at this end, Gayton Marina have their own crane so no cost to get it there. But I was going to get that cost anyway, either transport from the builder of the village. I would recommend trying to get it close to home though.

 

Thanks

 

John

[PaulW]

Sorry Paul It wasn't meant as a criticism of your work (yet ) but an observation that 23 man weeks is not long enough to fit out a boat to an acceptable standard.

Sure enough, on clarification, you're doing 6 day/50 hour weeks, which becomes over 31 man weeks, already 8 weeks over what you said (plus a month or so on top, in my experience).

 

No probs carlt, as always time flies by quicker than you think, and no doubt the 30 odd weeks will become extended.

[Blue_skies]

No probs carlt, as always time flies by quicker than you think, and no doubt the 30 odd weeks will become extended.

I'm interested in the discussion on man-weeks here and I'm looking for some advice. I don't want to do any engine stuff myself and to this end I think a sailaway (possibly a lined one) would be my best option. Any thoughts on man hours for fitting out a lined sailaway? I'm giving some thought to buying a sailaway from Liverpool boat company ltd. Their spec is... Hull with windows, doors, water (untreated) and fuel tanks, gas locker, deck fittings and ballast. Isuzu diesel engine and matched gearbox installed, to suit the size of your boat.

 

Cheers

[carlt]

I'm interested in the discussion on man-weeks here and I'm looking for some advice. I don't want to do any engine stuff myself and to this end I think a sailaway (possibly a lined one) would be my best option. Any thoughts on man hours for fitting out a lined sailaway? I'm giving some thought to buying a sailaway from Liverpool boat company ltd. Their spec is... Hull with windows, doors, water (untreated) and fuel tanks, gas locker, deck fittings and ballast. Isuzu diesel engine and matched gearbox installed, to suit the size of your boat.

 

Cheers

The problem is we don't know your level of skill, how fast you work, what standard of finish you want, whether you've any plumbing experience. If I was fitting out a boat to my tastes I'd put bulkheads up, plumb in and build kitchen & bathroom, build beds and go and find some nice loose furniture. Hey presto, habitable boat, couple of months (solid) work; put the kettle on.

Then again I'm a cabinet maker, who has worked for a boat builder fitting out boats, I've lost count of the number of boats I've owned and fitted/refitted and my needs aren't great.

[Ray]

We've been working on our boat since late October 2006. Usually doing no more than 7/8 hour days. One person with the ideas - most in his head or thought of as the problems arise; frequently someone providing the extra pair of hands. The main person (me) is the only one prepared to take the gamble and cut the wood, etc., the others help me carry it and hold it in place while I put the screws in!

 

I can usually manage 3-4 days a week at the boat but it is a 30+ minute drive each way from home, so time away from home is usually 8/9 hours.

 

I'm not skilled but I'm trying my hardest. I'm keeping a diary (blog) at www.729.me.uk/boat/home.html for those interested. We're still a long way away from finishing but I hope our first (short) leisure cruise, as opposed to the delivery journey, isn't too far off.

 

It's a lot of dosh, time and effort and you'll need understanding associates / partners.

 

Get as much advice as you can before you sign on the dotted line and kiss goodbye to virtually any spare time until the boat is done, unless you want it to drag out. Unless you're prepared to really rough it, any idea of much more than a night away from your moorings is going to be quite a way away, time wise.

 

Remember, if you keep it on the water while you're working you'll have licence and moorings to pay. That could be around £2.5k per year. Makes transport to a land based site for fitting out seem a good option if you can get it near to home.

[Blue_skies]

Remember, if you keep it on the water while you're working you'll have licence and moorings to pay. That could be around £2.5k per year. Makes transport to a land based site for fitting out seem a good option if you can get it near to home.

Good point. It may cost a fair amount to transport to and from a landsite but would probably save that money on liscence and mooring costs.