Will not start

[tonymac]

Thornycraft engine, will not start, but i am getting a funny clicking noise which seems to be coming from the fuel filter or there abouts when i turn the ignition on. the engine turns over normally (untill the battery goes flat). Any ideas?????

[stuart]

  Thornycraft engine, will not start, but i am getting a funny clicking noise which seems to be coming from the fuel filter or there abouts when i turn the ignition on. the engine turns over normally (untill the battery goes flat). Any ideas?????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Could this be a clicking from a relay to glow plugs on the engine?

[tonymac]

The clicking is fast and continuose, and can be felt on the fuel filter, don't know where the relays are but will have a look.

[tobytimothy]

Just a thought..... I once had exactly the same problem occur on my diesel car. Eventually I solved it by rocking the car while it was in gear. I presumed that the starter motor had got stuck and by rocking the car had released it. So perhaps yours is a similar problem. Thats of course assuming I diagnosed correctly. Perhaps if not some of the more technically minded members can come up with a better solution.

 

Best of luck anyway

[Big COL]

Tonymac

 

Some Thornycroft engies are fitted with an electric diesel pump, this is what I suspect is what you can hear clicking. You don't say what model engine it is. On my last boat, which had a Thornycroft 80D engine, the pump looked like a round cylinder about 1.5'' Dia and about 7''long. in the top of the pump there is a washable filter which is possibly clogged and therefore not supplying diesel to the injector pump. To check this unscrew the pipe that goes from the pump to the injectors at the pump end and switch on the ignition to start the pump and see if it's delivering diesel. If not the problem is in the pump, ie the filter is clogged, or the problem is prior to the pump,check for any loose conections on the fuel line back from the pump to the tank. If there are any loose conections then the pump will suck in air through these and will not pump any diesel. If on the other hand there is diesel at the pump then reconnect the pump and bleed the system at the injector pump. To do this open the bleed screw on the injector pump and turn on the ignition until diesel appears through the bleed screw, when it does turn off the ignition, retighten the bleed screw, the engine should then start, hope this helps.

 

Colin

Edited November 1, 2004 by Big COL

[stuart]

You have got fuel haven't you!?!

[tonymac]

Fuel is full and i have bled the system as Colin has sugested. Does this mean the filter is ok as fuel is coming from the bleed screw? I don't remember the clicking being there before, certanly not as loud.

[Big COL]

Tonymac

 

If you have diesel at the injector pump, and the engine still will not start, slacken off the connections at two of the injectors on the engine, and turn the engine over with the starter untill diesel appears, retighten conections and the engine should run.

 

Colin

[John Orentas]

Tonymac

 

Not much information to go on, but.

 

The 'Engine Stop Solenoid' is likely to be in the vicinity you refer to, if the stop switch is faulty and permanently closed, or the two wires conected elsewhere the solenoid will energise as soon as you switch on the ignition. This will give the symptoms you describe.

 

Locate the solenoid and feel if it is clicking in as you switch on, isolate it electrically if you can and try again.

 

Some, but very few industrial origin engines are fitted with 'Energise to run solenoids' so they fail safe.

 

Next step.

Check for fuel at the injectors as described on other replies.

Are the heater plugs working if fitted, check with Avo meter.

Does any kind of smoke come out of exhaust ? What colour ?

 

John Squeers

Edited November 2, 2004 by John Orentas

[Martin]

Sounds similar to a friend's Kubota which failed to start.

This had a small inline fuel pump which clicked too.

The Kubota had a solenoid operated fuel cut-off, operated by the ignition switch.

It gave quite a clunk when the power was switched on.

 

I would suggest following the suggestions already given, but also to trace the wiring through to determine exactly what should be doing what.

Is the solenoid getting power? Is it operating?

Is the pump getting power?

Is there diesel after the pump?

If yes, check at the injectors and check the heater plug (glow plug) wiring.

If no, check for anything further up the line like a manual shutoff tap that you didn't know about! (I have one of those!)

 

Finally, can you remember how the engine stopped last time?

Did you switch it off or did it die?

[Big COL]

Tonymac

 

The stop, on many Thornycroft engines especially the early ones, is by a pull to stop cable. As you don't say which type of stop the engine is fitted with, if it is a cable type check that the arm on the injector pump is fully returning to the start position when the cable has been pushed back after stopping. If it's an electrical stop then follow the checks that John has suggested.

[Paul Evans]

And failing all that, call a diesel mechanic. This is the point at which you wish you had breakdown insurance because it's going to cost you money. I have insurance arranged through my brokers and it has brought great peace of mind. Over the last two years, I have had a gearbox that would not engage forward gear, a burst coolant pipe in the middle of nowhere and a lost propellor (don't ask!). The labour cost (and the coolant pipe) have all been covered by the insurance - just wish I could have found the prop!

Edited November 3, 2004 by Paul Evans

[Guest]

Could you tell us who your insurers are please-I wasn't aware schemes like that existed.

Regards

Stan H

[Alastair]

Not used them, but I've heard of 'Canal rescue'. I think there are links on the canal junction website

[stuart]

Not used them, but I've heard of 'Canal rescue'. I think there are links on the canal junction website

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Did you mean http://www.rivercanalrescue.co.uk/ ?

[Paul Evans]

I didn't include details because I've left the papers on the boat - better then leaving them at home - but I've found details on the web at:

 

http://www.collidgeandpartners.co.uk/Candp15.htm

 

The downside is that you must insure your boat through Collidge & Partners to be able to insure under this policy but it seems cheaper than the River Canal Rescue version. Against that, my policy does not offer "home start".

[John Orentas]

Why not use a little of the money we are prepared to spend on callout insurance on a Diesel Engine Maintenance Course. There are very few problems that cannot be located having learned about the basics of the engine.

 

Major breakdowns are very rare, especially with modern engines, the vast majority are very minor in nature.

 

Best of all you may find out how to prevent problems occuring in the first place.

 

John Squeers.

 

Tonymac, is your Thonycroft running yet. ?

[tonymac]

Thanks for every ones help, after checking everything and finding no faults it started??????? Maybe fixed it without realising.

Thanks again for all advice.

[John Orentas]

Tonymac.

 

You should still try to find what the problem was, though it is more difficult now. The problem could well re-occur at a less convienient time and place.

 

John Squeers

[brich]

Thanks for every ones help, after checking everything and finding no faults it started??????? Maybe fixed it without realising.

Thanks again for all advice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Might be worth while looking at your wiring. Many electricial faults are caused by poor joints between wire and connector or connector and device. Often the basic act of checking the wiring by flexing the cables makes a poor conductor - temporarily - into a good one.

 

Also you should check your starter battery - make sure that it is reaonably charged and the connections to the battery terminals are good.