Help a Newbie!

[J.rad88]

I'm looking at buying a boat, the question is, what sort! I want a canal boat but I'm unsure of what length would be the best for me! I aim to be aboard 6 months of the year, winter/spring, however this could become a permanent fix! Im looking for a price on an decent enough size boat for 2 to live comfortably, plus the running costs not including mooring as I will be towpathing for the time on the water! Thank you in advance for any help/advice offered!!!

[sheriff]

I'm looking at buying a boat, the question is, what sort! I want a canal boat but I'm unsure of what length would be the best for me! I aim to be aboard 6 months of the year, winter/spring, however this could become a permanent fix! Im looking for a price on an decent enough size boat for 2 to live comfortably, plus the running costs not including mooring as I will be towpathing for the time on the water! Thank you in advance for any help/advice offered!!!

in the first instance I would decide if I want a cruiser stern/trad or semi trad.to do this I would go for a long walk down the towpath and you may get a couple of boaters to let you have a look...because you wish to spend some winters onboard,its a good time to start now to discover..the in and outs of winter cruiseing etc.

 

ask boaters lots of question...and they say 57 ft is a liveboard length for two..because you may decide to spend all year on boat...what part of london do you wish to cruise/live on

[Arthur Brown]

Once you have a boat on the water you will need 12 months mooring each year, select your non res moring carefully as there is more chance of an unattended boat falling foul of wind, weather, vandals etc than one with you on board.

[IainW]

we have been on a 57ft narrowboat for a few months and it is definitely long enough to live on for us. I would say 50ft+ would work for us. The only slightly annoying bit is there is nowhere to hang washing indoors. So that is where a few extra feet or an engine room would have been good i think.

 

when we first went to look at narrowboats they felt really cramped and we were convinced we would need a wide one. But after a short while of going on boats wide ones felt far too wide :-)

 

this is the boat we almost bought but the folk at the marina were far too condescending to deal with - Take Five. It would make a great liveaboard though!

 

best of luck with your adventure!

[bottle]

I'm looking at buying a boat, the question is, what sort! I want a canal boat but I'm unsure of what length would be the best for me!

 

Only you can make that decision really, some manage in a 45' others need a 70' but as said something in the region of 57' is the norm. Ours is 60'. Layout can have an effect on the perceived amount of room. A look around some brokerages, on line sites will start to give you an ides of what is available.

 

I aim to be aboard 6 months of the year, winter/spring, however this could become a permanent fix! Im looking for a price on an decent enough size boat for 2 to live comfortably,

 

That would depend on your budget and how much work you could do to bring one up to habitable condition anything between £20,000 and £100,000 should cover it.

 

plus the running costs not including mooring as I will be towpathing for the time on the water!

 

There is another thread about running costs a round figure of £6,000 is a good average. By 'towpathing' I expect you mean being a 'Continuous Cruiser' maybe a look at this (especially page 10) http://www.britishwaterways.co.uk/media/documents/General-Terms-and-Conditions-For-Boat-Licenses-E-and-W-2011.pdf

 

Where will you leave the boat in the summer autumn? You will need a mooring then unless of course you can comply with the above.

 

Good luck it is a long road.

[Guest]

Ours is 60ft which if we were live aboards would be more than adequate I would say - we probably could manage with 5ft less and lose the back cabin and still be comfortable.

 

Don't forget the length of your boat will often dictate your mooring costs so don't pay for more than you really need.

 

ed to add - ignore the last bit I see you don't intend to seek a mooring.

Edited January 23, 2012 by MJG

[skywatcher]

Welcome to the forum.

Everything to do with narrowboats seems to be charged by the foot, so the longer the boat the more the expense. Ours is 45ft which is cozy for the 2 of us, but can get a bit congested when we have friends on board.

[J.rad88]

Thank you for the help, I will be aboard all year!! CCing most if not all of the time? I have heard there is a difference between propulsion fuel and domestic fuel, what's the difference and does it affect cost??

[Rebotco]

Thank you for the help, I will be aboard all year!! CCing most if not all of the time? I have heard there is a difference between propulsion fuel and domestic fuel, what's the difference and does it affect cost??

 

There is no difference in the actual fuel itself.

 

There is a difference in the price you pay according to what proportion you are going to use for propulsion.

 

Each time you refuel you will have to sign a declaration as to that proportion.

 

A common proportion is 60%/40% and that is usually accepted without question by the tax authorities.

 

The point being that you pay no excise duty on the domestic (40%) but the full rate for the propulsion (60%).

 

If you are residential and do not cruise, your declaration could be 100% domestic.

 

Some marinas/fuel suppliers will automatically only charge at the 60/40 rate and refuse to sell at any other rate.

 

You will soon find out who does what!!

 

The declaration you make is self-certified and rarely checked. For average leisure boaters, I've never heard of anyone

 

being questioned by the Customs & Revenue, but there's bound to be someone on here who has!

 

I think the current freedom to self-declare won't last though. The Stasi in Brussels wants the UK to end this practice and

 

charge the full rate, whatever it is used for.

 

 

Brian

[Grace and Favour]

Thank you for the help, I will be aboard all year!! CCing most if not all of the time? I have heard there is a difference between propulsion fuel and domestic fuel, what's the difference and does it affect cost??

 

Propulsion fuel bears full excise duty and VAT Therefore £1.40 ish - just like road diesel

Domestic fuel Reduced Excise & VAT (Therefore £0.90 ish)

 

When you refuel at a Marina (or waterside station) you need to declare the % you use of each - and they may (note MAY) charge you acccordingly]

Some retailers will only sell on a 60/40 ratio (it would be advisable to determine this before you fill your tank(s)

[bottle]

Thank you for the help, I will be aboard all year!! CCing most if not all of the time? I have heard there is a difference between propulsion fuel and domestic fuel, what's the difference and does it affect cost??

 

 

The fuel question has been answered but just to clarify the bit in red.

 

You will be CCing all the year unless you have an official home mooring.

[trackman]

Just a view on boat type. as has already been said, you'll find cruiser, traditional and semi-trad sterns on offer when you look at boats. You'll have to choose one of these types.

 

As liveaboards we wouldn't contemplate a cruiser stern. It means a fair bit less cabin length (and space) for a given boat length, and it's b..... cold out on a cruiser stern when cruising on a bad day in winter. Our trad allows the steerer and one other person to stand inside the back doors while cruising, giving them some shelter and warmth. On a boat like ours, with a stove at the stern just by the step, we get a lot of warmth when the stove's lit - which it always is in cooler weather. On boats where the engine is just below the step, some engine heat comes up to warm the steerer in a similar way.

 

For boats used mostly in good weather and for parties of people, a cruiser stern is ideal because it allows people to gather on the stern deck and socialise, meaning that the steerer needn't be left alone at the back. That can be a problem with a trad stern when the weather's good enough for outside sociability, as parties of people will gather at the front where there's more room.

 

In my view semi-trads are little better than cruiser sterns for liveaboards. They give a lot more shelter from winds for those at the stern, and allow a fair number of people to gather there. However, they still cut down the cabin length like cruisers do, and they won't usually allow the steerer to benefit from stove or engine heat in cold conditions.

 

trackman

 

 

[OldGoat]

Just a view on boat type. as has already been said, you'll find cruiser, traditional and semi-trad sterns on offer when you look at boats. You'll have to choose one of these types.

 

As liveaboards we wouldn't contemplate a cruiser stern. It means a fair bit less cabin length (and space) for a given boat length, and it's b..... cold out on a cruiser stern when cruising on a bad day in winter. Our trad allows the steerer and one other person to stand inside the back doors while cruising, giving them some shelter and warmth. On a boat like ours, with a stove at the stern just by the step, we get a lot of warmth when the stove's lit - which it always is in cooler weather. On boats where the engine is just below the step, some engine heat comes up to warm the steerer in a similar way.

 

For boats used mostly in good weather and for parties of people, a cruiser stern is ideal because it allows people to gather on the stern deck and socialise, meaning that the steerer needn't be left alone at the back. That can be a problem with a trad stern when the weather's good enough for outside sociability, as parties of people will gather at the front where there's more room.

 

In my view semi-trads are little better than cruiser sterns for liveaboards. They give a lot more shelter from winds for those at the stern, and allow a fair number of people to gather there. However, they still cut down the cabin length like cruisers do, and they won't usually allow the steerer to benefit from stove or engine heat in cold conditions.

 

trackman

 

Nicely put; having hired semi-trads in the distant past they are (IMHO) the worst of both worlds; no clear space that the cruiser has and jolly uncomfortable seating for a group.

 

A point that makes more sense about a trad is that the space in the engine room is excellent for drying clothes (of course you must ensure that it doesn't smell of diesel), quite apart from the comfort for the steerer in wet or cold conditions. The 6 or 8ft. space is also good for storing tools.